No fares found for 31st May

[466.networkers]

Hi all,

I'm trying to book some tickets for Monday 31st May which is a Bank Holiday.

My girlfriend and I are travelling from Sheerness-on-Sea (SSS) to Birmingham New Street (BHM), leaving after 9am. (I have a 16-25 Railcard (we might both have them, yet to be decided) and we are returning on the 6th June)

I've tried Virgin Trains, London Midland/Southeastern and National Rail - all three say no fares available!

Can someone explain why this is happening, has engineering works got anything to do with it?

Thanks in advance.
Ryan

 

[ainsworth74]

I just put SSS to BHM into National Rail for 31/5/10 and leaving SSS I can see services at 9:02am and 9:32am. It takes 3+ hours though!

Not sure why you can't see them

 

[royaloak]

Possibly because the return is 12 weeks away and it cant give you fares as the service has not been loaded up yet.

 

[466.networkers]

Hi guys,

I'm not booking the return leg yet as I know it's not twelve weeks away.

I still can't find any fares for Monday 31st ... the only fares I get are for Tuesday 1st June ...

Any ideas?

 

[ainsworth74]

I'm a fool, I see now what you mean! I was looking at tickets for the 1st of June, NRE was kicking me over the 1st of June with out actually telling me! Sorry I can't help, as far as I know they do run on bank holidays, just with a reduced service.

 

[Ivo]

Would the Bank Holiday have anything to do with it? As in, no declarations/announcements until much later?

 

[Mojo]

It's not to do with there being no fares, but no trains in the system from SSS or SIT on 31 May!

 

[466.networkers]

Strange - Sittingbourne is a mainline station - how can this be possible?

Southeastern's Engineering Works page only goes up to the 17-21 May, so no luck there.

I'm gonna try trains to BHM from GLM or SOO (Gillingham Kent/Strood) and see what happens.

EDIT: No luck from either of those ....

 

[janb]

There has been an issue with incomplete timetable data in Journey Planner (RJIS replacement) for dates beyond the timetable change (23rd May IIRC). And thus one presumes the online systems also. It was meant to be fixed by 5th March but not sure if that has happened. But possibly the same/similar problem in play here.

 

[button_boxer]

The NR booking horizons page suggests no TOCs are open beyond 30th May as yet.

 

[466.networkers]

Thanks for the replies so far.

Does anyone have any information as to when I'll be able to book the tickets I need?

Thanks
Ryan

 

[cuccir]

I had a similar experience when trying to book tickets for this forthcoming Easter Monday; the advance tickets for Virgin trains down the WCML came up roughly a week later than would be expected, presumably as they were still sorting out the timetable/engineering details.

 

[button_boxer]

See my previous post - the booking horizons page on the National Rail website tells you exactly how far ahead each train company is taking reservations (and thus how far ahead you can book advance tickets, as the two are linked). Also the trainline (and I believe some TOC websites too) will let you sign up with the details of the journey you want to make and they'll email you when advance tickets become available. Of course just because the alert comes from thetrainline doesn't mean you have to book through them - book through a TOC site instead and there's no booking fee.

 

[tony_mac]

it's not accurate, even though it was updated today.
Virgin tickets are already available for 1st June, for example.

 

[googolplex]

East Coast are currently advising bookings are available up to the 4th June, excluding 31st of May, so there must be something special about it!

 

[466.networkers]

Off Peak and Anytime fares are now available for the outward journey, no sign of Advance fares yet. Are these likely to be released soon?

 

[D6700]

East Coast are currently advising bookings are available up to the 4th June, excluding 31st of May, so there must be something special about it!

I'm reliably informed that NR timetable planners are using new software from the commencement of the summer timetable that isn't yet fit for purpose :-x

Apparently, one effect was that almost every altered train was initially shown as cancelled!

After hearing this, I viewed a trains line up for East Coast services at York on Monday 31 May and found there were none between around 07:45 and 10:30!!!

This now appears to have been corrected, but given the many thousands of alterations up and down the country on that day (e.g. some operators running a Saturday service), I wonder if they are still checking the integrity of the data?

Must be a painful task!

 

[yorkie]

D6700, thanks for the insight... and welcome to the forum

 

[466.networkers]

There are now trains, just no Advance (read: cheap) fares!
The cheapest I've found a fare from SSS - BHM with a YP Railcard is £37.55 - the same journey on the 1st June is £7.25.

