Think we are getting into the same debate as the "How long should you wait at a ticket machine" topic i.e. there is no correct answer. In either situation one party is going to lose out - either the passenger who has to pay for another ticket but gets a refund later, or the TOC who loses revenue when people walk past the ticket machine without a valid ticket.
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Northern's policy for buying tickets on board
- Thread starter Oscar
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Think we are getting into the same debate as the "How long should you wait at a ticket machine" topic i.e. there is no correct answer. In either situation one party is going to lose out - either the passenger who has to pay for another ticket but gets a refund later, or the TOC who loses revenue when people walk past the ticket machine without a valid ticket.
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RailUK Forums
I touched on this in post 8. A message scrolls at the top saying card only or correct change only. However, there is a programming error in them where they can display contradicting messages.
Unless the machine is on the platform that the train is departing from then the guard would have difficulty seeing any message or light on the machine unless he/she distracts from their normal duties.
Failed Unit
Established Member
Yes I would agree with that statement, the machine is typically near the booking office, so typically a train in one direction would see the light but the other would struggle. In some cases the machine can't be seen by trains in either. I guess at least it helps and the gaurd may have clocked it wasn't working on the previous duty (assuming they they have passed the station before).
The other thing however is you won't be the only person requesting a ticket if multiple people joined the train.
The other thing however is you won't be the only person requesting a ticket if multiple people joined the train.
Multiple people not buying tickets before boarding doesn't automatically mean that the machine is out-of-order.
Likewise one or more people having tickets printed by the machine 10 minutes ago doesn't mean it was still operational 5 minutes ago.
The new TVMs I've seen Northern have installed are almost exclusively located on the platform. Usually the platform which has the peak outbound flow.
Failed Unit
Established Member
I wasn't suggesting it was, just that it helps your case should the gaurd not believe you. We were let through barriers at Canterbury because of a slow moving queue. Many had tickets, many did not, but the fact so many had the same story made it crediable if the gaurd didn't know the barriers were opened.
Kryten2340
Member
Might be going slightly off topic here but I'm wondering what would happen in the following situation.
Now it has been a good few years since I travelled from the Metro Centre to Newcastle but I used to work on the business park where Tyne Tees is and this is a good 10-15 minute walk from the Metro Centre itself. At the time there were no ticket machines at the Coach Park end of the station (this being the part of the station that backs onto the road leading to where I worked). The machines themselves were across the bridge in the Metro Centre itself.
In this situation are passengers meant to walk across the bridge to get their ticket and then walk back. I'll be honest I would always board the train and rely on the guard to issue a ticket but would of course always pay.
It was rare when I travelled on the train, usually when going into town for drinks after work and I would leave my travel pass at home but this thread has got me thinking about this.
In the above situation what would happen if no guard came to issue a ticket and there were revenue inspectors at Newcastle. Would the passenger be at fault or the guard? A similar situation happened to me in that I boarded the train and the guard came along and as I only had a £20 note I was let off without paying a fair. Again would the passenger be at fault if there were inspectors at Newcastle.
Again to reiterate this was a good few years ago (2004) before the barriers were put in at Newcastle and for all I know there may now be ticket machines at the coach park entry to the Metrocentre.
Now it has been a good few years since I travelled from the Metro Centre to Newcastle but I used to work on the business park where Tyne Tees is and this is a good 10-15 minute walk from the Metro Centre itself. At the time there were no ticket machines at the Coach Park end of the station (this being the part of the station that backs onto the road leading to where I worked). The machines themselves were across the bridge in the Metro Centre itself.
In this situation are passengers meant to walk across the bridge to get their ticket and then walk back. I'll be honest I would always board the train and rely on the guard to issue a ticket but would of course always pay.
It was rare when I travelled on the train, usually when going into town for drinks after work and I would leave my travel pass at home but this thread has got me thinking about this.
In the above situation what would happen if no guard came to issue a ticket and there were revenue inspectors at Newcastle. Would the passenger be at fault or the guard? A similar situation happened to me in that I boarded the train and the guard came along and as I only had a £20 note I was let off without paying a fair. Again would the passenger be at fault if there were inspectors at Newcastle.
