New ThamesLink/ branded TVMs at St Albans City

[jon0844]

Spotted two new S&B machines yesterday with the new T/ branding, and a few observations:

1) Why can companies not make a machine that is properly accessible to ALL? People with disabilities are not all in wheelchairs. These new machines are so low you must crouch down to see the display properly and use the PIN pad. Why? I am early 40s but have currently got some neck pain, so it was actually quite hard to use. Why not a card reader/PIN pad that can be tilted, or perhaps even TWO readers? Then everyone would be happy.

2) Why would a new machine have a resistive touchscreen instead of capacitive? Is it because they're not properly sheltered from the elements? These will be a right PITA for entering TOD codes or entering station names (I know, I had to do it to find my ticket).

3) I had to search for my destination because despite it being Sunday, the front screen doesn't offer the super off peak ticket to Brighton. But the machine DOES sell them - as long as you skip the home screen and find the destination manually. Sneaky, but I guess not illegal as TVMs aren't bound by the same rules on impartiality. No wonder the TOCs want rid of real people!

I guess I shouldn't complain about a station getting new machines. SAC now has a fair few machines, and certainly need them as all the old machines had a queue. Either people didn't notice this new one (the other wasn't working) or maybe they didn't fancy kneeling down to use them!

 

[Bishopstone]

One of these was installed at Bishopstone earlier this month: our first ticket machine for at least a decade.

Unless I missed it, there's no opportunity to buy a ticket starting from another station, which is a useful facility other Southern machines do offer. And yes, the inputs are painfully slow thanks to the resistive screen and what appears to be a slow processor for a new machine.

But much better than nothing, and indeed I'll be wandering down there later to collect some tickets for a very early start tomorrow, because I don't trust myself to allow enough time at 05.30 hours.

 

[jon0844]

I'd have hoped new machines would be markedly improved over the older ones, with a faster UI and maybe a higher resolution (for future upgrades).

Even the printer is no different, so lacking a higher resolution that could improve the new ticket design.

Bet they still cost loads though!

 

[class387]

One is at Hatfield as well, possibly earlier than St Albans.

 

[jon0844]

One is at Hatfield as well, possibly earlier than St Albans.

I've missed that! Heard one was coming but haven't spotted it.

 

[johnw]

Spotted two new S&B machines yesterday with the new T/ branding, and a few observations:

1) Why can companies not make a machine that is properly accessible to ALL? People with disabilities are not all in wheelchairs. These new machines are so low you must crouch down to see the display properly and use the PIN pad. Why? I am early 40s but have currently got some neck pain, so it was actually quite hard to use. Why not a card reader/PIN pad that can be tilted, or perhaps even TWO readers? Then everyone would be happy.

2) Why would a new machine have a resistive touchscreen instead of capacitive? Is it because they're not properly sheltered from the elements? These will be a right PITA for entering TOD codes or entering station names (I know, I had to do it to find my ticket).

3) I had to search for my destination because despite it being Sunday, the front screen doesn't offer the super off peak ticket to Brighton. But the machine DOES sell them - as long as you skip the home screen and find the destination manually. Sneaky, but I guess not illegal as TVMs aren't bound by the same rules on impartiality. No wonder the TOCs want rid of real people!

I guess I shouldn't complain about a station getting new machines. SAC now has a fair few machines, and certainly need them as all the old machines had a queue. Either people didn't notice this new one (the other wasn't working) or maybe they didn't fancy kneeling down to use them!

View attachment 28706

Spot on, I'm 6'4" tall and feel very vulnerable haveing to crouch down to use ticket machines and cash points.

 

[br0llz]

These machines including the GN/TL Ribbon logo in the software have cropped up at a few stations around the Southern West Coastway line too, it's very odd they've gone to the trouble of printing southern branded vinyls to wrap it, but not change the software logo...

Edit: Has anyone had a go on the contactless payment card reader yet?

 

[JonathanH]

One at Reigate too. Personally, I am very disappointed that they have gone for the S&B machines rather than ones with the Shere interface but maybe the latter are no longer in production.

The S&B machines have atrocious print quality, both before and after the recent ticket printing changes, a less intuitive interface and as noted in this thread do not offer some of the features that Southern have on their existing machines.

 

[TEW]

S&B machines can sell tickets from other origins, and tickets for up to 30 days in advance. London Overground and SWT TVMs offer both those features.

 

[F Great Eastern]

Much prefer S&B machines, a lot of those Shere machines have a bug where the card reader disables for 60 seconds or so if it cannot read the card at first try.

You then have an issue where it says it could not find any tickets attached or could not read the card, and takes you back to the main screen, the card reader display goes off and you try again and it doesn't respond or even try and read the card and after about 60 seconds it snaps back into life.

 

[jon0844]

Much prefer S&B machines, a lot of those Shere machines have a bug where the card reader disables for 60 seconds or so if it cannot read the card at first try.

You then have an issue where it says it could not find any tickets attached or could not read the card, and takes you back to the main screen, the card reader display goes off and you try again and it doesn't respond or even try and read the card and after about 60 seconds it snaps back into life.

That describes the exact problem I had once. It was most annoying.

But TVMs so often are, unless ordering a simple ticket on the front page (meaning most people don't have problems and would likely say they're great).

 

[F Great Eastern]

That describes the exact problem I had once. It was most annoying.

But TVMs so often are, unless ordering a simple ticket on the front page (meaning most people don't have problems and would likely say they're great).

