• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

New Train Driver Assessment

Status
Not open for further replies.

EdZ

Member
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
14
Just completed the first part of the new assessment regime (paper-based tests only), so I though I'd give an overview of the new tests.

First off, the Group Bourdon and TRP are done back-to-back. As far as I am aware, these are unchanged from the previous assessment, so plenty of information on them can be found elsewhere. As I understand it from the research papers on the selection of the new tests, the computerised Group Bourdon is no longer used.

The second half of the day was for the new TEA-Occ (Test of Everyday Attention for Occupational Assessment), which is done in 3 parts back-to-back:

First is an exercise where you must count low tones, interspersed with high tones that you must ignore. This was the part I found the most difficult, especially as 'low' and 'high' are relative. You cannot make any tally marks, and counting on your fingers is not going to help you (the tones are too quick, and often count above 10). Remember: the first tone you hear is always a 'low' tone, so you always start by counting 'one'.

Second is a test where you have to search a faux Yellow Pages for symbol pairs. There is a lot of flim-flam about going on holiday and having to hire a plumber, but that is irrelevant to the task. You also have a 'symbol card' on which four symbol pairs are shown, but there are only four varieties of symbols on the answer sheet so this also is a bit of indirection. What the test boils down to is ignoring any text on the answer sheet, and circling any and all pairs of matching symbols. That's it, and you have 45 seconds.

Third, you do the same symbol matching task (with some new waffle about finding a restaurant, again irrelevant) but at the same time you must count sequences of tones. Unlike the first task the tones are all the same, so this is much easier. There are several answer boxes on the answer sheet but you do not necessarily fill them all (e.g. there may be 15 answer boxes but you may only be played 8 sequences of beeps), so you cannot rely on looking at how many boxes are left to fill as to how much time you have left. You have 60 seconds.


The invigilator understandably kept schtum on any marking criteria for any of the tests, but we were told that OPC would mark the exercises within a week and hand them to the TOC, who may take another week before contacting anyone.

::EDIT::

Update! Assessment part 2:

Starts with providing short (one, maybe two sentences) on a selection of questions, that will later be used for the MMI. Very similar types of questions to the CBI, so look up the large amount of information on that.

Next, the Situational Judgement Exercise. It's judgement based, so I can't really offer any advice. Done on a computer, you click on-screen buttons with the mouse, if you can't do that you have bigger problems than trying to drive a train.

The MMI itself seemed to be entirely based around further questioning on the examples provided at the start of the day. Rumors that the MMI would be more based on theoretical responses to situations and less on personal experiences seem to have been utterly incorrect. This came as a rather unpleasant surprise.

Next, you have the perception and vigilance tests:

WAFV: A small square in the centre of the screen will blink regularly (or close to regularly, seemed to be about once per second to me) light grey. Occasionally, it will appear as light grey and then after half a second switch to dark grey. (i.e. it will not appear as a dark grey, the switch will be fairly obvious) You then press a button on the provided Schuhfried WTS controller. You do this for 30 minutes solid, though it will only feel like 10 at most. There are only two tricky things about this test: first, eye strain. Staring at a fairly bright screen for half an hour is more tiring than you think. Second, the button on the controller is awful. The activation force is so light that resting your finger on it will cause you to press it accidentally, but there is no positive engagement force, so it feels really mushy when you actually press it.

ATAVT: Watch the youtube video for an example of what the images look like. Don't worry about trying to memorise which button corresponds to which category, the answer screen after each image will have the buttons and their labels displayed.

2HAND: For those thinking "I'm used to the Playstation's dual-thumbstick layout, I'll be fine", be warned! The joysticks do NOT move the dot by velocity (i.e. pushing the stick up further, the dot moves up faster) as you would normally expect. Instead, the absolute position of the stick corresponds to the absolute position of the dot on the screen. If you pushed the stick halfway up from it's centre position, the dot will be 2/3 of the way up the screen, and if you let the stick go it will flick back to the centre position, and the dot will jump back to the centre of the screen. Left stick controls left/right, right stick controls up/down. Also, there is only one pattern you need to trace, and you do it multiple times. If you crammed together CVT so the letters joined, that's the sort of path you need to trace.
 
