Northern Class 195: Construction/Introduction Updates

[Harvey B]

It's certainly possible, if you're willing to stretch your "distant future" a little further.

The 195s are 15 years younger than the 185s, 15-20 years younger than the 170s, and younger still than all the Sprinters, so they will probably remain in service after they're all gone. (The 150s at least will probably be replaced in the next franchise.)

The question then will be "what else would suit the line"? Assuming that electrification doesn't reach this line, it'll be a choice between the 195s and any future diesel/bi-mode unit that hasn't been built yet.

But to see them on the Settle-Carlisle in a year's time? I don't think that's in the current franchise's plan at all.

Thanks
I just gave those dates as examples. I myself see 195s on that line being a likely possibility at the end of the franchise, I myself don't really see it happening next year either

 

[Harvey B]

Well it's Northern Rail so it's actually a surprise when they acctually do things earlier than people expect

Mind you I wouldn't be surprised if Northern turned around and said that there was yet another delay to these units entering service.

I also wonder how long it will be before Northern pulls this joke on people (again)

In all seriousness I wasn't expecting them to enter service until the middle of July at the earliest

 

[Roose]

Remember when the franchise was awarded, Barrow was a Labour marginal. Now wonder why the unsuited (in comparison to refurbished 170s) but new trains are on the Connect services...

Ask the passengers on Monday if they think that they are unsuitable.

 

[Mathew S]

Ask the passengers on Monday if they think that they are unsuitable.

Indeed. Air conditioning, WiFi, charging points... for the overwhelming majority the 195s are going to represent a massive upgrade. At this point, it's not really faster trains that matter to a lot of people - as long as they can keep to the timetable then by definition they're fast enough. It's the upgrade in quality that matters. Remember that, to myself and a lot of other passengers who will be using these new trains, Class 156s represent the current luxury option.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Indeed. Air conditioning, WiFi, charging points... for the overwhelming majority the 195s are going to represent a massive upgrade. At this point, it's not really faster trains that matter to a lot of people - as long as they can keep to the timetable then by definition they're fast enough. It's the upgrade in quality that matters. Remember that, to myself and a lot of other passengers who will be using these new trains, Class 156s represent the current luxury option.

It's not so much that they are unsuitable for NorthWest Express, it's more that they are better suited to other things and Northern have units which could be fitted with equivalent interiors (as indeed some of the 158s are) and used instead.

 

[Greybeard33]

It's not so much that they are unsuitable for NorthWest Express, it's more that they are better suited to other things and Northern have units which could be fitted with equivalent interiors (as indeed some of the 158s are) and used instead.

195s are 100mph units, whereas 158s are limited to 90. That extra 10mph matters for paths on the WCML.

 

[Bletchleyite]

195s are 100mph units, whereas 158s are limited to 90. That extra 10mph matters for paths on the WCML.

Not massively (or at least not pre-HS2) as those services are run using 158s now. The north WCML isn't full or anywhere near it (they wouldn't be able to shuffle 75mph Pacers up and down between Lancaster and Carnforth if it was) - it's not like south of MKC!

 

[Mathew S]

Not massively (or at least not pre-HS2) as those services are run using 158s now. The north WCML isn't full or anywhere near it (they wouldn't be able to shuffle 75mph Pacers up and down between Lancaster and Carnforth if it was) - it's not like south of MKC!

The paths are dire, and the current 158-run services are causing delays to VTWC services in the Golborne/Wigan area. Golborne to Preston is a really congested stretch of railway, and only going to get more so when the new open access services start. Preston - Lancaster isn't much better.

To be honest, the biggest difference the 195s will make in terms of timekeeping will be reduced dwell times. 158s are painfully slow to load/unload a trainfull of commuters. 195s have wide doors at thirds, straight into the carriage, for these busy routes, that'll be a huge improvement.

 

[Greybeard33]

The paths are dire, and the current 158-run services are causing delays to VTWC services in the Golborne/Wigan area. Golborne to Preston is a really congested stretch of railway, and only going to get more so when the new open access services start. Preston - Lancaster isn't much better.

To be honest, the biggest difference the 195s will make in terms of timekeeping will be reduced dwell times. 158s are painfully slow to load/unload a trainfull of commuters. 195s have wide doors at thirds, straight into the carriage, for these busy routes, that'll be a huge improvement.