How can the same journey be more expensive on a Bank Holiday?

PS Only me going now ...

 

[yorkie]

There are now trains, just no Advance (read: cheap) fares!
The cheapest I've found a fare from SSS - BHM with a YP Railcard is £37.55 - the same journey on the 1st June is £7.25.

How can the same journey be more expensive on a Bank Holiday?

PS Only me going now ...

Either AP tickets are not yet released, or they feel that demand is likely to be high. Probably the former.

The higher price ticket you quote is walk on and "same journey" price you quote is an AP ticket. Same journey, yes, but completely different products.

 

[466.networkers]

I know this is going to sound crazy, so bear with me ....

I've decided to travel up on the 1st June, it's too expensive to go on the 31st May ...

I'm trying to find some prices for London Midland services between EUS and BHM but all I can find are VTWC only Advance tickets - if I want to travel on a Desiro rather than a Pendolino do I have to pay £30 more for the privilege? (I know I'll end up on a Pendo, I don't mind them, I'm merely asking for the cheapest LM tickets ...)

Thanks in advance.

 

[yorkie]

Your best bet is to use Avantix Traveller NFM05 to find the fares. ATOC do not like this because they would rather not allow you to easily find the fares. Therefore it is morally right for you to use it in my opinion. Given that most people into fares seem to have it these days, I would say there is a strong possibility that someone reading this sees your plight and supplies you with a copy...

The LM only return fares (non-discounted) London Terminals - Birmingham Stns are:

£17.00 OPR Super Off Peak (restriction LK)
£25.00 CDR Off Peak Day (restriction SK)
£29.00 SVR Off Peak (restriction SK)
£65.00 SOR Anytime

Restriction : LK
MONDAYS to FRIDAYS:

Not valid for travel on London
Midland services timed to
ARRIVE London Terminals before
1300.

Not valid for travel on
northbound London Midland
services timed to DEPART
London Terminals or any other
station, before 1030.

Not valid for travel on London
Midland services timed to
DEPART any station between
1630 and 1930 in either
direction (except for the 1829
London Euston to Crewe service
) unless a connecting
service is being used to
complete a journey begun at a
valid time.

Break of journey is not
permitted except to change
trains at an intermediate
station or to access station
facilities.

SATURDAYS, SUNDAYS and BANK
HOLIDAYS:
By any London Midland train.

Break of journey is not
permitted except to change
trains at an intermediate
station or to access station
facilities.
SSS/SSR/OPS/OPR/SOP
SUPER OFF-PEAK

Ticket Code: OPS/SSS
Ticket Class: STANDARD
Ticket Name: SUPER OFF-PEAK
Single/Return: SINGLE
Out Validity:-
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey: YES
Pre-Booking Requirement: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Child Discount: YES
Railcard Discount: YES
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket Code: SOP/OPR/SSR
Ticket Class: STANDARD
Ticket Name: SUPER OFF-PEAK
Single/Return: RETURN
Out Validity:-
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Rtn Validity:-
Day - WITHIN ONE
______________ CALENDAR MONTH
Break of Jrny: (OUT) YES
(RTN) YES
Pre-Booking Requirement: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Child Discount: YES
Railcard Discount: YES
Refunds: See 'Refunds' Section

Group discounts SSS/SSR YES
______________SOP/OPS/OPR___NO

Outward/Single/Return Travel
Available any day.

Time restrictions are
indicated by a restriction
shown against the ticket's
validity code.

Restriction : SK
Mondays to Fridays

Valid on any London Midland
service scheduled to arrive
London Midland terminals at or
after 1000

Not valid for travel on
northbound London Midland
services timed to depart
London Terminals before 0845
or on any northbound London
Midland service timed to
depart any other station
before 0845.
Break of journey is not
permitted except to change
trains at an intermediate
station or to access station
facilities.

Saturdays, Sundays and Bank
Holidays

By any London Midland service.