Last edited:
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

red2005

Member
Joined
9 May 2009
Messages
844
Location
north ish
Sounds absolutely ridiculous to me!!yes I understand you need to find the right kind of person to drive trains but I think they may have forgotten that this is just the role of a train driver!!...it's not an astronaut etc!!....the role of a lorry driver shares equally the same amount of responsibility yet doesn't have to go through all this flim flam!!

There was nothing wrong with the old tests!...they were demanding enough as it was so why fix something that wasn't broken!?? Bloody annoying if you ask me!
 

welshjpc

Member
Joined
31 May 2013
Messages
89
Location
BBK
Oh no, not the lorry driver vs train driver thing again. Don't open that can of worms.
 

ultra4

Member
Joined
20 Sep 2013
Messages
144
I suppose, that gives more people chance to become train drivers.
Regardless of your mechanical, physical, electrical knowledge etc.
Determines whether one can multitask, and probably whether he has an X-factor required to be safe and reliable train driver?
 

Silv1983

Member
Joined
8 Jun 2012
Messages
527
Location
Somewhere in Stockport
Sounds absolutely ridiculous to me!!yes I understand you need to find the right kind of person to drive trains but I think they may have forgotten that this is just the role of a train driver!!...it's not an astronaut etc!!....the role of a lorry driver shares equally the same amount of responsibility yet doesn't have to go through all this flim flam!!

There was nothing wrong with the old tests!...they were demanding enough as it was so why fix something that wasn't broken!?? Bloody annoying if you ask me!

I'd be worried if this is comparible to what astronauts have to go through..
 

red2005

Member
Joined
9 May 2009
Messages
844
Location
north ish
Well the level of responsibility is still the same!whether people like it or not!if anything I'd say the responsibility of driving trucks and buses is higher still!


I'm not so sure it does give more people the opportunity to be train drivers to be honest, it may just open it up to people who were not so hot on mechanics and electrics etc but what about the people that are good at those things but not so hot at the new stuff!?and let's be honest there's not a great deal of mechanics etc involved in the day to day role of a driver!.....only thinking that comes into any mechanical problem on board is what the number of the maintenance department is lol
 

EdZ

Member
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
14
The tests are on ability, not competence. They're designed so that practising them will provide little if any improvement.
For your astronaut analogy: they're testing whether you panic when rotating at rapid speeds about multiple axes with no frame of reference, not whether you can correctly calculate the burn times required for a Hohmann transfer. The latter can be taught, the former cannot.

As for responsibility, it's not so much responsibility but rather ability. A bus crash is nasty, but low speed and unlikely to do much damage to anything other than the bus and a handful of card. A train crash can not only cause scores of fatalities, but can devastate the infrastructure around it (e.g. bridge impacts). Additionally, the margin of error between a warning sign and the required reaction is far slimmer due to the increased speed, massively longer stopping distance, and the inability to manoeuvre.
 

ultra4

Member
Joined
20 Sep 2013
Messages
144
Just completed the first part of the new assessment regime (paper-based tests only), so I though I'd give an overview of the new tests.

First off, the Group Bourdon and TRP are done back-to-back. As far as I am aware, these are unchanged from the previous assessment, so plenty of information on them can be found elsewhere. As I understand it from the research papers on the selection of the new tests, the computerised Group Bourdon is no longer used.

The second half of the day was for the new TEA-Occ (Test of Everyday Attention for Occupational Assessment), which is done in 3 parts back-to-back:

First is an exercise where you must count low tones, interspersed with high tones that you must ignore. This was the part I found the most difficult, especially as 'low' and 'high' are relative. You cannot make any tally marks, and counting on your fingers is not going to help you (the tones are too quick, and often count above 10). Remember: the first tone you hear is always a 'low' tone, so you always start by counting 'one'.

Second is a test where you have to search a faux Yellow Pages for symbol pairs. There is a lot of flim-flam about going on holiday and having to hire a plumber, but that is irrelevant to the task. You also have a 'symbol card' on which four symbol pairs are shown, but there are only four varieties of symbols on the answer sheet so this also is a bit of indirection. What the test boils down to is ignoring any text on the answer sheet, and circling any and all pairs of matching symbols. That's it, and you have 45 seconds.