Again to reiterate this was a good few years ago (2004) before the barriers were put in at Newcastle and for all I know there may now be ticket machines at the coach park entry to the Metrocentre.
There are a couple of similar situations in the Greater Manchester area where a ticket office is located only on one platform (usually the Manchester-bound one as this is where the greatest demand is) - the consensus then was that you indeed had to buy a ticket before you got on, even if it meant walking past your platform to the other side and back.
Thinking about it now there is a similar set up at Redcar Central.
Thinking about it now there is a similar set up at Redcar Central.
There aren't any ticket machines at the Metrocentre are there? I've used the staiton 20/30+ times and have never seen any! I'm not aware that there ever were any either, but I only moved to the north-east in 2004...
wellhouse
Member
The latest card-only TVMs installed at stations including Slaithwaite do not accept the full range of Credit Cards accepted at stations and on board. American Express seems to be excluded
Solent&Wessex
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And another can of worms relating to Northern's TVMs is that booking offices seem incapable of recalling TOD bookings when the machine is not working. Folk are then just told to get on the train and show a reference number.
I have spoken to someone I know in a Northern Booking Office and he told me the procedure Northern has put in place to allow booking offices to recall TOD bookings is so time consuming and requires many phone calls and form filling that they don't bother. Why they can't just recall the booking on the TIS, check ID of passenger, and print the tickets like other TOCs seem to do is quite beyond me.
Meanwhile instructions to on train staff are that they shouldn't accept reference numbers and that they should be charged for a ticket and told to contact whoever they brought the ticket from originally!!!
I have spoken to someone I know in a Northern Booking Office and he told me the procedure Northern has put in place to allow booking offices to recall TOD bookings is so time consuming and requires many phone calls and form filling that they don't bother. Why they can't just recall the booking on the TIS, check ID of passenger, and print the tickets like other TOCs seem to do is quite beyond me.
Meanwhile instructions to on train staff are that they shouldn't accept reference numbers and that they should be charged for a ticket and told to contact whoever they brought the ticket from originally!!!
Kryten2340
Member
Back when I was using the station regularly in 2004 there was one (maybe two) ticket machines in the Metrocentre itself opposite where the lift is to go upto the higher levels of the blue multi storey car park.
Can anybody confirm whether Adwick has ticket issuing facilities?
When I first started using the station I enquired at the SYPTE Information Centre and they stated you had to purchase on the train. I have always been sold an Off Peak Return, the last time being 6th March, but yesterday was sold an Anytime. I enquired at Doncaster whether they had now installed a ticket machine and 2 of the 3 people said they didn't know and one said yes - in the new shelter. When I got back to Adwick I checked and there aren't any new shelters and no ticket machines in the old shelters.
NRES states it has a booking office - which is closed Monday - Sunday!
It also states there is a self service machine in the booking office, but there isn't a booking office.
It was only 20p difference so I'm not bothered about the money, but if there aren't any ticket facilities it is the principle.
When I first started using the station I enquired at the SYPTE Information Centre and they stated you had to purchase on the train. I have always been sold an Off Peak Return, the last time being 6th March, but yesterday was sold an Anytime. I enquired at Doncaster whether they had now installed a ticket machine and 2 of the 3 people said they didn't know and one said yes - in the new shelter. When I got back to Adwick I checked and there aren't any new shelters and no ticket machines in the old shelters.
NRES states it has a booking office - which is closed Monday - Sunday!
It also states there is a self service machine in the booking office, but there isn't a booking office.
It was only 20p difference so I'm not bothered about the money, but if there aren't any ticket facilities it is the principle.
Might have been taken out now. Also, I wonder if that actaully counts as technically they weren't on the station itself.
clagmonster
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When I was there (a few months ago), there was a TVM in the information centre. Maybe that is what was being described as the new shelter. I can't remember what payment types it accepts, like you I enquired at what I assumed was the booking window, though I already had a ticket and was after a platform ticket for my collection.
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