Northern Pacer Withdrawals - Info?

[Swimbar]

Going off topic but I seem to have missed something here what's actually happened at Ingrow?

The bridge deck is being replaced

 

[Solent&Wessex]

The bridge deck is being replaced

Which, because it was using mainly volunteer manpower and expertise, with some contractor involvement, got stopped when the restrictions on non-essential movement etc got put in place the other week.

 

[D365]

Oh thanks, I was confused by what you meant. I think that they probably won't be needed again once the derogations expire. But I also think that Northern may keep some Pacers as route learning vehicles once normal timetables resume (in case they have no avaliable stock for them to do driver training)

It depends whether the Class 195s are fully commissioned, surely.

 

[superkev]

It depends whether the Class 195s are fully commissioned, surely.

I believe Northern and probably all TOCs have a current policy of only one person on the cab so commissioning, training,route learning has stopped. The end date for the 144s is 31st August so depending on the virus situation I cant see them running again. With only a handful of new stock awaiting entry into service how Northern are going to manage in the future without 23 units is a mystery to me. Perhaps a pruning of the timetable.
K

 

[JonathanH]

With only a handful of new stock awaiting entry into service how Northern are going to manage in the future without 23 units is a mystery to me. Perhaps a pruning of the timetable.

Almost certainly a gradual increase in services (and passengers) given the circumstances rather than immediate restoration of the full timetable.

Weren't there already 144s in storage at Heaton prior to this in any case?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Almost certainly a gradual increase in services (and passengers) given the circumstances rather than immediate restoration of the full timetable.

Weren't there already 144s in storage at Heaton prior to this in any case?

IIRC there was one 2-car (plus a middle car from a 3-car) stopped with corrosion at Heaton, plus one or two still in use but stabled at Heaton due to shortage of space in Yorkshire.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Which, because it was using mainly volunteer manpower and expertise, with some contractor involvement, got stopped when the restrictions on non-essential movement etc got put in place the other week.

Indeed. Very off topic so will leave it, there will be news articles appearing on the kwvr website soon from the engineers involved. But the units won't go further than Ingrow is the key point to this topic.

 

[Murray J]

not sure if it's been mentioned here but 142017 is at the east kent railway.

 

[4REP]

I believe Northern and probably all TOCs have a current policy of only one person on the cab so commissioning, training,route learning has stopped. The end date for the 144s is 31st August so depending on the virus situation I cant see them running again. With only a handful of new stock awaiting entry into service how Northern are going to manage in the future without 23 units is a mystery to me. Perhaps a pruning of the timetable.
K

Northern recieved 49 cascaded units plus another 5 150s to come from GWR. Also 58 new 195s. It balances out the numbers with a few extra units.
102 pacers replaced by 112 cascaded/new units. Also electrification replaced pacers so you can add 319s too as replacement. There will alsoo be spare 15x Dmus lying around at Depots.

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Presumably they are there for scrapping by Raxstar? It's a shame that vehicle 55555 (from 142014) wasn't preserved, but nevermind!

I have heard, though unconfirmed that they are for the Swanage Railway.

Someone maybe able to confirm this

Mark

They have been purchased by Arlington fleet group

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Been trying my best to keep up.
Yellow - K&WVR stored
Blue - HT stored

 

[Ewan M]

Nice wee read here
https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/her...ed-two-pacers-scrap-and-want-live-one-2529485

Musician and songwriter Sam and his wife Mim, from Durham, have donated one of the Class 142 diesel units to the Wensleydale Railway as a gift, while the other is being temporarily cared for by the heritage line ahead of a long-term project to transform it into a home, a holiday let and a community arts space.

Sam and Mim have even set up an Instagram page - @tinytrainhouse - to bring their new purchase into the social media age and document the story of its conversion into an off-grid, eco-friendly house.

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Nice wee read here
https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/her...ed-two-pacers-scrap-and-want-live-one-2529485

Was reading that yesterday, god I hate the journalism.

They approached Angel Trains, who had leased 102 of the Pacers to Northern

Angel trains leased 79 of the 102 to northern, the rest came from porterbrook

We went to the yard and saw a couple we wanted to buy, but then found this whole row of them destined for scrap

Isn’t that all of them anyway? 3 long rows of pacers, waiting to be scrapped.

And this is where it gets worse.

The Keighley and Worth Valley Railway has also recently received some of the Pacers' sister Class 44 units, which will become part of its heritage fleet.

I’m guessing “class 44” should be class 144?
Unless the K&WVR have made the decision to preserve 16 class 144s (which no matter the love for them would never happen) then they are not becoming part of the heritage fleet...

on the topic of the K&WVR I saw some pictures on Instagram yesterday of 144011 being driven on the line, I’m guessing they have made an agreement with northern or porterbrook to be able to use this unit to train staff so when 144011 comes back to them, they are ready to run it?

But my rant dosent stop here!

They are being decommissioned and scrapped at the CF Booth metalworks in Rotherham

Complete rubbish, 2 out of the 30 odd that have been scrapped have been scrapped at booths, the rest at Sims and EMR.

and the first one was removed from service last August, with three more following in the autumn.

142005 - withdrawn in August, yes.
The other “3” were not withdrawn in the autumn but the winter. And this “3” would happen to be 9!