Third, you do the same symbol matching task (with some new waffle about finding a restaurant, again irrelevant) but at the same time you must count sequences of tones. Unlike the first task the tones are all the same, so this is much easier. There are several answer boxes on the answer sheet but you do not necessarily fill them all (e.g. there may be 15 answer boxes but you may only be played 8 sequences of beeps), so you cannot rely on looking at how many boxes are left to fill as to how much time you have left. You have 60 seconds.


The invigilator understandably kept schtum on any marking criteria for any of the tests, but we were told that OPC would mark the exercises within a week and hand them to the TOC, who may take another week before contacting anyone.

How do you feel, you got on?

I found paper dots test easier than computerized one.

TRP1 subject GLOP, was not too hard (was your subject the same?)

Dials and cables, found it much harder, than the practice materials. There were four dials, four sectors, and scales on top, which had to be looked at only if more than one arrow were falling into the same sector. And finally there were 43 questions to be answered in only 8 minutes.

TEA-Occ I expected it to be much harder to be honest. Counting the tones is much easier than counting particular words while listening to the recording.
 

notadriver

Established Member
Joined
1 Oct 2010
Messages
3,653
Well the level of responsibility is still the same!whether people like it or not!if anything I'd say the responsibility of driving trucks and buses is higher still!


I'm not so sure it does give more people the opportunity to be train drivers to be honest, it may just open it up to people who were not so hot on mechanics and electrics etc but what about the people that are good at those things but not so hot at the new stuff!?and let's be honest there's not a great deal of mechanics etc involved in the day to day role of a driver!.....only thinking that comes into any mechanical problem on board is what the number of the maintenance department is lol

I really hope the driver manager interviewing you doesn't see your comments here.
 

red2005

Member
Joined
9 May 2009
Messages
844
Location
north ish
Lol Jesus what have you been reading!??lol

Your just talking about the people ON the bus obviously but what about the other people around it!? I'm sorry mate but that was the biggest load of clap trap I think I have ever read!!

Yes you talk about bridge bashes etc but in reality those hazards are extremely rare!! Trains and the infrastructure have a lot of safety systems on board to compensate those hazards a lorry or a bus does not therefore the reliance on the driver is just as high!!any large vehicle in the wrong hands is a weapon!..and for a start train drivers whilst at work don't have to put up with the IGNORANCE of other road users who shouldn't be let anywhere near a push bike let alone a car or any other motor propelled vehicle!..try asking any road user (especially commercial ones)with an ounce of common sense whether their reactions have to be tip top or not!

By the way chap when talking about fatalities on the roads/railway etc try doing your research....your talking to someone who has not only witnessed multiple accidents involving commercial vehicles whilst driving them,but unfortunately had the duty of pulling the deceased out of them as an operational firefighter.low/high speeds have very little to do with it when your dealing with a 44 tonne articulated vehicle loaded with steel girders or hazardous goods for example!....5mph or 56mph that's going to do damage

I work alongside train drivers daily and have done for 5 years I know what abilities you need to be a train driver. And I dare any want to be train driver to go into a structured/ managers interview and say "it's not about responsibility it's about ability" whether you like it or not mate a lot of people could be trained to be a train driver and pass the course comfortably , granted people fail as well as they do in many other careers.

Why are you still talking about astronauts I brought that up as as a term....kind of in the way people sometimes use the term "it's not rocket science" lol dear oh dear you'll be quoting Stephen hawking next
 

