Northern emergency timetable

[stan claire]

Not sure if this has already been posted (can’t find it anywhere) but amidst the absolute carnage caused by Northern’s sunday workings an emergency timetable is being implemented from the 22nd of December until further notice in the west and until the 29th in the east

Timetables and disruption

Northern | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

www.northernrailway.co.uk

Amended Timetable - From 22 December 2024​

Sundays in the West

From Sunday, 22nd December, Northern plans to introduce an amended timetable in the North West due to conductor availability. This timetable is designed to provide more certainty about the services that will run and reduce short-notice cancellations.



Sundays in the East & North East

A short-term timetable is planned for Sunday, 22nd December, and Sunday, 29th December (ONLY), due to train crew availability and engineering works. This timetable aims to give passengers more certainty about services and minimise last-minute cancellations.

 

[3RDGEN]

Long overdue, lets see what the service levels are when published.

 

[Tractor37]

The East is only on the two Sundays 22/12 and 29/12 to cover for engineering work. Not the entire week!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Long overdue, lets see what the service levels are when published.

It's published now, on the normal timetable PDF pages. It's not as swingeing as I expected to be honest (there don't seem to be many routes bustituted, and there are none with nothing at all, plus it's near enough a full operating day and not the early finish I expected), I hope it's enough as cancellations on two-hourly services will be bad.

 

[NorthWestRover]

I'm not sure it is published. Those timetables are dated from 15th December and include, at least on the Wigan to Manchester service, the currently undeliverable Sunday timetable. It would not be surprising if Northern have published the "standard" new timetable and will then publish an amended one after this weekend. Basket case as I've said previously.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm not sure it is published. Those timetables are dated from 15th December and include, at least on the Wigan to Manchester service, the currently undeliverable Sunday timetable. It would not be surprising if Northern have published the "standard" new timetable and will then publish an amended one after this weekend. Basket case as I've said previously.

No, it is published. When you go onto the timetables page:

Train Timetables

Northern | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

www.northernrailway.co.uk

...expand the route you are interested in and scroll to the bottom. There will be one called "Service Alterations - <route name>" dated Sunday 22nd December. It's that one. It's missing for some of the summary timetables that aggregate other routes. It will obviously be missing for routes that have no Sunday service anyway.

As it's only dated for 22nd I don't doubt they might refine it a bit based on what works on that day (that and 29th are likely to have the lowest level of volunteers I'd think).

 

[NorthWestRover]

Thanks and what a stupid way other do it! About six different versions of the timetable lol.

Every two hours Wigan to Manchester. If that is guaranteed (pretty much) service, then it's usable.

 

[tumbledown]

Should these changes be showing up on Real Time Trains as CAN? None currentl for Wigan on the 22nd.
Conversely, Chester-Leeds are shown there as starting short at Man Vic, but no timetable posted on the Northern site yet.

 

[BPN2022]

Is it in real time trains? And does it effect every working day in the west?

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Is it in real time trains? And does it effect every working day in the west?

Just Sundays, not yet in Realtime trains

 

[bengley]

Thanks and what a stupid way other do it! About six different versions of the timetable lol.

Every two hours Wigan to Manchester. If that is guaranteed (pretty much) service, then it's usable.

A bus every two hours is not useable on what is in effect a metro service.

Completely useless.

 

[NorthWestRover]

It's a train. It's Sunday. It's an emergency timetable. It's not ideal. It's usable if you plan.

For the last few weeks, we've had one every three hours (if you're lucky). And not knowing what would run. If this brings some stability, it's an improvement.

There is a replacement bus to Bolton too with connections there to Manchester.

 

[3RDGEN]

In April Labour issued their "Getting Britain Moving" document; "https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/up...ING-Labours-Plan-to-Fix-Britains-Railways.pdf".

On page 15 it states,

"Unblocking barriers to delivery – the Secretary of State will direct the newly appointed leadership of Great British Railways to pull together an expert team to address key priorities.

Operations – a resource-led, viable timetable will be devised, agreed with the Secretary of State, and implemented at speed to tackle train crew management, timetabling, and service delivery issues. Existing private operators will need to be held strictly to account against contractual performance criteria to ensure that they do not allow services to deteriorate in advance of their contracts expiring.

That approach appears to be what has been applied on Northern (west side), identifying your resources then publishing a workable timetable around them appears to be good idea, if it's delivered.

 

[A S Leib]

At least Northern have made it clear that there's ticket acceptance if there's no Northern service within an hour.

 

[Iskra]

At least Northern have made it clear that there's ticket acceptance if there's no Northern service within an hour.

Can you provide a link to that please?

 

[AndrewE]

Can you provide a link to that please?

especially as it depends entirely on other TOCs to tell all their staff and then to honour it...

 

[A S Leib]

Can you provide a link to that please?

Under ticket acceptance in the link in post 1.

On Sundays: If no other Northern train departs on your route within an hour of the scheduled time you will be able to use your train ticket, at no extra cost, with the following train companies and routes:

Not sure if this has already been posted (can’t find it anywhere) but amidst the absolute carnage caused by Northern’s sunday workings an emergency timetable is being implemented from the 22nd of December until further notice in the west and until the 29th in the east

Timetables and disruption

Northern | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

www.northernrailway.co.uk

 

[tumbledown]

within an hour of the scheduled time
Is that the original schedule or the emergency schedule, do we think?

 

[Kite159]

And have they removed the cheaper advance tickets from sale for those routes they know they won't be running any (or very few) trains?

