Northern 'Flexi-season tickets'

[skyhigh]

I searched for a thread on this, but couldn't find one - so if I've missed one, apologies!

Northern are trialling 'flexi-season' tickets between Harrogate and Leeds, starting from 14/07. More details at: https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/flexi

A Flexi-Season ticket is a bulk purchase of 10 all-day tickets, offering savings for regular commuters.
This new product will be on sale between Harrogate and Leeds, in either direction, from Tuesday 14th July with more routes to follow.
Unlike a normal season ticket, you only pay for the days you travel on. Perfect for part-time workers or those who work from home a couple of days a week.
Flexi-seasons are topped-up online and loaded on to a Smart card, meaning you can skip the usual queue to get them at the station. If you don’t yet have a Smart card you can request one below.

Key Benefits

• A multi-trip bundle of 10-day tickets, valid up to six months
• 10% saving versus individual Standard Anytime Day Returns
• Unlimited all-day travel between two name stations
• Buy in a single go online to skip the queues at the station
• 100% paperless - stored on a durable, personalised Smart card

Basically looks like a smartcard only version of a carnet ticket to me.

 

[_toommm_]

At least they’re giving a 10% discount, unlike the pathetic attempt Merseyrail made where they sell you three returns for the price of three returns.

 

[SteveM70]

A franchise commitment made by Arriva and promised within twelve months of them gaining the franchise. Like their trains, better late than never

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Did the Merseyrail "offer" at least allow unlimited use between the origin and destination stations on each day of validity?

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

A franchise commitment made by Arriva and promised within twelve months of them gaining the franchise. Like their trains, better late than never

Arriva gave up the ghost earlier this year! So they never managed to do this.

How much would a WY Metro season ticket cost, as a multiple of the Anytime Day Return? I'm guessing rather less than 4.5×, which is effectively the discount that this carnet offer presents. It's a pathetic discount that won't be of use to many people as a result.

 

[_toommm_]

Did the Merseyrail "offer" at least allow unlimited use between the origin and destination stations on each day of validity?

I don’t think so:

What is a Merseyrail Flexi-Ticket?

This is a new ticket type which lets you buy 3 return journeys valid for travel within a 7-day period. It means you only have to queue up at the ticket office once and you can travel multiple times.

 

[Bletchleyite]

At least they’re giving a 10% discount, unlike the pathetic attempt Merseyrail made where they sell you three returns for the price of three returns.

To be fair, SBB do that as well!

Northern's Anytime tickets aren't as overpriced compared to a day's worth of season ticket as they tend to be in the South East or worse on InterCity routes, so this is probably not a bad deal, and it is a smartcard product so you can't get prosecuted for being cack-handed with your biro.

So overall positive I think.

Edit: 6 month validity too, very reasonable. Once we're back to normal if LNR started offering such a product (and it took into account that it's cheaper to get an Anytime Day Single out and a NSE Off Peak Single back than an Anytime Day Return, as the latter deliberately have no evening restrictions ) then I'd certainly consider it.

 

[717001]

The current paper carnets on GN/TL are singles, so you have to buy two batches. They are due to move to The Key, hopefully in early autumn, so it will be interesting to see if those remain as singles or switch to match the Northern ones.

 

[SteveM70]

How much would a WY Metro season ticket cost, as a multiple of the Anytime Day Return? I'm guessing rather less than 4.5×, which is effectively the discount that this carnet offer presents. It's a pathetic discount that won't be of use to many people as a result.

It depends where you’re going, but when I lived in Hebden Bridge (which is almost exactly equidistant by train between Manchester and Leeds), it was galling that not only was an anytime return to Manchester about 25% more than one to Leeds (the so called tunnel tax), a Leeds weekly season was about 3.8x a daily ticket but a Manchester one was about 4.2x. A proper double whammy

 

[_toommm_]

It depends where you’re going, but when I lived in Hebden Bridge (which is almost exactly equidistant by train between Manchester and Leeds), it was galling that not only was an anytime return to Manchester about 25% more than one to Leeds (the so called tunnel tax), a Leeds weekly season was about 3.8x a daily ticket but a Manchester one was about 4.2x. A proper double whammy

Its the same at Marsden too - the Standedge Tunnel tax in this case.

 

[SteveM70]

Its the same at Marsden too - the Standedge Tunnel tax in this case.

I do understand the relative expense of a cross-boundary ticket in the current funding environment (although if the government are serious about Northern powerhouse and connectivity they should address it) but the discount percentage buying a season ticket should be consistent

 

[CyrusWuff]

Looking on BRFares, it's listed as a "Flexiday Season" (Ticket Type NFS) with an overall validity of six months and priced at nine times the Anytime Day Return fare...So yup, sounds decidedly like a Carnet to me!

 

[Wallsendmag]

Looking on BRFares, it's listed as a "Flexiday Season" (Ticket Type NFS) with an overall validity of six months and priced at nine times the Anytime Day Return fare...So yup, sounds decidedly like a Carnet to me!

Except these are in effect day seasons rather than day returns

 

[Cheshire Rover]

TfW have a similar product called Multiflex. I used it for a while when I was still working in Manchester but not frequently enough to merit a season ticket.

 

[thejuggler]

How much would a WY Metro season ticket cost, as a multiple of the Anytime Day Return? I'm guessing rather less than 4.5×, which is effectively the discount that this carnet offer presents. It's a pathetic discount that won't be of use to many people as a result.

A full WY Metro season ticket is £1200-2300 depending on zones selected, bus included etc.