Indeed, the WCML north of Preston is a congested two track line. Northern was only allowed to keep using 185s for so long because there was no alternative 100mph stock available. And the 158s are currently only operating two thirds of the required hourly service between the Airport and Lancaster, with a substitute 319 shuttle between the Airport and Preston in the third hour.

 

[Mathew S]

It would very sadly appear that one of the new trains, running as 5Z41 from Blackpool to Springs Branch this morning has been involved in a fatality between Preston and Wigan. Thoughts with all of those involved.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would very sadly appear that one of the new trains, running as 5Z41 from Blackpool to Springs branch this morning has been involved in a fatality between Preston and Wigan. Thoughts with all of those involved.

Now that's seriously bad luck

 

[Mathew S]

Now that's seriously bad luck

Indeed. The unit in question moved south through Wigan a few minutes ago, reversed at Springs Branch, and is now heading back north, so hopefully it's not too badly scarred.

 

[Spartacus]

'Involved' as in caught up with, seems the incident happened before it was booked through.

 

[Mathew S]

'Involved' as in caught up with, seems the incident happened before it was booked through.

Hmm, apologies if that's the case. I shall have to have words with my (usually very reliable) source.

 

[507021]

195116 has been named "Proud To Be Northern".

 

[anamyd]

195116 has been named "Proud To Be Northern".

doesn't a 331 also have that same name, simultaneously...?

 

[507021]

doesn't a 331 also have that same name, simultaneously...?

It does indeed.

 

[Mathew S]

195116 has been named "Proud To Be Northern".

This might sound like a silly question, but are they actually, formally named that, or do they just have it written on the side?

 

[J-2739]

Written on the side probably Saw a recent video of them.

 

[507021]

This might sound like a silly question, but are they actually, formally named that, or do they just have it written on the side?

They are yes.

 

[Andyh82]

This might sound like a silly question, but are they actually, formally named that, or do they just have it written on the side?

They are written on the side in the style of a name plate that was unveiled in a presentation, so it’s probably enough to be classed as a name.

 

[driver_m]

195 122 is being put together on Edge Hill.

 

[Bertie the bus]

They are written on the side in the style of a name plate that was unveiled in a presentation, so it’s probably enough to be classed as a name.

It is a name. The Northern press release states it was officially named.

For anybody interested, and who might want to get their face in the local rag, there is another event at Barrow on Monday.

Waving off the 10:46 departure.
https://media.northernrailway.co.uk/news/northern-new-train-event-in-barrow

A short ceremony will start at 10:30am with speeches by Chris Jackson, Regional Director and Tim Owen, chair of the Furness Line Community Rai Partnership. This will followed by a wave off of the 10:46 Barrow to Manchester Airport.

 

[Harvey B]

Can't remember If I posted this already but are the PIS screens on the 195s/331s just the TV screens or are there any actual displays like the ones in Northern's already compliant stock (The Class 158s for example)

 

[samuelmorris]

Can't remember If I posted this already but are the PIS screens on the 195s/331s just the TV screens or are there any actual displays like the ones in Northern's already compliant stock (The Class 158s for example)

'Actual' displays? What's the difference?

 

[Harvey B]

'Actual' displays? What's the difference?

The overhead displays like the ones seen on Northern's refurbished units. I count this to be either the dot matrix displays or the LED screens (As seen on some of the refurbished 158s and 144012). Should have really included that to be honest, Thanks for asking

 

[samuelmorris]

I'm not sure, I imagine it depends if they can be put in the doorways or not. A display that isn't above head height just at the vehicle ends probably isn't sufficient as you wouldn't be able to see it clearly when seated.

 

[Harvey B]

I'm not sure, I imagine it depends if they can be put in the doorways or not. A display that isn't above head height just at the vehicle ends probably isn't sufficient as you wouldn't be able to see it clearly when seated.

Thanks, I'm surprised that they don't have overhead displays like the rest of their fleet.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Was hoping for something like the Thameslink PIS on 700s, or in some of TPE's refurbed 185s.
ie something better than a scrolling one-liner.
(eg showing stopping pattern, real time updates, connection times etc).
No doubt we'll soon find out.

 

[GrimShady]

How modular are the 195s construction wise? Can they be converted to 331 in the future?

I'm of the opinion they should be able to work in multiple with each other or at least have the ability to insert a motor coach with pantograph into the formation.