 

[Southern Beau]

No, it is published. When you go onto the timetables page:

Train Timetables

Northern | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

www.northernrailway.co.uk

...expand the route you are interested in and scroll to the bottom. There will be one called "Service Alterations - <route name>" dated Sunday 22nd December. It's that one. It's missing for some of the summary timetables that aggregate other routes. It will obviously be missing for routes that have no Sunday service anyway.

As it's only dated for 22nd I don't doubt they might refine it a bit based on what works on that day (that and 29th are likely to have the lowest level of volunteers I'd think).

Can you see anything for the Preston to Blackpool south line. I’m not seeing any service alteration mention so wondered if it’s been totally scrapped.

we’ve had buses for the last 4-5 sundays

 

[jawr256]

Can you see anything for the Preston to Blackpool south line. I’m not seeing any service alteration mention so wondered if it’s been totally scrapped.

we’ve had buses for the last 4-5 sundays

The Blackpool South timings are in the N9 section of the timetable page (York, Leeds and Colne to Preston and Blackpool) - see the version dated Sunday 22nd December
https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/s...es/N9/2024-12-22-to-2024-12-22-1733308271.pdf

This shows a train every two hours to Blackpool South.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Having seen the calamity this weekend (which was largely not weather related) I question if this timetable is pared back enough. In particular I would avoid planning any travel on Northern on 22nd December - I'd be amazed were they operating anything let alone what is publicised here.

It might be workable in mid January, but I doubt it will be for the 22nd, 29th or 5th Jan.

 

[sandpiper]

And to think it could all be avoided by offering the conductors an attractive Sunday overtime rate!

 

[185]

And to think it could all be avoided by offering the conductors an attractive Sunday overtime rate!

An attractive rate was offered... But the management couldn't help themselves, and attached strings to it.

DaFTO need to review the toxic relationship inherited from Arriva Rail Northern, and really clear the problems out this time.

 

[Mag_seven]

Please confine discussion here to the actual emergency timetable. For discussion about the (rejected) offer please use this thread:

Deal proposed for Northern Conductors in the North West regarding Sunday working

Can't find the original thread so.... RMT and Northern have agreed that guards will now get paid £400 for working Sundays. Subject to referendum...there are some changes to terms and conditions. No doubt someone more techy than me will post the link to that news

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[CHAPS2034]

Having seen the calamity this weekend (which was largely not weather related) I question if this timetable is pared back enough. In particular I would avoid planning any travel on Northern on 22nd December - I'd be amazed were they operating anything let alone what is publicised here.

The emergency timetable on Sundays doesn't come in until NEXT Sunday. Yet the Manchester - Stockport - Crewe service has been binned completely for tomorrow -15th. No RRBs as far as I can see. Absolutely shambolic. What with the current toxic relations and the Manchester derby, I suppose this was inevitable.

Under the emergency timetable next Sunday there is supposed to be one every 2 hours...I'm not holding my breath.

The emergency timetable on Sundays doesn't come in until NEXT Sunday. Yet the Manchester - Stockport - Crewe service has been binned completely for tomorrow -15th. No RRBs as far as I can see. Absolutely shambolic. What with the current toxic relations and the Manchester derby, I suppose this was inevitable.

Under the emergency timetable next Sunday there is supposed to be one every 2 hours...I'm not holding my breath.

Update - 12 routes not running tomorrow but some have RRBs

Routes with RRBs

• Manchester Piccadilly and Stoke-on-Trent - Buses will run between Stockport and Stoke-on-Trent
• Manchester Piccadilly and Crewe - Buses will run between Stockport and Crewe
• Manchester Piccadilly and Chester via Altrincham - Buses will run between Stockport and Chester
• Blackpool South and Preston - Buses will replace trains between these stations
• Preston and Colne - Buses will replace trains between these stations
• Blackburn and Clitheroe - Buses will replace trains between these stations
• Lancaster and Morecambe / Heysham - Buses will replace trains between these stations
• Lancaster and Windermere - Buses will replace trains between these stations
• Liverpool Lime Street and Blackpool North - Buses will replace trains between these stations

No RRBs

• Wigan North Western and Stalybridge
• Manchester Victoria and Southport
• Manchester Victoria and Chester

Northern said that the buses will not run as frequently as the train service.

In addition, a reduced service will run on following routes

• Manchester Airport and Blackpool North
• Manchester Airport and Barrow-in-Furness
• Manchester Piccadilly and Sheffield
• Manchester Piccadilly and Hadfield
• Manchester Piccadilly and Buxton
• Manchester Victoria and Blackburn via Todmorden and Bolton
• Liverpool Lime Street and Wilmslow
• Liverpool Lime Street and Manchester Oxford Road via Warrington Central

Information via the Manchester Evening News. A rehearsal for the next few weeks no doubt.

 

[BPN2022]

The worst service I have ever seen out of Blackpool today.

 

[DaveB10780]

I was just looking at Manchester to Sheffield Northern services today which are much reduced as expected. What I find most confusing is why, despite the zillions of trains not running, RTT only has this as a 3 car 195 set. I suppose RTT may be incorrect.

 

[Killingworth]

The worst service I have ever seen out of Blackpool today.

On Hope Valley we seem to have one unit making 4 return trips between Manchester and Sheffield today, that's it. Better than nothing but only just.

Have the emergency timetables been published? They're not obvious at stations. At Dore they're only displaying timetables to 14th December.

 

[Kite159]

Northern said that the buses will not run as frequently as the train service.

So one random unadvertised bus replacement which will no doubt be empty to allow northern management to report back 'we tried running buses but they weren't used, can we ditch them,?'