EdZ

Member
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
14
How do you feel, you got on?
Mostly worried about my Group Bourdon. I ended up doing 1-2 lines worse on part 4 than the others (which were consistent).
I found paper dots test easier than computerized one.
The opposite for me! With the computerised one, I can scan along a line then mark 'behind' my gaze. With the paper one, your hand gets in the way no matter how you orient the paper (and I was told "no, you can't turn the test upside-down")!
TRP1 subject GLOP, was not too hard (was your subject the same?)
Same here. I'm guessing they must rotate subjects.
Dials and cables, found it much harder, than the practice materials. There were four dials, four sectors, and scales on top, which had to be looked at only if more than one arrow were falling into the same sector. And finally there were 43 questions to be answered in only 8 minutes.
Ditto. I was expecting it to be fairly easy, even after the examples, but I ran out of time with a page or two of questions still to go. Wish I could recall if that was a 'penalised for errors' test or not.
TEA-Occ I expected it to be much harder to be honest. Counting the tones is much easier than counting particular words while listening to the recording.
Apart from the first part, the TEA-Occ wasn't too bad. The pair-finding parts are really just a mini Group Bourdon spread out over a big piece of paper with easier symbols to find.
 
Last edited:

142094

Established Member
Joined
7 Nov 2009
Messages
8,789
Location
Newcastle
Have to say that those tests sound a lot like the one used by Network Rail for signallers. Phone book and high and low tones sounds just about the same.
 

welshjpc

Member
Joined
31 May 2013
Messages
89
Location
BBK
Well the level of responsibility is still the same!whether people like it or not!if anything I'd say the responsibility of driving trucks and buses is higher still

OK, I asked you to leave this can of worms alone but you seem keen to have a go. Let me just get on my soapbox.....

How do you become a lorry driver? A few weeks doing a course (I know how to strap down a load and drive a big truck).
How do you become a bus driver? A few weeks doing a course (I know to talk nicely to passengers and not swerve wildly in a vehicle with a long wheel base).

I have my C, C1 and C+E driving license thanks to my job I also passed my PCV theory test but didn't want to take my driving test as I didn't see it as a job I would want in the future.

However I wouldn't touch a permanent lorry or bus job with a poopy stick. Other drivers are lunatics.

p.s. I do understand rocket science :p
 
Last edited:

Silv1983

Member
Joined
8 Jun 2012
Messages
527
Location
Somewhere in Stockport
Glenn what job allows you to work alongside train drivers daily and gain a comprehensive understanding of the role? Even Driver Managers' can't put claim to that statement. I'm curous please enlighten.
 

DunfordBridge

Member
Joined
13 Apr 2013
Messages
600
Location
Scarborough
Have to say that those tests sound a lot like the one used by Network Rail for signallers. Phone book and high and low tones sounds just about the same.

That is very interesting. I was only reading the Pearson website last night where it actually mentioned that the test was used for signallers. I never imagined that it included UK signallers.
 

ultra4

Member
Joined
20 Sep 2013
Messages
144
Wish I could recall if that was a 'penalised for errors' test or not.

No there was no penalties for wrong answers. I wish the administrator gave us a warning when where were for example 30 secs left.
Could have had a wild guess on remaining questions, and who know some of them might have been correct.::(
 

Trainer74

Member
Joined
12 Apr 2012
Messages
29
Just completed the first part of the new assessment regime (paper-based tests only), so I though I'd give an overview of the new tests.

First off, the Group Bourdon and TRP are done back-to-back. As far as I am aware, these are unchanged from the previous assessment, so plenty of information on them can be found elsewhere. As I understand it from the research papers on the selection of the new tests, the computerised Group Bourdon is no longer used.

The second half of the day was for the new TEA-Occ (Test of Everyday Attention for Occupational Assessment), which is done in 3 parts back-to-back:

First is an exercise where you must count low tones, interspersed with high tones that you must ignore. This was the part I found the most difficult, especially as 'low' and 'high' are relative. You cannot make any tally marks, and counting on your fingers is not going to help you (the tones are too quick, and often count above 10). Remember: the first tone you hear is always a 'low' tone, so you always start by counting 'one'.

Second is a test where you have to search a faux Yellow Pages for symbol pairs. There is a lot of flim-flam about going on holiday and having to hire a plumber, but that is irrelevant to the task. You also have a 'symbol card' on which four symbol pairs are shown, but there are only four varieties of symbols on the answer sheet so this also is a bit of indirection. What the test boils down to is ignoring any text on the answer sheet, and circling any and all pairs of matching symbols. That's it, and you have 45 seconds.

