Operational Incident at Blackfriars

[Andy Pacer]

Severe disruption to Thameslink services this morning due to what is described as an 'operational incident' at Blackfriars. Delays of up to around 60 mins.

 

[Peter C]

From Thameslink on Twitter at 0838:

Please do not travel, all lines between St Pancras and London Blackfriars will be closed to allow for urgent repair work to the overhead electric wires to take place.
Service information to follow shortly

https://twitter.com/TLRailUK/status/1426448140073328640?s=19

-Peter

 

[AlterEgo]

Someone forgot to pan down at Farringdon?

 

[bengley]

Someone forgot to pan down at Farringdon?

Correct

 

[Andy Pacer]

From Thameslink on Twitter at 0838:

https://twitter.com/TLRailUK/status/1426448140073328640?s=19

-Peter

Thanks for that. Probably fortunate it's not a weekday morning peak

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Correct

While I’m sad to see the line closed and people’s journeys affected, I’m glad “operational incident” turned out to be a (somewhat silly and embarrassing) driver mistake and not a derailment as I had first feared. That’s usually what has happened when train staff use that term, I’ve found.

 

[Peter C]

Thanks for that. Probably fortunate it's not a weekday morning peak

You're very welcome - went on Twitter and thought it might be worth sharing.

-Peter

 

[dk1]

Someone forgot to pan down at Farringdon?

Oh does that still happen? Used to be regular. Thankfully with 755s pan protection stops us before we do any damage but it’s tight at Farringdon so no room for error.

 

[BluePenguin]

What exactly happens when drivers forget? I thought the pantograph would simply sit redundant in the air, the train would leave before shortly crawling to a halt. The a case of switching to third rail power and carrying on. Or vice versa

 

[aleggatta]

Someone forgot to pan down at Farringdon?

Correct

Thought that was all automatic now?

 

[dk1]

What exactly happens when drivers forget? I thought the pantograph would simply sit redundant in the air, the train would leave before shortly crawling to a halt. The a case of switching to third rail power and carrying on. Or vice versa

Doesn’t it go directly into tunnel at Farringdon though?

 

[Nottingham59]

How long would a non-conducting rail have to be beyond the end of the overhead line to force the pan down and protect it from the tunnel roof? Would that be practical?

 

[swt_passenger]

Doesn’t it go directly into tunnel at Farringdon though?

How long would a non-conducting rail have to be beyond the end of the overhead line to force the pan down and protect it from the tunnel roof? Would that be practical?

The overhead continues right through to City Thameslink anyway. The pan only comes off the wires just a short distance before Blackfriars southbound.

 

[Ianno87]

The overhead continues right through to City Thameslink anyway. The pan only comes off the wires just a short distance before Blackfriars southbound.

The conductor bar basically ends on the incline out of City Thameslink, as the line emerges into daylight.

 

[Nottingham59]

the overhead tends right through City Thameslink

So what happened in this case? Did the pan come off the wires after City Thameslink or something?

 

[jon0844]

While I’m sad to see the line closed and people’s journeys affected, I’m glad “operational incident” turned out to be a (somewhat silly and embarrassing) driver mistake and not a derailment as I had first feared. That’s usually what has happened when train staff use that term, I’ve found.

I'd say that this is used more for a SPAD or opening the doors wrong side, missing a stop or something than a derailment. I think you should not jump to the latter conclusion whenever you see that stated!

Also there was an incident on the ECML this morning too, involving someone jumping from a train to avoid the police.

On the plus side, it seems the service (sans incidents) has drivers today.

 

[swt_passenger]

So what happened in this case? Did the pan come off the wires after City Thameslink or something?

That’s what’s happened before. The distance between the two stations is very short, (only about 100m to the building at Queen Victoria St), so if the front pan over extends AIUI the auto dropping device won’t catch it before getting to Blackfriars. The rear pan will still be in contact for longer.

 

[Ianno87]

That’s what’s happened before. The distance between the two stations is very short, so if the front pan over extends AIUI the auto dropping device won’t catch it before getting to Blackfriars. The rear pan will still be in contact for longer.

Presumably the train can carry on applying power (via the rear pan) until the auto dropping activates?

 

[island]

So what happened in this case? Did the pan come off the wires after City Thameslink or something?

Yes, save that it is (I think) a rigid bar rather than wires.

 

[swt_passenger]

Presumably the train can carry on applying power (via the rear pan) until the auto dropping activates?

Not sure how the ADD works across the two half-trains...

 

[island]

I'd say that this is used more for a SPAD or opening the doors wrong side, missing a stop or something than a derailment. I think you should not jump to the latter conclusion whenever you see that stated!

More often than any of the above it’s used to indicate a one-under.

 

[dk1]

The overhead continues right through to City Thameslink anyway. The pan only comes off the wires just a short distance before Blackfriars southbound.

Ahh fair enough. Cheers for that.

 

[bengley]

Thought that was all automatic now?

Empty stock train

Automatic changeover only works when the train stops.

More often than any of the above it’s used to indicate a one-under.

That's normally 'Emergency services dealing with an incident'

Yes, save that it is (I think) a rigid bar rather than wires.

It's wires at City. The bar is only in the St Pancras area.

 

[Jim]

More often than any of the above it’s used to indicate a one-under.

I've never once on National Rail heard a one under referred to as an operating incident!

 

[D6130]

I've never once on National Rail heard a one under referred to as an operating incident!

In my day it was always referred to publicly as 'an incident on the line'.

 

[QueensCurve]

Correct

Is there no engineered protection to prevent this?

 

[LAX54]

So when in passenger service Class 9, the pan drops auto, but when in ecs mode, the pan has to be lowered by the driver, just sounds like an accident waiting to happen....oh it did !

 

[bengley]

So when in passenger service Class 9, the pan drops auto, but when in ecs mode, the pan has to be lowered by the driver, just sounds like an accident waiting to happen....oh it did !

Indeed - drivers rarely have to manually do the changeover now, so they are more likely to make a mistake on the rare occasion they do have to

Is there no engineered protection to prevent this?

Only when the train stops in passenger service!

 

[Peter C]

Just seen this on Twitter:

If you're wondering why there is disruption at Blackfriars this is why, the front pantograph wasnt lowered and as it came through City Thameslink and ran out of overhead it went to full height and has hit my office building

https://twitter.com/oo_gauge_models/status/1426464116034752512

-Peter

 

[yorkie]

Just a gentle reminder that any speculative posts should be made in the appropriate forum section please.

Some posts have been moved here.