No information at Paddington

[Taunton]

Came out of the tube at Paddington to travel to Windsor via Slough. Passing by the fact that there always seems inadequate TVM provision there, went to look for the first train. There were a couple of screens showing little information, then I chanced upon a "next fast train" one, which showed Slough, 0850, platform 1, in a couple of minutes

Off I go looking for a confirmation, but there was none. Platform 1 does not have barriers, here's a Class 800, passengers in but absolutely anonymous, and platform screens just showing the GWR logo. Jump on, look around. All screens blank inside. No PA before departing (or anywhere on the journey). Now most 800s do not stop at Slough, but doors close and we're off. No indication in the journey anywhere about where the train might be heading. It was a bit of a relief that the brakes went on passing Langley.

I can honestly say I've never been in a train where, apart from that initial "fastest to" sign, it had no indication at all about where it was going. Turns out it was just an outer-suburban to Oxford, not really what I expect off Platform 1. Now I like to think I know my way around a bit better than some, but it's extraordinary that after all the hoopla about the 458 screens not being quite the right size, and all sorts of legislation and expense about passenger information, that I end up in 2019 on my most anonymous train ever.

 

[Grumpy Git]

I think it's completely ridiculous that in 2019, the railway industry cannot publish platform information.

They could do it before it all went private, so why not now? I understand the need to change platform sometimes, but the current state of affairs is crazy. At least the airports have the excuse not to give gate numbers so you stay in the shops/restaurants (even though they won't admit it).

When I'm on a Swiss or German train and the guard checks my ticket, they always tell me which platform I need at whichever station for the next change.

 

[JN114]

Trains are removed from the screens 2 minutes before departure - is it plausible in the few seconds between seeing the “next train to” board and arriving at the platform this had happened? You do say the train was in a couple of minutes. This is a performance measure widely practiced at many, if not all London termini.

 

[Grumpy Git]

Trains are removed from the screens 2 minutes before departure - is it plausible in the few seconds between seeing the “next train to” board and arriving at the platform this had happened? You do say the train was in a couple of minutes. This is a performance measure widely practiced at many, if not all London termini.

I can see the reason this may happen at a large station like Paddington on the MAIN display, but surely the "local" screen on the actual platform can be left displaying the correct information at least until the doors are closed?

 

[nickswift99]

I can see the reason this may happen at a large station like Paddington on the MAIN display, but surely the "local" screen on the actual platform can be left displaying the correct information at least until the doors are closed?

Barriers are shut 1 minute before so passengers should be able to see the display at least until that time - otherwise they can't be sure they're boarding the correct train.

 

[Taunton]

There are no barriers on platform 1 at Paddington. I was able to see the next train to Slough on the board by the ticket office, from where Platform 1 and the train itself are in sight, and a steady stream were still boarding with me. And of course this was only one of the several information sources missing.

 

[Peter C]

here's a Class 800, passengers in but absolutely anonymous, and platform screens just showing the GWR logo. Jump on, look around. All screens blank inside.

From my experience the screens on the sides of the GWR IETs are only good for telling you where a train will call at next and maybe the destination - the whole time aspect on them doesn't work (I've seen trains at noon at Oxford calling at Hanborough, next station down, at 00:00) and sometimes the screens show nothing at all. Strange about the inside screens though.

-Peter

 

[43096]

I can see the reason this may happen at a large station like Paddington on the MAIN display, but surely the "local" screen on the actual platform can be left displaying the correct information at least until the doors are closed?

At Waterloo a train comes off the main departure boards at, I think, 1min before departure, but the boards on the platform only clear once the train goes and triggers the relevant track circuit (i.e. like any other station).

 

[ChrisHogan]

They could do it before it all went private, so why not now?

Platform numbers weren't published on departure posters at Paddington in B.R. days either - certainly not from 1978 when I first worked there.

 

[Horizon22]

I can see the reason this may happen at a large station like Paddington on the MAIN display, but surely the "local" screen on the actual platform can be left displaying the correct information at least until the doors are closed?

Nope all displays could be off from a platform, prevents running and dispatch incidents with people trying to board as the train pulls away. Each terminal often has a slightly different procedure.

That being said you'd expect something on the train PIS.

 

[Horizon22]

At Waterloo a train comes off the main departure boards at, I think, 1min before departure, but the boards on the platform only clear once the train goes and triggers the relevant track circuit (i.e. like any other station).

Not true, a lot of stations can have the local platform display removed at the same time as the main bank of CIS.

 

[northernbelle]

Not true, a lot of stations can have the local platform display removed at the same time as the main bank of CIS.

Indeed - and it's not limited to London termini either. I noticed at Exeter St Davids a couple weeks ago that the trains were disappearing off the main concourse screen a couple minutes before they actually departed.

 

[317362]

Paddington has trains off the main and platform screens at -2 before departure, and also seems to have introduced physical barriers beyond gatelines to really stop you getting on despite the train sitting there. (Not P1 though)

 

[yorkie]

It happens at Marylebone, as I reported recently: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ore-departure-why.194857/page-2#post-4281374#

A few weeks ago I was walking up the platform at Marylebone towards the extreme end of the platform; requiring the front train only, with other trains occupying the platform nearer the buffers. Two minutes prior to departure the screens on the platform went blank. I continued walking as I know what's going on and how train companies behave.

But people behind me got confused and thought the platform may have changed and went back towards the gateline and consulted staff. They then went back up the platform, and only just made it.