Third, you do the same symbol matching task (with some new waffle about finding a restaurant, again irrelevant) but at the same time you must count sequences of tones. Unlike the first task the tones are all the same, so this is much easier. There are several answer boxes on the answer sheet but you do not necessarily fill them all (e.g. there may be 15 answer boxes but you may only be played 8 sequences of beeps), so you cannot rely on looking at how many boxes are left to fill as to how much time you have left. You have 60 seconds.


The invigilator understandably kept schtum on any marking criteria for any of the tests, but we were told that OPC would mark the exercises within a week and hand them to the TOC, who may take another week before contacting anyone.
Hi Edz, I sat stage 1 on Tuesday 17th at Reading the morning session. We were told that we would have to wait at least two weeks for results. Great news I had an email today saying that I'd passed stage 1. 3 days wait not bad. I'm well chuffed! The email said that they were in the process of finalising dates for stage 2. The new tests did make you think and concentrate a lot more and I can see why they have introduced them. Good luck to anyone that has done stage 1.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Just completed the first part of the new assessment regime (paper-based tests only), so I though I'd give an overview of the new tests.

First off, the Group Bourdon and TRP are done back-to-back. As far as I am aware, these are unchanged from the previous assessment, so plenty of information on them can be found elsewhere. As I understand it from the research papers on the selection of the new tests, the computerised Group Bourdon is no longer used.

The second half of the day was for the new TEA-Occ (Test of Everyday Attention for Occupational Assessment), which is done in 3 parts back-to-back:

First is an exercise where you must count low tones, interspersed with high tones that you must ignore. This was the part I found the most difficult, especially as 'low' and 'high' are relative. You cannot make any tally marks, and counting on your fingers is not going to help you (the tones are too quick, and often count above 10). Remember: the first tone you hear is always a 'low' tone, so you always start by counting 'one'.

Second is a test where you have to search a faux Yellow Pages for symbol pairs. There is a lot of flim-flam about going on holiday and having to hire a plumber, but that is irrelevant to the task. You also have a 'symbol card' on which four symbol pairs are shown, but there are only four varieties of symbols on the answer sheet so this also is a bit of indirection. What the test boils down to is ignoring any text on the answer sheet, and circling any and all pairs of matching symbols. That's it, and you have 45 seconds.

Third, you do the same symbol matching task (with some new waffle about finding a restaurant, again irrelevant) but at the same time you must count sequences of tones. Unlike the first task the tones are all the same, so this is much easier. There are several answer boxes on the answer sheet but you do not necessarily fill them all (e.g. there may be 15 answer boxes but you may only be played 8 sequences of beeps), so you cannot rely on looking at how many boxes are left to fill as to how much time you have left. You have 60 seconds.


The invigilator understandably kept schtum on any marking criteria for any of the tests, but we were told that OPC would mark the exercises within a week and hand them to the TOC, who may take another week before contacting anyone.
Hi Edz, I sat stage 1 on Tuesday 17th at Reading the morning session. We were told that we would have to wait at least two weeks for results. Great news I had an email today saying that I'd passed stage 1. 3 days wait not bad. I'm well chuffed! The email said that they were in the process of finalising dates for stage 2. The new tests did make you think and concentrate a lot more and I can see why they have introduced them. Good luck to anyone that has done stage 1.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
No there was no penalties for wrong answers. I wish the administrator gave us a warning when where were for example 30 secs left.
Could have had a wild guess on remaining questions, and who know some of them might have been correct.::(

Ultra hi. Group bourdon test I didn't finish
Glop test left 2 answers blank ( went to go back but ran out of time )
The dials I did 27 out of the 43
The new tests I found ok
Sat on Tuesday this week, had email to say I passed today ( 3 days wait not two weeks ) and that I would have an email soon about stage 2 soon. To be honest I think they're looking to see how accurate you are with your answers more than anything. Don't be disheartened just keep going. I applied before the closing day in May, heard nothing until end of August. In 5 weeks I've done everything up to stage 1 :(). Now waiting for stage 2. Gd luck.
 