I arrived at Kings Cross once and had the same thing happen on 2 machines next to each other, which in turn annoyed the hell out of the person behind me who on one machine tried to pay with a card and it wouldn't recognise his card either whilst I tried the second machine (since the card reader was off) same happened and the person got frustrated as he switched over to the second machine and had the same problem and got a very dirty look.

Wasn't going to hang around and tell him to wait 60 seconds as I legged it to the other side of the concourse to use the S&B ex FCC machines which worked first time and a lot quicker at reading the card as well, ever since then I just avoid the shere machines if I can or know I have a tight connection, just pick them up somewhere else

Personally whilst the resolution on the older ones is crap (newer ones seem to be slightly better even if not perfect) the S&B have never failed me, never freaked out or gave strange errors, broke down or had problems reading cards. There's also the issue as I reported before that the Shere machines tend to be very picky about using foreign (work issued) Visa cards which simply never happens on S&B machines.

 

[JonathanH]

S&B machines can sell tickets from other origins, and tickets for up to 30 days in advance. London Overground and SWT TVMs offer both those features.

Yes, SWT ones do however only sell tickets from other SWT locations rather than truly allowing remote issue which is completely ridiculous when you are somewhere at the extremity of their operation.

 

[talldave]

Spot on, I'm 6'4" tall and feel very vulnerable haveing to crouch down to use ticket machines and cash points.

I'm 6'5" and TVMs are a pain in the back! It's not just the railway though, the PIN pads on Barclays' in branch all singing & dancing touch screen banking extravaganza machines are also ludicrously low. Why does "accessible" only ever mean "low"?

 

[jon0844]

Why does "accessible" only ever mean "low"?

I really don't know.

My mum was wheelchair bound for a few years but made a reasonable recovery and now walks with a stick. Because of her back injury, she would be totally unable to use one of these machines.

So, when I hear companies bragging about how they've invested in 'accessible' equipment, perhaps shown in a photo with a wheelchair user smiling and shaking the hand of the CEO, I can only sigh and think 'you don't have a clue'.

 

[Skimble19]

I've missed that! Heard one was coming but haven't spotted it.

There is also one at Welwyn Garden City. New TVMs are finally popping up all over the route.

The one at Hatfield is in the retail entrance, the WGC machine is up in the Howard Centre by the Ticket Office.

 

[jon0844]

There is also one at Welwyn Garden City. New TVMs are finally popping up all over the route.

The one at Hatfield is in the retail entrance, the WGC machine is up in the Howard Centre by the Ticket Office.

Ah, that'll explain why I haven't noticed the Hatfield one. Rarely come in that way.

 

[causton]

Please say these aren't the new ones that we are getting on the Abbey line and on other stations...

At least yours have the new software! Ours still mention Oyster Extension Permits

 

[ert47]

There was a briefing about new machines coming a few months back. Can't remember of the top of my head as to where all of them would be, but there were to be some remote ones where you can request assistance from an assistant who could guide you through the purchase...

 

[jon0844]

There was a briefing about new machines coming a few months back. Can't remember of the top of my head as to where all of them would be, but there were to be some remote ones where you can request assistance from an assistant who could guide you through the purchase...

The video link ones? I note that Amazon stopped promoting its customer support service feature in its tablets that had a video link (one way), as I presume customers didn't like it.

 

[Skimble19]

There was a briefing about new machines coming a few months back. Can't remember of the top of my head as to where all of them would be, but there were to be some remote ones where you can request assistance from an assistant who could guide you through the purchase...

5 of them on GN at present at Welwyn North, Meldreth, Waterbeach, Biggleswade and (from memory so could be wrong!) Ashwell & Morden. I believe the idea is to trial them at stations with limited staffing hours so passengers still have a way of talking to someone whilst buying tickets when the office is shut and nobody is around.

 

[jon0844]

So with GTRs long term plans, they'll be at all stations eventually!

 

[Inspector999]

I still can't get my head around the limits on the range of tickets / stations that modern TVMs have.
I can well remember that, during an idle moment at Annecy station in France back in 1990, I could get the machine to issue tickets from a distant station and do seat reservations on the TGV, and do all that in English.
Surely software capabilities have increased enough in the last 26 years for the whole fares manual to be loaded on current machines. It must be a commercial decision not to bother. And that is a real scandal when people end up having to pay more money than the cheapest valid fare for their journey.

 

[jon0844]

It is why TOCs are not yet ready to close ticket offices, and any comparison with London Underground is crazy as the two situations are totally different.

Until a machine can do everything, it cannot replace real people. I don't see that happening if we're getting TOCs buying new machines that are still based on what we had years ago.

 

[Kite159]

So with GTRs long term plans, they'll be at all stations eventually!

Including Doleham?

 

[jon0844]

Saw the one at Hatfield today. Good that it does accept CPCs (didn't try it at SAC even though that had it too) but I noticed that even the screen is hard to see when standing!

Maybe these machines should come with seats?

 

[philjo]

There is also one in the ticket hall at Potters Bar next to the existing TVM. Looked to be far too low to be usable without incurring back pain.

 

[jon0844]

There is also one in the ticket hall at Potters Bar next to the existing TVM. Looked to be far too low to be usable without incurring back pain.

Maybe someone should ask GTR? I bet they'd come up with a standard statement about having to make them accessible and miss the point entirely.

I'd Tweet myself but think I've probably said enough to them of late. Don't want to get barred!

 

[Skimble19]

It's a shame the screens arent higher, but I suppose with that particular design there isn't really a practical way of doing that without making it considerably harder for someone in a wheelchair to use it. With the other machines the screens are of course at an angle which helps with the height issue, but these are considerably smaller so there's no room inside the machine for that to be done.