If you have a longer commute every day it may not take many days of travel for this to make sense. However if you only have a short commute and don't travel 5 days a week the maths don't stack up as easily.

The ten ticket carnet with discount would be perfect for me.

 

[johntea]

A flexi-season ticket allows unlimited travel on the day of activation between the origin and destination stations shown on the ticket. A break of journey is not permitted along the route of the ticket at this moment.

Eh? Why not?!

 

[alistairlees]

A flexi-season ticket allows unlimited travel on the day of activation between the origin and destination stations shown on the ticket. A break of journey is not permitted along the route of the ticket at this moment.

Eh? Why not?!

It looks like other stations between Harrogate and Leeds are not yet enabled for this ticket type. The faqs on the Northern website does suggest this is only a temporary arrangement.

 

[Starmill]

The discount of 10% makes the trips cheaper than Annual Seasons for 3 days travelling a week or less. It would however be useful still for people wanting more than that if they can't find the capital anywhere to pay for the Annual (assuming these continue to be on offer in the future).

 

[johntea]

I've had a 0% credit card for my last couple of annual season tickets which has worked well as then you get the benefit of the annual saving over monthly tickets (actually quite significant!) but can then still pay it off in monthly chunks

Although I've heard conflicting opinions on if it is good or bad for a credit report (con:a £2k active balance on a credit card proaying off more than the minimum account monthly potentially shows responsible debt)

 

[_toommm_]

I've had a 0% credit card for my last couple of annual season tickets which has worked well as then you get the benefit of the annual saving over monthly tickets (actually quite significant!) but can then still pay it off in monthly chunks

Although I've heard conflicting opinions on if it is good or bad for a credit report (con:a £2k active balance on a credit card proaying off more than the minimum account monthly potentially shows responsible debt)

It depends really what your credit limit is, and how long you keep the balance on there. If your credit limit was only 2.5K, it would initially be bad as you’ve got a high credit utilisation rate; but as you say paying more than the minimum consistently every month helps you.

Having credit isn’t bad; quite the contrary. It’s just how you use it really. Some people put everything on one of their many credit cards to reap the rewards, but then pay it off in full every month. That’s the best thing to do in my opinion.

 

[skyhigh]

It looks like other stations between Harrogate and Leeds are not yet enabled for this ticket type. The faqs on the Northern website does suggest this is only a temporary arrangement.

The readers haven't been installed at intermediate station yet (though you can see where they're going to be, as silver posts have been popping up at stations recently where they'll go).

 

[tarq]

The readers haven't been installed at intermediate station yet (though you can see where they're going to be, as silver posts have been popping up at stations recently where they'll go).

Are they installing readers just on the Harrogate line or other lines too?

Has Harrogate got a gateline?

 

[Wallsendmag]

Are they installing readers just on the Harrogate line or other lines too?

Has Harrogate got a gateline?

PVals are being installed across the region by TfN

 

[ASharpe]

The readers haven't been installed at intermediate station yet (though you can see where they're going to be, as silver posts have been popping up at stations recently where they'll go).

Here's one installed the last few days at Shipley.

 

[Bungle965]

Are they installing readers just on the Harrogate line or other lines too?

Has Harrogate got a gateline?

Harrogate has indeed got a gateline.

 

[ainsworth74]

Looking at the Northern website this afternoon it now appears that intermediate stations are available on the Harrogate Loop though disappointingly the FAQ still says break of journey is not permitted, it's not clear to me whether that's just the FAQ not being updated as yet though.

Several other station pairs have also joined the trial in the form of Leeds to Skipton, Dewsbury and Huddersfield along with Bolton to Blackburn (no intermediate stations available as yet on those routes!). I also note that they appear to have been loaded into the fares system for quite a wide range of Northern stations for instance Middlesbrough to Saltburn, Southport to Wigan Stations, Beverly to Hull (including intermediate stations).

Northern's website page is here: https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/flexi

 

[tarq]

Looking at the Northern website this afternoon it now appears that intermediate stations are available on the Harrogate Loop

Several other station pairs have also joined the trial in the form of Leeds to Skipton, Dewsbury and Huddersfield along with Bolton to Blackburn (no intermediate stations available as yet on those routes!). I also note that they appear to have been loaded into the fares system for quite a wide range of Northern stations for instance Middlesbrough to Saltburn, Southport to Wigan Stations, Beverly to Hull (including intermediate stations).

Have they installed validators at those stations?

 

[skyhigh]

Platform validators are popping up around the network - look out for silver posts by entrances. If there's a bag on top, there's a validator underneath.... I can confirm they are installed and working at intermediate stations between Leeds and Harrogate.

(Photo shows validator with "Touch below to start or end your journey" displayed on the screen.)

Leeds, Skipton, Dewsbury and Huddersfield are also all enabled now.

 

[johntea]

We will be adding many more routes in the coming months - the product will ultimately be available at all stations and routes where you can currently buy a season ticket.

Does that mean eventually I would be able to buy say Castleford - Harrogate?

I was also thinking it seems a bit odd to go to the effort of installing a load of these extra readers, rather than just developing a software update for the standard TVMs

 

[Wallsendmag]

We will be adding many more routes in the coming months - the product will ultimately be available at all stations and routes where you can currently buy a season ticket.

Does that mean eventually I would be able to buy say Castleford - Harrogate?

I was also thinking it seems a bit odd to go to the effort of installing a load of these extra readers, rather than just developing a software update for the standard TVMs

Ideally You don’t want existing ticket holders tying up your TVMs when they just need to tap a Pval.