The National Railway Museum have accepted a donated Pacer

They make it sound like they were doing angel trains a favour

The press are getting it wrong as always

 

[Harvey B]

I’m guessing “class 44” should be class 144?
Unless the K&WVR have made the decision to preserve 16 class 144s (which no matter the love for them would never happen) then they are not becoming part of the heritage fleet...

What they should have said is that K&WVR are keeping 16 class 144s in storage for Northern and that one of the units they're storing will be returning as a preserved pacer

 

[Harvey B]

on the topic of the K&WVR I saw some pictures on Instagram yesterday of 144011 being driven on the line, I’m guessing they have made an agreement with northern or porterbrook to be able to use this unit to train staff so when 144011 comes back to them, they are ready to run it?

Unless plans have changed and its being handed over

142005 - withdrawn in August, yes.
The other “3” were not withdrawn in the autumn but the winter. And this “3” would happen to be 9!

Seems like the press can't do simple maths

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Unless plans have changed and its being handed over

Nope, they said that it will be coming back to them later this year

 

[61653 HTAFC]

The press are getting it wrong as always

Indeed. If the fourth estate are the "canary in the coal mine" of democracy, then it looks like we're doomed!

 

[Mat17]

Unless the K&WVR have made the decision to preserve 16 class 144s (which no matter the love for them would never happen)

Ha! I'd love to know where they'd even begin to store those!

 

[Harvey B]

Nope, they said that it will be coming back to them later this year

I can't see them training on it while it's owned by Porterbook & leased by Northern unless plans change

 

[Harvey B]

how many 142s are in warm storage and how many have been withdrawn from Northern?

 

[warwickshire]

They have been purchased by Arlington fleet group

What use do you know would the Arlington fleet group find for these units. Ie work wise. Is it departmental test train for example.
Many thanks.

 

[IamTrainsYT]

I can't see them training on it while it's owned by Porterbook & leased by Northern unless plans change

I see that to be perfectly fine, it could be part of the agreement that they have made with northern to store the units.

how many 142s are in warm storage and how many have been withdrawn from Northern?

Northern:
2 class 142s stored at NH
2 class 142s stored at Blackburn king street
8 class 142s stored at HT
1 class 142 stored at NL

Off lease:
12 class 142s stored at gascoigne wood (will be 9 tomorrow)

Arlington fleet group:
3 class 142s stored at Eastleigh (will be 6 tomorrow)

South Wales police:
1 class 142 at Bridgend rugby pitch

TFW:
2 class 142s stored at LE
1 class 142 stored at CF

preserved:
2 class 142s at gascoigne wood
1 class 142 at Locomotion
1 class 142 at the east Kent railway
2 class 142s at the whitrope heritage centre
3 class 142s at the Chasewater railway
2 class 142s at the Wensleydale railway
1 class 142 at the mid Norfolk railway
2 class 142s at the Rushden railway

33 class 142s have been scrapped

 

[Plymdan]

So I see the Plym valley Railway is not on the preserved list. Are they not taking 142023 now?

 

[IamTrainsYT]

So I see the Plym valley Railway is not on the preserved list. Are they not taking 142023 now?

That’s currently still being leased by northern and is the only one stored at NL

 

[Harvey B]

I see that to be perfectly fine, it could be part of the agreement that they have made with northern to store the units.

Northern:
2 class 142s stored at NH
2 class 142s stored at Blackburn king street
8 class 142s stored at HT
1 class 142 stored at NL

Off lease:
12 class 142s stored at gascoigne wood (will be 9 tomorrow)

Arlington fleet group:
3 class 142s stored at Eastleigh (will be 6 tomorrow)

South Wales police:
1 class 142 at Bridgend rugby pitch

TFW:
2 class 142s stored at LE
1 class 142 stored at CF

preserved:
2 class 142s at gascoigne wood
1 class 142 at Locomotion
1 class 142 at the east Kent railway
2 class 142s at the whitrope heritage centre
3 class 142s at the Chasewater railway
2 class 142s at the Wensleydale railway
1 class 142 at the mid Norfolk railway
2 class 142s at the Rushden railway

33 class 142s have been scrapped

How many from Northern are in warm storage in total?
How many from Northern are off lease in total?
Sorry for being awkward But I need the totals so I can update the fleet on Wikipedia

 

[IamTrainsYT]

What use do you know would the Arlington fleet group find for these units. Ie work wise. Is it departmental test train for example.
Many thanks.

They are going to be dismantled and parts sold on to railways and collectors (with railways getting much higher priority of cause)

How many from Northern are in warm storage in total?
How many from Northern are off lease in total?
Sorry for being awkward But I need the totals so I can update the fleet on Wikipedia

Northern: 2+2+8+1=13
Off lease: 12

 

[Harvey B]

They are going to be dismantled and parts sold on to railways and collectors (with railways getting much higher priority of cause)

Northern: 2+2+8+1=13
Off lease: 12

cheers, does that 13 include the two still in service? (Once again asking for Wikipedia)

 

[SteveM70]

Indeed. If the fourth estate are the "canary in the coal mine" of democracy, then it looks like we're doomed!

And there’s the thing. Every time I read a newspaper article about something I have a reasonable knowledge of, I find mistakes. Yet people read about things they don’t know about and believe every word

 

[IamTrainsYT]

cheers, does that 13 include the two still in service? (Once again asking for Wikipedia)

the 2 at NH are also stored

 

[Geeves]

One of those 142s at the Chasewater, 029 (I think) is there for spares and stripping only.