Break of journey is not
permitted except to change
trains at an intermediate
station or to access station
facilities.
CDS/CDR/FCR/GE1/SVH/1DR/1DT/
FCD OFF-PEAK DAY

ODT/OTF OFF-PEAK DAY
TRAVELCARD

GR3/GR4 GROUPSAVE DAY

FTC FAMILY TRAVELCARD

Ticket Name: Off-Peak Day
Code - CDS/SVH
Class - STANDARD
Single/Return - SINGLE
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
(SEE NOTE 1)
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey: YES
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - YES
Group - YES
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket Name: Off-Peak Day
Code - CDR/1DR/1DT
Class - STANDARD
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
(SEE NOTE 1)
Time - SEE BELOW
Return Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - YES
Group - YES
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket: Off-Peak Day
Travelcard
Code - ODT
Class - STANDARD
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
(For Day/Time see Note 1)
Return Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
(see Note 1)
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
(see Note 5)
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - YES
Group - NO
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket:______Family Travelcard
Code - FTC
Class - STANDARD
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
(For Day/Time see Note 1)
Return Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
(see Note 1)
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
(see Note 1)
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - NO
Group - NO
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket: Off-Peak Day
Code - FCR/GE1/FCD
Class - FIRST
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
(see Note 1)
Time - SEE BELOW
Return Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - YES
Group - YES
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket: Off-Peak Day
Travelcard
Code - OTF
Class - FIRST
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
For Day/Time see Note 1)
Return Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
(see Note 1)
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - YES
Railcard - YES
Group - NO
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

Ticket: GroupSave Day
Code - GR3/GR4
Class - STANDARD
Single/Return - RETURN
Outward Validity:
Day - DATE ON TICKET
(see Note 1)
Time - SEE BELOW
Break of Journey:
Out/Rtn - YES
(see Note 5)
Pre-Booking Req: NONE
Reservations Compulsory: NO
Discounts:
Child - NO
Railcard - NO
Group - NO
Refunds: See 'Refunds' section

 

[466.networkers]

Hmmm - Avantix says £19.10 as the cheapest Any Permitted ticket ....

I think I'll stick to paying £7.25.

Thanks for all the help and advice guys.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I've bought my tickets, managed to get Off Peak Singles for £19.10 each way for the 31st May.

I have a small question - as they say "Any Permitted" on them, does that mean I can use them on HS1?
I'm meant to use HS1 on the Outward journey but SET Classic service from Victoria on the Return.

Thanks
Ryan

 

[yorkie]

I've bought my tickets, managed to get Off Peak Singles for £19.10 each way for the 31st May.

Yes, that's a Virgin thing to make them half the Off Peak Return. They are normally only 10p less! In this case, these Singles are not available singly. (See previous posts for my views on that! )

I have a small question - as they say "Any Permitted" on them, does that mean I can use them on HS1?
I'm meant to use HS1 on the Outward journey but SET Classic service from Victoria on the Return.

Any Permitted means exactly that, yes.

You are not 'meant' to take any particular train or route because you have an Off Peak ticket, that is not restricted to any specific train or route (within the Routeing Guide of course!). In the case of these tickets, with your railcard they are valid on any train with the exception of some peak services on WSMR and London Midland on weekdays. There are no restrictions on SET or Virgin or Chiltern with these tickets. Restrictions do not apply on Bank Holiday Monday 31 May or Sunday 6 June when you are travelling anyway. As you bought Off Peak singles you must return on 6 June, had you bought a return (same price) you could have travelled back any time within 1 month. If your plans change and you need to come back a different day then it's a £10 admin fee (unless the booking clerk is feeling generous).

 

[466.networkers]

Thanks for your excellent post Yorkie, as it turns out, I've got an Off Peak Return, so can travel back up to the 30th June (so it says on the ticket anyway!)

Thanks
Ryan

 

[yorkie]

Ah, it must have realised you got off peak singles each way and automatically made it into a return

So you have complete flexibility. Not as cheap as AP but still good value for the distance, and you never know when the flexibility can be useful.

 

[466.networkers]

Another silly question - am I right in thinking that as I have standard Off Peak tickets, and as such no reservations. I don't have to travel on the exact trains I booked the tickets by? Or do I?

Sorry for the n00bish questions, I should know better by now!

Thanks
Ryan

 

[yorkie]

The tickets are valid on any train, yes.

The only restrictions are if you change your plans and return on a normal weekday then you cannot use certain London Midland or WSMR services at 'peak' times.

There are no restrictions on Virgin Trains or on South Eastern Trains whatsoever with those tickets.

 

[tony_mac]

I hope you haven't just stumbled into a delicate situation!.....

PS Only me going now ...

 

[466.networkers]

I hope you haven't just stumbled into a delicate situation!.....

No, my g/f is now my ex ... :roll: