Northern Unit Refurbishments

[brel york]

I worked on a 142 that had a fridge dropped on it

 

[ash39]

I've heard of kids chucking stones off bridges, but a fridge?!

 

[brel york]

Yeah it happened about 6 -7 years ago either 142 014 or 016 it landed just behind driver made its way on the roof and got wedged under bridge and it came through the roof into toilet compartment

 

[brel york]

I was in a small team that stripped the toilet and repaired the roof

 

[NorthernSpirit]

I'm I alone in thinking Northern don't maintain there vintage fleet too well. I've never known any of the depots featuring in any of the various awards.

The UK's largest heritage railway operator (aka Northern) only seem to repair the fleet to a very basic level. I've seen class 158's running in service with the standard issue Neville Hill Depot masking tape.

I wonder what sort of condition these 150/1’s that are coming to Northern from GWR are going to be in. From reading threads on here from that part of the world, the passengers down in Devon and Cornwall are so pleased that they are going.

When I've used them between Bristol and Weston they seem to be in better nick than Northern's 150's, plus the have LED lighting inside.

 

[Allwinter_Kit]

The UK's largest heritage railway operator (aka Northern) only seem to repair the fleet to a very basic level. I've seen class 158's running in service with the standard issue Neville Hill Depot masking tape.

It's not just limited to their old trains either. Even some of the newer fleet is relatively dirty and patched up. Some of the 333s rattling around West Yorkshire are filthy inside and out.

 

[D2007wsm]

When I've used them between Bristol and Weston they seem to be in better nick than Northern's 150's, plus the have LED lighting inside.

They are still drab inside and tatty compared to the GWR 150/0s and 150/2s. Recently I have been on several where the seats are collapsing. The ones which have been posted lilac inside aren't to bad, but the ones which still have the 80s brown, sorry cream with green floors are horrible. I hate it when one of these turns up, especially when full and standing, due to the 3x2 seating arrangement. I for one won't be sorry to see these go, instead seeing Turbos, mini HSTs and 802s.

 

[xotGD]

It's not just limited to their old trains either. Even some of the newer fleet is relatively dirty and patched up. Some of the 333s rattling around West Yorkshire are filthy inside and out.

Can't say I've ever had an issue with cleanliness on a 333. As is well documented, my issue is with the seating.

 

[Spartacus]

I think it's just a matter of doing what they can, I've seen stuff recorded in fault logs to be attended to from depots around London, like slightly scratched toilet mirrors for one but there are others, that simply wouldn't be considered reportable.

 

[Mordac]

333 maintenance is outsourced so Siemens, so not Northern's fault there, except for possibly failing to push back on contractual standards.

 

[SugrFr33]

I haven't checked the unit numbers yet but just got on a pair of 2 car 158s that have the orange scrolling LED boards inside - does this mean the 158s will be done to 2 different standards? (Outsides not in new livery) (the half I was sat on was 158859)

 

[pemma]

I haven't checked the unit numbers yet but just got on a pair of 2 car 158s that have the orange scrolling LED boards inside - does this mean the 158s will be done to 2 different standards? (Outsides not in new livery)

Do you know which units have which system? They aren't all leased from the same ROSCO and it's the ROSCO who are funding the PRM changes.

There's also two which have recently joined from Scotrail but they should be obvious to identify as they probably be in debranded Scotrail livery or plain blue, opposed to blue and lilac.

 

[Halish Railway]

I haven't checked the unit numbers yet but just got on a pair of 2 car 158s that have the orange scrolling LED boards inside - does this mean the 158s will be done to 2 different standards? (Outsides not in new livery) (the half I was sat on was 158859)

No, the scrolling LED dot-matrix is a temporary fix and is done as part of PRM modifications being carried out at Loughborough.

All 158's have to be done to Northern Connect standards, no subfleets.

 

[SugrFr33]

Do you know which units have which system? They aren't all leased from the same ROSCO and it's the ROSCO who are funding the PRM changes.

There's also two which have recently joined from Scotrail but they should be obvious to identify as they probably be in debranded Scotrail livery or plain blue, opposed to blue and lilac.

What do you mean by system?

No, the scrolling LED dot-matrix is a temporary fix and is done as part of PRM modifications being carried out at Loughborough.

All 158's have to be done to Northern Connect standards, no subfleets.

That would explain it, thank you

 

[pemma]

No, the scrolling LED dot-matrix is a temporary fix and is done as part of PRM modifications being carried out at Loughborough.

All 158's have to be done to Northern Connect standards, no subfleets.

What specific CIS requirements are there for Northern Connect services?

