New starter - Covid-19 impact on employment

[Fokx]

What I can't get my head around is if there is a backlog of applications and the recruitment people are working in difficult circumstances with increasing workloads why are new vacancies being advertised which will only add to the congestion in the system?

CJ

Because ultimately it’s about future-proofing vacancies and the train service provision.

Many of the trainees currently stuck in the system awaiting training, exams and passing out will be to fill existing vacancies that already exist, but if during this time extra staff retire, move TOC and change grade, you still need staff to fill these roles and by the time these newly advertised vacancies are viewed, candidates screened, selected, have their medicals and actually face final interviews and assessments, then serve their notice period if in a permanent role already, that congestion doesn’t exist anymore because ideally the entire process will take months and the existing candidates stuck in the system will be on their way to passing out or be live in the link (Covid/training situation depending).

 

[richfoz84]

I’ve had a call today to say the training for trainee driver is restarting and my start date is August 10th! At Manchester Piccadilly with Northern. So sounds like things are moving again!

 

[TeaTrain]

Nice one @richfoz84! I am hoping something will be made clear for TPE drivers now. Also at Man Pic.

 

[C J Snarzell]

It's certainly not a critcism of HR because these are difficult and quite unusual times we have been living in.

All the jobs I've applied for have gone 'stone cold' since I submitted the applications in March/April - no updates or paper sift rejections - absolutely nothing and it isn't just Northern either, many other organisations (not just in the rail industry) are in the same boat.

Like I said - this is totally understandable (Covid19 has impacted everywhere) and many workplaces will still not be running on full capacity for a while longer yet.

My query was just to try and understand why new jobs would go out in recent days/weeks & the 'stone cold' ones I referred to (from months ago) are still unresolved.

The question has been answered anyway so thanks for the replies.

CJ

 

[Lord Bottomley]

Ive never been involved in a recruitment process like the railways have. Its seems pretty unique. Lol.

 

[TeaTrain]

@Lord Bottomley That's because there isn't another process like it lol! It's pretty crazy and unique for sure.

 

[Trainrave]

I am aware that a number of people using this forum are either employed as a trainee driver, waiting at home to get back into classroom/cab training and there there also people awaiting a start date having passed their DMI/final stage.

Do people in this position feel as though they are ready and feel safe to resume training, or do people feel as though too many precautions are being taken?

 

[TeaTrain]

I don't think there is such a thing as 'too many precautions'.

Before I go to the classroom I want to know they have done all they can to protect me, my colleagues and everyone else. I have a son who is 4 months old. I want to be able to feel safe in my workplace as much as possible so will wait until they have figured it all out. If this takes time then so be it.

Just because I feel ready to start my training doesn't mean anything really. It's a patience game at the moment! 4 months and counting!

 

[Timpg]

I am aware that a number of people using this forum are either employed as a trainee driver, waiting at home to get back into classroom/cab training and there there also people awaiting a start date having passed their DMI/final stage.

Do people in this position feel as though they are ready and feel safe to resume training, or do people feel as though too many precautions are being taken?

I returned to work this week, to carry on with my driving hours. To be honest I think my employer has done everything they can sensibly do in order for me to continue safely with my instructor. We both get COVID tested every week, temperature taken before duty. Cabs are cleaned and masks/ sanitiser available. So I feel perfectly safe to continue.

 

[Stigy]

I am aware that a number of people using this forum are either employed as a trainee driver, waiting at home to get back into classroom/cab training and there there also people awaiting a start date having passed their DMI/final stage.

Do people in this position feel as though they are ready and feel safe to resume training, or do people feel as though too many precautions are being taken?

I’d have been happy to return a couple of months ago. I’d have been happy to continue throughout, but I appreciate why that wasn’t possible.

I think there’s being cautious, and there’s being over cautious. Especially when the country has all but ‘opened up’ again fully.

 

[Timpg]

I’d have been happy to return a couple of months ago. I’d have been happy to continue throughout, but I appreciate why that wasn’t possible.