EdZ

Member
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
14
Hi Edz, I sat stage 1 on Tuesday 17th at Reading the morning session. We were told that we would have to wait at least two weeks for results. Great news I had an email today saying that I'd passed stage 1. 3 days wait not bad. I'm well chuffed! The email said that they were in the process of finalising dates for stage 2.
Interesting! My test was Wednesday 16th, so hopefully I'll hear back early next week.
 
Last edited:

theageofthetra

On Moderation
Joined
27 May 2012
Messages
3,504
Are there any restrictions on using a countdown timer app on your phone (with phone in flight mode) so you know how much time is left? I think it would really help in the parts of the assessment where wrong answers don't matter and allow you the last 10-15 secs to just put random answers.
 

ultra4

Member
Joined
20 Sep 2013
Messages
144
Hi Edz, I sat stage 1 on Tuesday 17th at Reading the morning session.

You mean Tue the 15th?
Mine was on the 17th that's why I asked you where were you sitting.
However 17th was on Thursday
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Interesting! My test was Wednesday 18th, so hopefully I'll hear back early next week.

Was is Wed the 16th?
LOL guys there is confusion with dates, maybe we all sat the same assessment ? :lol:
Your dates correspond with days in month September.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Are there any restrictions on using a countdown timer app on your phone (with phone in flight mode) so you know how much time is left? I think it would really help in the parts of the assessment where wrong answers don't matter and allow you the last 10-15 secs to just put random answers.

Yes, there are. Nothing except for provided materials is allowed on your desk.
They are very strict too.
Although I suppose, you could get away with whist watch (with timer function).
 

red2005

Member
Joined
9 May 2009
Messages
844
Location
north ish
OK, I asked you to leave this can of worms alone but you seem keen to have a go. Let me just get on my soapbox

Lol who are you the railuk forum police!??lol

Fair play for passing the tests and your right aspects of those roles certainly are not rocket science but if you think those roles are about strapping down loads and talking nicely to people and that's your lot fair enough you have your opinion lol.

My point on this whole subject has nothing to do with anyone's ability to carry out the roles mentioned as like I said earlier many people could be trained to do all those roles!

My point was they seem to kick the backside out of it with the assessments for the role of a train driver when there is no more need for good reactions,concentration and basic mechanical knowledge than that of most people that drive on our roads for a living!? And my opinion is that there is certainly no more responsibility in being a train driver to that of anyone who drives larger or passenger carrying road vehicles etc.
 

youngboy

Member
Joined
28 Jan 2013
Messages
128
It sounds to me after reading these posts about the new tests that they seem easier than the old ones or much the same.
I think more emphasis on the CBI and driver manager interview is probably the way to go, maybe on the CBI they should extend the interview and ask more searching questions as someone said on here months ago that would sort the men from the boys !!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It's a futile argument talking about job responsibility, I'm a gas engineer so my jobs more responsible than anyone else's....or is it my mate's job he's an architect working on high rise apartment development's etc etc, his argument is that he's more responsibility because his company insure him for personal liability of millions because if he designs wrong and the building collapses he could kill thousands. His boss thinks hes more responsible he's the manager and ultimately he carries the can........ it could go on forever !!
 

bystander

Member
Joined
2 Jan 2012
Messages
61
Sounds absolutely ridiculous to me!!yes I understand you need to find the right kind of person to drive trains but I think they may have forgotten that this is just the role of a train driver!!...it's not an astronaut etc!!....the role of a lorry driver shares equally the same amount of responsibility yet doesn't have to go through all this flim flam!!

There was nothing wrong with the old tests!...they were demanding enough as it was so why fix something that wasn't broken!?? Bloody annoying if you ask me!

