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Northern Unit Refurbishments

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Andyh82

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Looking at all the replies, it must be a thankless task working at Northern.
 
stu99

stu99

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Halish Railway said:
What work is being carried out? Will it include new seats?
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I'm not sure, somebody more in the know maybe could answer that?
156438 came back with the same seats but I can't remember if it was before it was announced that they would be replaced or not.
 
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pemma

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stu99 said:
I don't know, it could be during this refurbishment, but I think it'll be the next stage, however I don't know when this will start.
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If it's true the Chapman seats from the 156s will be upcycled and put in to 150s then logically the 156s with Chapman seats would be the first sets to get new seats.
 
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1179_Clee2

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jcollins said:
If it's true the Chapman seats from the 156s will be upcycled and put in to 150s then logically the 156s with Chapman seats would be the first sets to get new seats.
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BIG PROBLEM

All of Northern's 156s fitted with Chapman seating are Porterbrook's trains. None have been for rerfurb.
All of Northern's 156s that have been for refurb are owned by Angel and are fitted with Richmond seating.
Porterbrook should be using their Chapman seating out of their 156s to fit into their 150/2s which are staying with Northern.
The ONLY trains Angel has with Northern with Chapman seating that will get new seats are 6 158s with 5 more arriving from Scotrail.
 
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pemma

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1179_Clee2 said:
BIG PROBLEM

All of Northern's 156s fitted with Chapman seating are Porterbrook's trains. None have been for rerfurb.
All of Northern's 156s that have been for refurb are owned by Angel and are fitted with Richmond seating.
Porterbrook should be using the their Chapman seating out of their 156s to fit into their 150/2s which are staying with Northern.
The ONLY trains Angel has with Northern with Chapman seating that will get new seats are 6 158s with 5 more arriving from Scotrail.
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Why is it a big problem? Porterbrook are funding the PRM mods, Northern are funding the other mods. Surely Porterbrook won't want the new seats removed and replaced with the old ones when the 156 lease comes to an end?
 
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1179_Clee2

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jcollins said:
Why is it a big problem? Porterbrook are funding the PRM mods, Northern are funding the other mods. Surely Porterbrook won't want the new seats removed and replaced with the old ones when the 156 lease comes to an end?
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Angel will have 31 150/1 and 7 150/2 that need Chapman seating for Northern.
Porterbrook have 11 150/2 that need Chapman seating for Northern.
Northern have available 18 156s and 11 158s that will have had Chapman seating removed where does Northern get the rest of the Chapman seating from second hand.
 
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pemma

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1179_Clee2 said:
Angel will have 31 150/1 and 7 150/2 that need Chapman seating for Northern.
Porterbrook have 11 150/2 that need Chapman seating for Northern.
Northern have available 18 156s and 11 158s that will have had Chapman seating removed where does Northern get the rest of the Chapman seating from second hand.
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I accept the numbers don't add up to give enough seats for all the 150s but you were implying that the seats removed from Porterbrook trains could be be refitted to other Porterbrook sets.

Based on the numbers you've given it seems you've presumed the Angel 12 won't join the fleet. However, that leaves an unknown as the Northern franchise agreement indicated there would 18 x 3 car 150s - 2 150/0s and 16 conversions, so would Northern create an extra 2 hybrid sets or would the number of 3 car sets change? That affects how many seats would be needed to refurbish all the 150s.

If the pre- and post-refurbishment seating numbers in the franchise agreement are correct, the post-refurbishment 2 car 150s will have 124 seats and the 3 car sets will have 198 seats. The 158s have 138 seats and the Porterbrook 156s have 146 seats.

There's not really enough information to determine how many sets could be covered, ignoring how many 3 car sets are created, would 124 seats only include Chapman seats, or would some bench or fold down seats be included?
 
DanNCL

DanNCL

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jonesy3001 said:
sure there`ll be plenty of seats available when the pacers start being withdrawn.
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It's specifically Chapman seats that are needed by Northern. The only Pacers with Chapman seats are the 143s, which Northern don't operate, so I'm not sure how Pacers being withdrawn solves the problem of where to get Chapman seats from.
 
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pemma

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jonesy3001 said:
sure there`ll be plenty of seats available when the pacers start being withdrawn.
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The ATW Pacers have the right type of seating but we don't know when they'll be withdrawn yet, I think in total they have around 3000 seats between them. The Northern Pacers have the wrong type of seating.
 
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1179_Clee2

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jcollins said:
I accept the numbers don't add up to give enough seats for all the 150s but you were implying that the seats removed from Porterbrook trains could be be refitted to other Porterbrook sets.

Based on the numbers you've given it seems you've presumed the Angel 12 won't join the fleet. However, that leaves an unknown as the Northern franchise agreement indicated there would 18 x 3 car 150s - 2 150/0s and 16 conversions, so would Northern create an extra 2 hybrid sets or would the number of 3 car sets change? That affects how many seats would be needed to refurbish all the 150s.

If the pre- and post-refurbishment seating numbers in the franchise agreement are correct, the post-refurbishment 2 car 150s will have 124 seats and the 3 car sets will have 198 seats. The 158s have 138 seats and the Porterbrook 156s have 146 seats.

There's not really enough information to determine how many sets could be covered, ignoring how many 3 car sets are created, would 124 seats only include Chapman seats, or would some bench or fold down seats be included?
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All my info is from Platform 5 pocket books from 1983 to 2018.
The NEW 2018 book says on 2020 fitted units
150/1 full details awaited
150/2 fitted with Chapman seats
DMSL 58 +3 tip up 1TD 2W
DMS 70 +6 tip up
 
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xotGD

xotGD

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jcollins said:
The ATW Pacers have the right type of seating but we don't know when they'll be withdrawn yet, I think in total they have around 3000 seats between them. The Northern Pacers have the wrong type of seating.
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I now have visions of a 150 retrofitted with a combination of bus seats and the Merseytravel seats from hell!
 
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pemma

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Halish Railway said:
Is 150275 going to be re-refurbished with cascaded Chapman seats?
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At the moment there aren't enough Chapman seats to allow all the 150s to have them, so I imagine that one will miss out unless they get some more (e.g. by ATW withdrawing their Pacers.)
 
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