I think there’s being cautious, and there’s being over cautious.

Although I totally respect and understand peoples individual circumstances. I’d agree with you and would have more than happy to continue throughout. I have my personal views over this whole virus situation, but I keep them to myself lol!!

 

[Trogladyte]

I am desperate to get back to training. Bored of being at home!

 

[Coach Carter]

I’m sure ready to go back to work. Had enough of sitting around now. The measures were needed but at some point it’s got to go back to normal, we can’t all sit at home forever. Things like car driving lessons are back up and running now.
So far I’ve been given a ‘you might’ be called back in by the end of September.
Not sure if that’s an across the board thing for our depots trainees or because I was still waiting for an instructor to come free before it all got shut down, so maybe not called back until someone from group ahead of me finishes and frees up an instructor.

 

[Jon1930]

Like you guys my trainee has had enough of being at home and wants to get back and get his hours in. Every other industry has resumed work, seems like the unions just like kicking off for the sake of it, what they dont know is their members want to get back to work.

 

[Stigy]

Like you guys my trainee has had enough of being at home and wants to get back and get his hours in. Every other industry has resumed work, seems like the unions just like kicking off for the sake of it, what they dont know is their members want to get back to work.

I agree that it seems like the union are kicking off for the sake of it, which does seem the norm these days. It does seem at times that we’re overlooked as trainees and they’re not taking our interests on board. We pay our subs too, so the unions should also take our interests in to account.

 

[StevieH]

I agree that it seems like the union are kicking off for the sake of it, which does seem the norm these days. It does seem at times that we’re overlooked as trainees and they’re not taking our interests on board. We pay our subs too, so the unions should also take our interests in to account.

What's the latest? They were negotiating the last 2 weeks I take it no progress yet?

 

[lammergeier]

I agree that it seems like the union are kicking off for the sake of it, which does seem the norm these days. It does seem at times that we’re overlooked as trainees and they’re not taking our interests on board. We pay our subs too, so the unions should also take our interests in to account.

If it's any consolation it's not just trainees in this position. Road learning and traction training has stopped at many (all?) TOCs and there are qualified drivers awaiting a ride out for various reasons (PQA, after fatality etc) who are stuck at home wanting to work but unable due to ride outs currently being binned.

It's a crap situation you find yourself in but you're not in it because you're a trainee per se.

 

[Stigy]

If it's any consolation it's not just trainees in this position. Road learning and traction training has stopped at many (all?) TOCs and there are qualified drivers awaiting a ride out for various reasons (PQA, after fatality etc) who are stuck at home wanting to work but unable due to ride outs currently being binned.

It's a crap situation you find yourself in but you're not in it because you're a trainee per se.

I know it’s not just trainees, must be a nightmare for those as you say, route learning etc too.

 

[Stigy]

What's the latest? They were negotiating the last 2 weeks I take it no progress yet?

The trial has been done and dusted and deemed a success, it’s not just up to specific TOCs/FOCs to get their staff back in. Most seem to have this underway, but we are having another trial of our own which should be concluded mid August.

 

[C J Snarzell]

I believe a few large organisations are in a somewhat stalemate situation with their respective Unions, not just the rail industry.

One of my friends works in a large distribution depot and his shop steward is causing World War 3 with management over the safe working conditions of staff.

CJ

 

[theironroad]

Like you guys my trainee has had enough of being at home and wants to get back and get his hours in. Every other industry has resumed work, seems like the unions just like kicking off for the sake of it, what they dont know is their members want to get back to work.

I agree that it seems like the union are kicking off for the sake of it, which does seem the norm these days. It does seem at times that we’re overlooked as trainees and they’re not taking our interests on board. We pay our subs too, so the unions should also take our interests in to account.

If it's any consolation it's not just trainees in this position. Road learning and traction training has stopped at many (all?) TOCs and there are qualified drivers awaiting a ride out for various reasons (PQA, after fatality etc) who are stuck at home wanting to work but unable due to ride outs currently being binned.

