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Northern Class 195: Construction/Introduction Updates

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Jamesrob637

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Someone has kindly reminded me that there was an order/gifting for three extra 195s not three extra 331s. So it'll be these which aren't yet built/in service while all the "current" order should be delivered soon if not already.
 

Geeves

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The three extra 195s aren't a gift they are in place of the wires going up to Windermere. They are still being paid for.

If they wanted to gift anything it would be useful for extra intermediate cars on the 2 car units
 

Jamesrob637

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The three extra 195s aren't a gift they are in place of the wires going up to Windermere. They are still being paid for.

If they wanted to gift anything it would be useful for extra intermediate cars on the 2 car units

Apparently the 331s are obtaining intermediate cars so watch this space!
 

superkev

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195 130 looking very new just passed through Sowerby Bridge heading for Leeds. Diddnt see a single passenger on it.
Of the 3 cars just 131, 132, 133 left, wherever they are at the moment, to complete order.
K
 

setdown

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Current situation aside, I’d be much more likely to get the train into Manchester than drive, if I knew there was a chance of travelling on a 195, rather than it being the awful 15x trains exclusively. Is it possible that 195s will end up doing (even occasional) passenger service on the mid-Cheshire line?
 

Jamesrob637

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Current situation aside, I’d be much more likely to get the train into Manchester than drive, if I knew there was a chance of travelling on a 195, rather than it being the awful 15x trains exclusively. Is it possible that 195s will end up doing (even occasional) passenger service on the mid-Cheshire line?

This might go hand in hand with the since-2017-promised increased frequency!
 

Chorley Cake

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For anyone looking to see the 19502x range... 020-Huddersfield (today), 022-Huddersfield (today), 023-Doncaster (end of May), 025-Newton Heath (7th June). Not sure about 021 & 024 ?
 

northernchris

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For anyone looking to see the 19502x range... 020-Huddersfield (today), 022-Huddersfield (today), 023-Doncaster (end of May), 025-Newton Heath (7th June). Not sure about 021 & 024 ?

I've seen 195024 in service recently, and 025 was out yesterday. Seem to recall 021 was involved in a low speed derailment so could be away for repair.
 

Mathew S

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3 x 331 intermediate cars with batteries, to serve Windermere. Don't know where the 195s will go instead.
It'll be an entertaining little connundrum for the planners, because of the knock-on impacts on Barrow, and Cumbrian Coast, services. Logically, it'll mean that the Windermere - Aiport runs will have to be return journeys by the same unit, as opposed to the opposite working being to/from Barrow as is the case at the moment. That, in turn, will affect the 'missing' hours in the Barrow - Airport/Airport - Barrow services which further will knock on to which services operate through from Carlisle to Lancaster via the Cumbrian Coast (and vice versa).
None of it is insurmountable, but it's going to be a right little mess for someone to untangle.
 

_toommm_

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It'll be an entertaining little connundrum for the planners, because of the knock-on impacts on Barrow, and Cumbrian Coast, services. Logically, it'll mean that the Windermere - Aiport runs will have to be return journeys by the same unit, as opposed to the opposite working being to/from Barrow as is the case at the moment. That, in turn, will affect the 'missing' hours in the Barrow - Airport/Airport - Barrow services which further will knock on to which services operate through from Carlisle to Lancaster via the Cumbrian Coast (and vice versa).
None of it is insurmountable, but it's going to be a right little mess for someone to untangle.

They could possibly terminate them at Piccadilly as there’s already lots of services normally to the Airport, and shove the unit into Longsight Excursion Platforms or into Mayfield Loop whilst they wait for their booked slot north.

Currently, there’s arrivals at Piccadilly from Windermere at:
10:57, 12:47, 13:47, 16:48, 18:54 and 20:58

Departures back to Windermere from Piccadilly at:
08:48, 10:47, 12:47, 14:47, 16:54

It would be a long wait at some times of the day, but it would mean that the battery 331s wouldn’t block the platform at the Airport. Alternatively, they could run through to Wilmslow via Styal, utilising the turnback sidings there.
 

Mathew S

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They could possibly terminate them at Piccadilly as there’s already lots of services normally to the Airport, and shove the unit into Longsight Excursion Platforms or into Mayfield Loop whilst they wait for their booked slot north.

Currently, there’s arrivals at Piccadilly from Windermere at:
10:57, 12:47, 13:47, 16:48, 18:54 and 20:58

Departures back to Windermere from Piccadilly at:
08:48, 10:47, 12:47, 14:47, 16:54

It would be a long wait at some times of the day, but it would mean that the battery 331s wouldn’t block the platform at the Airport. Alternatively, they could run through to Wilmslow via Styal, utilising the turnback sidings there.
I don't think they'll want to break the direct link to the airport, to be honest. Rightly or wrongly, it's seen as important for Windermere to have services to/from the airport for tourism.
 

_toommm_

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I don't think they'll want to break the direct link to the airport, to be honest. Rightly or wrongly, it's seen as important for Windermere to have services to/from the airport for tourism.

True - there is an inane obsession to linking everything to the Airport. The other alternative could be the Wilmslow Down Reversing Siding, which IIRC takes 5 coaches??
 

Greybeard33

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It'll be an entertaining little connundrum for the planners, because of the knock-on impacts on Barrow, and Cumbrian Coast, services. Logically, it'll mean that the Windermere - Aiport runs will have to be return journeys by the same unit, as opposed to the opposite working being to/from Barrow as is the case at the moment. That, in turn, will affect the 'missing' hours in the Barrow - Airport/Airport - Barrow services which further will knock on to which services operate through from Carlisle to Lancaster via the Cumbrian Coast (and vice versa).
None of it is insurmountable, but it's going to be a right little mess for someone to untangle.
As I posted a few months ago in the 331 thread:
The Windermere services currently interwork with the Barrow services at Manchester Airport. In order to disentangle the diagrams, I think the Windermere - Airport service frequency would have to change from the current 1tp3h to 1tp2h (the round trip time is 5 hours, less an hour's overlap between Oxenholme and Windermere). This would mean that the frequency of direct Airport - Barrow services would also have to change to an even 1tp2h, so further reducing DMUs under the wires between Lancaster and the Airport.

The 331 diagrams would then make two successive return trips Oxenholme - Windermere before returning to the Airport.
 

Mathew S

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As I posted a few months ago in the 331 thread:
A more even split Barrow/Windermere would make sense, especially in tourist season. A potential stumbling block may be availability of 156s to run the Barrow - Lancaster services which operate in the hours when there's no Barrow - Airport. Though, perhaps that's a use to which one of the now free 195s could be put.

At the end of the day, it's all going to depend on what happens with the timetable post-COVID, and once whatever changes end up taking place in/around Manchester are brought in. Things could look very different.
 

Bletchleyite

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True - there is an inane obsession to linking everything to the Airport. The other alternative could be the Wilmslow Down Reversing Siding, which IIRC takes 5 coaches??

Being as how that service is heavily used by tourists (quite a lot of e.g. Japanese ones are quite obvious, I guess Europeans wouldn't stand out but may also be there!), I can't think of one that makes more sense being linked to the Airport!

You couldn't do a shuttle with those units unless you had two of them. They will need the time running under the wires to charge up.
 
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