With road driving, many mistakes are recoverable with no consequences at all. On the railway, many or even most driver errors result in delays at the very minimum while the situation is sorted out (even if it's just two minutes while the emergency brakes come off - that still needs explaining and more pertinently paying for by someone). My experience of drivers and trainees is that those who understand that it may appear to be a not-particularly-difficult job, but is one that you have to get 100% correct (within very small parameters) 100% of the time are those who prosper and don't come a cropper. Those who harp on about what a boring / easy / rubbish / etc delete as applicable job are those who tend to have incidents. You need to be calm, humble and to understand that you have to respect the job, in order to do it well and unobtrusively which is the name of the game. Have you considered that having the mentality of understanding that you must apply yourself to pass tests and jump through hoops in a very specific manner might just possibly be part of the aptitude to drive a train? And if that isn't obvious to you then you don't fit the criteria to be a driver. Which I daresay you don't.
 

red2005

Member
Joined
9 May 2009
Messages
844
Location
north ish
Yes understand all that as I work alongside drivers as I've already mentioned so have seen and heard first hand what the role is about re jumping through hoops, delays , tests etc , well if the tests are so flawless and particularly vital how are these people who find it boring/rubbish/in it for the money/ easy getting through these tests!?

Yes and many mistakes are not!....there's a million and one safety systems that can stop train drivers making certain mistakes and then they have safety systems to back up THOSE safety systems , road users unfortunately don't have that option as the 6 friends I have lost in car accidents since school would love to tell you!

Look your getting the wrong end of the stick here!!no one is saying that you don't have to be a certain kind of individual to drive trains as that's obvious!!....you can't just put any nutter in the cab!..my point was that the tests and the way they piddle about with them is a bit extreme in comparison to the role.
 
Last edited:

Johncleesefan

Member
Joined
4 Sep 2013
Messages
729
I think that all the assessments and stages are put in place for your own safety, the safety of the passengers/freight and the company you are going to work for. To me, the whole process is legit in terms of getting the right person for the job, If the person has what it takes to drive a train for a living then he/she will have no issues in the recruitment process. Its in place to determine they only get the right people for the job, and leave as little margin for error in putting through the wrong candidate. Maybe what you're suggesting is that the pcv/hgv process needs to be tightened up to be similar to the train driver process, so that only the very best will acquire a license?
 

GB

Established Member
Joined
16 Nov 2008
Messages
6,457
Location
Somewhere
Yes and many mistakes are not!....there's a million and one safety systems that can stop train drivers making certain mistakes and then they have safety systems to back up THOSE safety systems , road users unfortunately don't have that option as the 6 friends I have lost in car accidents since school would love to tell you!

I am curious to know what these million and one safety systems are and what the back up of those million and one safety systems are.
 

ultra4

Member
Joined
20 Sep 2013
Messages
144
Everything changes with time. Changes meant to improve and they are based on observations, and result analyses. Such is human's nature aiming for perfection.
I think the whole idea of new test is more precise and fairer selection among recruits.
TOCs are looking for individuals with aptitudes. How do you find or measure them?
No scale or measuring tape or even laser will help here.
Therefore current selection process, invented I suppose by some brainy people, is most appropriate tool, at this moment in time. Until the next one comes up.
Many of us are responsible and safe and carry out duties where smallest mistake can cost lives.
However not all of us are able to do each other jobs.
Mentioned above architect is brilliant in calculating structured, loads etc. which is on the paper but might be useless at calculating braking distance of 2km long train.
A gas engineer's mistake will potentially blow up half of the street - very responsible job indeed.
However he might fall asleep while driving the train during the night for a long time.
etc
Doesn't matter how much some of us disagree with current selection process, we need to accept it as one being probably the best.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Maybe what you're suggesting is that the pcv/hgv process needs to be tightened up to be similar to the train driver process, so that only the very best will acquire a license?
I agree.
How many irresponsible lorry driver have you seen, overtaking on the motorway, changing directions without indication, forcing cars off the lane, loosing temper, blasting horn, swearing etc. Same applies to bus drivers (I am one to), so I know what I am talking about.
There is some much more to it then just being able to steer, accelerate and brake perfectly.
 

A-driver

Established Member
Joined
9 May 2011
Messages
4,482
Glenn what job allows you to work alongside train drivers daily and gain a comprehensive understanding of the role? Even Driver Managers' can't put claim to that statement. I'm curous please enlighten.

"Glenn25" seems to be a troll so don't expect him to answer that question. Just ignore him. He is just trying to start another round of 'anyone can drive a train, it's a easy job, all overpaid, all prima donnas, bus driving is harder' etc arguments.

He clearly has no idea what he is actually talking about from reading his posts so far on this thread!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top