It's a crap situation you find yourself in but you're not in it because you're a trainee per se.

Just amazing!

I'm just watching the news and a scientist advising government says the best way of preventing the transmission of covid is when people stay apart, as new restrictions are put in place around the country and concerns for increasing covid cases.

Trade Unions which were established to defend working people against unscrupulous practice, which Includes the Heath and safety of their members, are accused on here of not acting in their members interests in wanting to ensure that two people working in a confined space are safe because they want a totally safe system of work to keep people safe.

Sure it's been a tough time for many, and some trainees so desperately wanting to be productive (aka getting qualified salary) should be grateful they've been fully employed on 100% pay siting at home while other members of front line staff, earning less than a trainee driver wage, have reported for duty and been exposed to the virus through this period.

Without trade Unions, there would be no health and safety at work rules, there would be no risk assessment done to see if your work place was safe.

Without trade Unions, the likelihood is that trainees and instructors would have been forced into he cab together with no protection from day 1 in March, crew messrooms would have zero measures in place to socially distance and for spare crews to report from home.

Keep bashing trade Unions if you want, but no one else is out there defending your workplace.

 

[the sniper]

Keep bashing trade Unions if you want, but no one else is out there defending your workplace.

Only on the railway, complaining about the union because they're having to stay away from work for months, while being paid...

Within a few months of passing out they'll be complaining they aren't spare enough!

 

[Coach Carter]

Just amazing!

I'm just watching the news and a scientist advising government says the best way of preventing the transmission of covid is when people stay apart, as new restrictions are put in place around the country and concerns for increasing covid cases.

Trade Unions which were established to defend working people against unscrupulous practice, which Includes the Heath and safety of their members, are accused on here of not acting in their members interests in wanting to ensure that two people working in a confined space are safe because they want a totally safe system of work to keep people safe.

Sure it's been a tough time for many, and some trainees so desperately wanting to be productive (aka getting qualified salary) should be grateful they've been fully employed on 100% pay siting at home while other members of front line staff, earning less than a trainee driver wage, have reported for duty and been exposed to the virus through this period.

Without trade Unions, there would be no health and safety at work rules, there would be no risk assessment done to see if your work place was safe.

Without trade Unions, the likelihood is that trainees and instructors would have been forced into he cab together with no protection from day 1 in March, crew messrooms would have zero measures in place to socially distance and for spare crews to report from home.

Keep bashing trade Unions if you want, but no one else is out there defending your workplace.

I’m not bashing the union at all. I’m saying that at some point it’s got to go back regardless and that at some point I’ve got to go back or I won’t have a job as I’m sure they won’t want to pay me to be at home forever. My wages change at preset/agreed dates anyway, I’ve been on newly qualified wages for months now and I’ve not even started my handling hours yet so no it’s not all about the wages going up bud! It’s about some self worth and being useful. I’m not a bit fan of being payed for doing nothing, I feel like a fraud

 

[lammergeier]

Just amazing!

I'm just watching the news and a scientist advising government says the best way of preventing the transmission of covid is when people stay apart, as new restrictions are put in place around the country and concerns for increasing covid cases.

Trade Unions which were established to defend working people against unscrupulous practice, which Includes the Heath and safety of their members, are accused on here of not acting in their members interests in wanting to ensure that two people working in a confined space are safe because they want a totally safe system of work to keep people safe.

Sure it's been a tough time for many, and some trainees so desperately wanting to be productive (aka getting qualified salary) should be grateful they've been fully employed on 100% pay siting at home while other members of front line staff, earning less than a trainee driver wage, have reported for duty and been exposed to the virus through this period.

Without trade Unions, there would be no health and safety at work rules, there would be no risk assessment done to see if your work place was safe.

Without trade Unions, the likelihood is that trainees and instructors would have been forced into he cab together with no protection from day 1 in March, crew messrooms would have zero measures in place to socially distance and for spare crews to report from home.

Keep bashing trade Unions if you want, but no one else is out there defending your workplace.