 

[AlbertBeale]

What's as bad as departure information disappearing too soon is the same with arrivals information. (Assuming you can find it at all, that is.) I've sometimes met people at Kings Cross, got there just before the scheduled arrival time, looked at the arrivals board, and found the train wasn't shown. Turns out that the train was a few minutes early, and the instant it was running into the platform it had been taken off the arrivals board. Result, friend thinking I wasn't there and trying to find an appropriate place to wait (and, of course, given the crazy KX layout, being sent out into rain in front of the station before finding their way back round to the concourse which is only easily accessible for people departing...), meanwhile I'm running backwards and forwards across the front of the platforms asking people who've just got off various trains where they've come from, to see if I can find the right platform. Why on earth can't a train's arrival platform (and information about when it actually arrived, if it already has) be left on the arrivals board until at least a few minutes after the scheduled arrival time?

 

[Grumpy Git]

Thought I was just stupid when I used Kings Cross for the first time a few weeks ago until I read your post AB. The layout and signage at KX really is shocking.

 

[Oxfordblues]

My little trick en-route to Paddington is to check with realtimetrains for trains stopping at SLO then consult opentraintimes for the platform number at PAD. There's often a crowd waiting in front of the information screens while their train is shown as "preparing" and you can get onto the platform ahead of them all!

 

[Metal_gee_man]

Thought I was just stupid when I used Kings Cross for the first time a few weeks ago until I read your post AB. The layout and signage at KX really is shocking.

Please tell me I'm not the only one that uses the lifts at KGX up to the overbridge, through the barriers down the escalators and come out into the main concourse because it's a quicker interchange to STP than walking the platform length out the exit, and then walking all the way back to STP?

 

[LowLevel]

GWR went out of their way to force having the only Intercity standard trains (perhaps up for debate in the form of the IET) in the entire country with all the onboard stuff to go wrong and trickery that entails that are DOO-P on the Oxford fasts (and when they get the cameras to work properly they'll run to Bedwyn in that mode too) so if the auto passenger info system is on the blink you'll likely end up with nothing.

 

[jimm]

GWR went out of their way to force having the only Intercity standard trains (perhaps up for debate in the form of the IET) in the entire country with all the onboard stuff to go wrong and trickery that entails that are DOO-P on the Oxford fasts (and when they get the cameras to work properly they'll run to Bedwyn in that mode too) so if the auto passenger info system is on the blink you'll likely end up with nothing.

No - driver-only operation equipment is part of the standard equipment for all Class 80x trains and was required by the Department for Transport - see Page 20 of the IEP technical specification here https://assets.publishing.service.g...s/attachment_data/file/82840/tts-redacted.pdf

A DOO agreement for Paddington to Oxford and Bedwyn services since the start of the full Turbo service in the Thames Valley in 1993 - nothing new/different about it at all.

 

[LowLevel]

No - driver-only operation equipment is part of the standard equipment for all Class 80x trains and was required by the Department for Transport - see Page 20 of the IEP technical specification here https://assets.publishing.service.g...s/attachment_data/file/82840/tts-redacted.pdf

A DOO agreement for Paddington to Oxford and Bedwyn services since the start of the full Turbo service in the Thames Valley in 1993 - nothing new/different about it at all.

I believe you've misunderstood what I've said.

GWR are the only operator of the IET 80x train to insist on using it in DOO-P mode. Consequently they've gone from having fairly simple 16x Turbo trains on the route (though I did catch one of those the other day - toilet door had had a moment and isolated itself half open as they're prone to do, no one to tell about it/reset it - unhelpful) to having the only full Intercity spec stock in the country that actually runs without a train manager on board looking after it.

I believe VTEC proposed DCO at one stage with the driver controlling the doors but no other operator has suggested them running with just a driver and possibly a Rail Gourmet host on board.

By design they're not a simple train and personally I'd find it very confusing to board an express out of Paddington and be confronted by the same train but without any on board crew just because it happens to terminate at Oxford rather than carry on to Worcester

 

[irish_rail]

Not to mention quite often the TM has to go back and restart engines on the move , so another reason it's all gone a bit quiet on IET DOO

 

[coppercapped]

Not to mention quite often the TM has to go back and restart engines on the move , so another reason it's all gone a bit quiet on IET DOO

I'm afraid you'll have to explain that a bit more. What does the Train Manager have to do with the engines?

 

[hwl]

I'm afraid you'll have to explain that a bit more. What does the Train Manager have to do with the engines?

Especially as mostly on electric in the DOO area.
Quite often they are stuck behind something else on Didcot-Oxford so not much need for all engines working there!

 

[cactustwirly]

I believe you've misunderstood what I've said.

GWR are the only operator of the IET 80x train to insist on using it in DOO-P mode. Consequently they've gone from having fairly simple 16x Turbo trains on the route (though I did catch one of those the other day - toilet door had had a moment and isolated itself half open as they're prone to do, no one to tell about it/reset it - unhelpful) to having the only full Intercity spec stock in the country that actually runs without a train manager on board looking after it.

I believe VTEC proposed DCO at one stage with the driver controlling the doors but no other operator has suggested them running with just a driver and possibly a Rail Gourmet host on board.

By design they're not a simple train and personally I'd find it very confusing to board an express out of Paddington and be confronted by the same train but without any on board crew just because it happens to terminate at Oxford rather than carry on to Worcester

That's because they replaced DOO Turbos, I don't see what the issue is.
I believe there's a few Cotswold services that run DOO to Oxford, and then pick up a guard there.

 

[irish_rail]

I'm afraid you'll have to explain that a bit more. What does the Train Manager have to do with the engines?

If an engine shuts down, authorisation can be given from Hitachi for the TM to go to the affected vehicle to manually reset it from the cupboard at end of coach whilst on the move . Has been a godsend lately!

 

[yorkie]

If anyone has any points to add regarding the information provision (or lack of) at Paddington, please contact us with the details and we'll consider re-opening the thread.