 

[Halish Railway]

What specific CIS requirements are there for Northern Connect services?

Electronic reservations, new seats and coloured PIS (like those in the refurbished 158's).

 

[Halish Railway]

155 347 is in Kilmarnock, any idea when it will return to Neville Hill?

 

[brel york]

Knowing my compatriots in Scotland it could be a while

 

[Halish Railway]

Knowing my compatriots in Scotland it could be a while

Uh, it's going to be a long time to do 7 units. I'm guessing it's due to the corrosion caused by the cheap design and lack of monocoque body. What are they doing to the interior?

 

[brel york]

I’ll ask my mate who’s the engineering guy up there

 

[PHILIPE]

155 347 is in Kilmarnock, any idea when it will return to Neville Hill?

Ask again in about a year's time if 155346 is anything to go by.

 

[brel york]

Yeah we really are struggling up there, I enjoy going up there , good set of lads

 

[Halish Railway]

Ask again in about a year's time if 155346 is anything to go by.

Good advice, by what I've seen from 155 346 and 155 345, they get refurbished, but just come back to Neville Hill and sit around. Any idea what they are doing at Neville Hill?

 

[ash39]

I see 155346 working almost every time I'm in Leeds now. You're right on 345 though, don't think that's been out since it came back from Kilmarnock.

It did come back a lot quicker than the first one though.

 

[pemma]

Electronic reservations, new seats and coloured PIS (like those in the refurbished 158's).

Pretty sure new seats aren't a requirement which is why they tried refurbishing the existing seats on one of the 158s. I'll check the exact requirements later on.

 

[M1544]

I see 155346 working almost every time I'm in Leeds now. You're right on 345 though, don't think that's been out since it came back from Kilmarnock.

It did come back a lot quicker than the first one though.

155346 was at Kilmarnock for 13 months.
155345 was 7 months so over 5 months quicker.
I read that one of the reasons the first one took so long was that the original leyland design drawings were no longer available so they had to work blind for the first set.

 

[brel york]

A lot of drawings are not available anymore, some of the drawings regarding the Barclays conversion to chapman seats on the 150s are not available on pads

 

[pemma]

Electronic reservations, new seats and coloured PIS (like those in the refurbished 158's).

The minimum requirements for Northern Connect units are:

(a) air conditioning and heating systems that are designed to operate effectively and reliably within the range of ambient temperatures normally experienced in the north of England throughout the year;
(b) fixed or folding tables at a minimum of 90% of seats;
(c) power sockets or USB charging points with a minimum of one socket provided for every two seats;
(d) adequate space for luggage which takes account of the fact that the Northern Connect Passenger Services shall be operated to and from airports and other significant tourist venues;
(e) toilet facilities (including, baby-change facilities and toilets which are Controlled Emission Toilets);
(f) full compliance with the accessibility requirements in the Railways (Interoperability) Regulations 2011 notwithstanding that compliance is not required by law until 1 January 2020; and
(g) electronic seat reservation systems;

Additionally all Sprinters plus the 319s, 333s and 170 must have the following work done:

(a) recovering of all seats and the replacement of all seat cushions;
(b) new floor coverings throughout;
(c) repainting of all interior panels;
(d) powder coating of all grab poles and rails;
(e) a clean compliant with the Deep Clean Specification;
(f) full exterior repaint (it being agreed that with regard to those Class 319s units repainted into the current Northern operator’s livery in 2015 or 2016 re-painting of those units shall be completed by 31 March 2023);
(g) fitting of Wi-Fi compliant with at least the Minimum Wi-Fi Service Requirements;
(h) fitting of at least one PRM compliant toilet with baby-change facility per multiple unit;
(i) fitting of LED lighting, with lighting intensity complying with EN 13272 ‘Railway Applications – Electrical Lighting for Rolling Stock in Public Transport Systems’;
(j) fitting of a passenger information system compliant with the Passenger Information System Specification;
(k) fitting of CCTV compliant with the Internal CCTV Specification;
(l) fitted with a driver advisory system to advise the driver on the most economical method of driving consistent with good timekeeping;
(m) fitted with forward facing CCTV;
(n) fitted to be “ERTMS-ready” so that when ETCS equipment needs to be installed in accordance with the Network Rail programme it can be done without needing intrusive works including because necessary wiring is in place and space for the equipment has been kept free as part of the refurbishment works.

So while Northern can go above the minimum requirements new seats and coloured PIS are not required.

 

[Halish Railway]

I don't understand why you can't get the drawings anymore. I thought that they would be vital for maintenance.

 

[brel york]

Most of the br ones are available but some of the interior ones from the Huntley Barclay interior work are not available