How is pointing out the simple fact that qualified drivers are affected by this the same as trainees "union bashing"?

 

[Stigy]

Just amazing!

I'm just watching the news and a scientist advising government says the best way of preventing the transmission of covid is when people stay apart, as new restrictions are put in place around the country and concerns for increasing covid cases.

Trade Unions which were established to defend working people against unscrupulous practice, which Includes the Heath and safety of their members, are accused on here of not acting in their members interests in wanting to ensure that two people working in a confined space are safe because they want a totally safe system of work to keep people safe.

Sure it's been a tough time for many, and some trainees so desperately wanting to be productive (aka getting qualified salary) should be grateful they've been fully employed on 100% pay siting at home while other members of front line staff, earning less than a trainee driver wage, have reported for duty and been exposed to the virus through this period.

Without trade Unions, there would be no health and safety at work rules, there would be no risk assessment done to see if your work place was safe.

Without trade Unions, the likelihood is that trainees and instructors would have been forced into he cab together with no protection from day 1 in March, crew messrooms would have zero measures in place to socially distance and for spare crews to report from home.

Keep bashing trade Unions if you want, but no one else is out there defending your workplace.

Worth pointing out that not all trainees are sat at home on full pay.

I’ve never been a fan of trade unions from a personal point of view and I certainly don’t have to explain my reasons to someone on the internet. I pay for a service at the end of the day. I do however appreciate what they’ve done for our T&Cs etc. If that’s having my cake and eating it then nom nom.

What I would say in response to what you’ve said above however, is that this country is all but opened up again. Pubs are open, Gyms are opening soon if they haven’t already, driving lessons have recommenced and you can travel on trains for leisure purposes. Yet we are still off work.

Statistically, one would surely have more chance contracting covid whilst going for a few beers down the local ‘Spoons?....

To say that without unions there’d be no H&S is just plain silly I’m afraid. There would still be laws companies have to abide by in one form or another, the same as any other industry With weaker unions. Finally just to point out, it’s not all a bed of Roses being stuck at home, and it affects people in different ways, that may be strains on relationships and/or mental health. It’s not all about the money.

 

[221129]

At the end of the day, the needs of the business and the need to cover the immediate service are more important to the TOCs. If you start putting trainees back on and they'll be mixing in the messrooms etc and you get a localised outbreak the TOCs will be in some hot water.

 

[Stigy]

At the end of the day, the needs of the business and the need to cover the immediate service are more important to the TOCs. If you start putting trainees back on and they'll be mixing in the messrooms etc and you get a localised outbreak the TOCs will be in some hot water.

I agree, and I also agree with this being taken seriously, wand that was the point of the trial. However, there’s a trial and there’s a trial, and this has dragged out a bit.

What if there is a second wave before we pass out (I say “if” because my glass is always half full, though I appreciate it probably doesn’t seem it in this thread )? Will we be sent home again? Or will the so called trial have taken this in to account (I really hope it’s the latter as that would be the common sense approach...)? Not sure if anyone has a definitive answer, but the unions tend to remain tight lipped.

 

[Trainrave]

From a personal view, as a trainee who has not yet done a days work for the company, my one and only reason for wanting to begin training is the fear of redundancy.
I am concerned that I have now picked up 6 months of wages without being any use to the company.

Fair play to the union for being as strong as they are, but I really hope that doesn’t come at the cost of jobs.

 

[221129]

From a personal view, as a trainee who has not yet done a days work for the company, my one and only reason for wanting to begin training is the fear of redundancy.
I am concerned that I have now picked up 6 months of wages without being any use to the company.

Fair play to the union for being as strong as they are, but I really hope that doesn’t come at the cost of jobs.

If you're likely to be made redundant then being halfway through the course or not starting wont have a massive bearing on it. You've been recruited for a reason, I wouldnt worry about it too much right now.

 

[TeaTrain]

I know what you mean @Trainrave! I have been paid for 4 months now and am defenitly itchy to get started. Providing it is safe to do so of course. My manager did tell me my job is safe so that put my mind at rest.