Overground/Crossrail takeover of Greater Anglia inners

[jon0844]

Don't worry about me. Worry about those who will be ranting on Twitter once they find out!

(Who cares that it's much the same on other trains, like Pendolinos for example).

 

[Dave1987]

Don't worry about me. Worry about those who will be ranting on Twitter once they find out!

(Who cares that it's much the same on other trains, like Pendolinos for example).

Pendos only have them at table seats but because its Virgin then it's ok remember. Much the same as it will probably be perfectly ok for MTR Crossrail to have the same amount of delays and cancellations as they will be "clearing up the mess left by Abellio".

 

[dk1]

Pendos only have them at table seats but because its Virgin then it's ok remember. Much the same as it will probably be perfectly ok for MTR Crossrail to have the same amount of delays and cancellations as they will be "clearing up the mess left by Abellio".

Was told that the Pendolino problem exists because of the carriage profile & hence they are on sides of tables. Perhaps the First plan to re-seat the fleet was to allow seat based sockets like on their HSTs.

 

[CapitalStar378]

From a passengers point of view, where lines cross in real life is irrelevant. There are similar examples on the existing tube map, eg Bow Church should be east of Bow Road, the DC line into Euston should be north of St Johns Wood.

Yes but the entire stretch of line is in the wrong place, the ELL is west of the WA line by about a mile but is shown completely opposite on the LO map.

 

[dosxuk]

Yes but the entire stretch of line is in the wrong place, the ELL is west of the WA line by about a mile but is shown completely opposite on the LO map.

Well this is more geographically accurate, but harder to understand...

 

[306024]

And to win the pedants medal, the line from Shoreditch High St to Whitechapel runs above the GE line from Liverpool St to Bethnal Green Actually that looks a neat representation.

While it was being built, this was the bridge that a GE driver saw drop an inch or two during the evening peak. Chaos was not the word.

Only a few weeks to go before each company blames the next for any delays at Liverpool St, or for all of them to gang up together on Network Rail.

 

[theorangeone]

Where do you get the entire map from? I haven't seen this map in circulation; I suppose it could just be because I'm looking in the wrong place.

 

[cjohnson]

Where do you get the entire map from? I haven't seen this map in circulation; I suppose it could just be because I'm looking in the wrong place.

It's on the large print timetable PDFs that have just been uploaded onto the TfL site.
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/modes/london-overground/london-overground-timetables

 

[jopsuk]

is there an official version of the Underground map yet with the new Crossrail & TfL Rail services shown?

 

[ainsworth74]

Was told that the Pendolino problem exists because of the carriage profile & hence they are on sides of tables. Perhaps the First plan to re-seat the fleet was to allow seat based sockets like on their HSTs.

I was always under the impression that it was simply when they were built sockets weren't seen as such a big thing (not as many mobile phones that needed constant charging) so putting them at every table was seen as being sufficient. If it was a profile thing they could surely have put them under the seats in the same way that FGW HSTs or 180s have them (and it avoids traipsing cables around a stranger if you're in the aisle seat)?

 

[Starmill]

From the Timetable change on 17th may the 2345 London Liverpool Street to Bishops Stortford via Edmonton Green appears to have been canned. Once operated by LOROL it will terminate at Chesunt - without a connection for stations Broxbourne to Bishops Stortford inclusive. This will affect anyone travelling from Bethnal Green to Theobalds Grove inclusive travelling beyond Chesunt - the last train of the night just got a lot earlier. Only 4 minutes earlier for the last train from Cheshunt though. Unlikely anyone will be there to be inconvenienced, but it does seem somewhat silly!

 

[306024]

Unlikely anyone will be there to be inconvenienced, but it does seem somewhat silly!

Only silly if you believe that "travel has an intrinsic positive utility and is valued for its own sake, not just as a means of reaching a destination." If as you say it is unlikely that anyone will be there to be inconvenienced, how can it be silly?

The alternative for some is to use the nearest Lea Valley station instead and catch the 23.42 Liverpool St to Hertford East, which does connect at Cheshunt or Broxbourne into the last train to Stortford.

The 23.45 Liverpool St to Stortford only used to continue in passenger service beyond Cheshunt as the units were required to stable at Stortford, and to avoid the driver having to wake up anyone who had nodded off, no staff at Cheshunt at that time of night. Now there is no requirement for the units to go there, that dubious duty falls to the new station staff. Strikes me as a small price to pay compared to the big improvements to the Sunday timetable for example.

 

[Philip C]

From the Timetable change on 17th may the 2345 London Liverpool Street to Bishops Stortford via Edmonton Green appears to have been canned.

The alternative for some is to use the nearest Lea Valley station instead and catch the 23.42 Liverpool St to Hertford East, which does connect at Cheshunt or Broxbourne into the last train to Stortford.

The 23.45 Liverpool St to Stortford only used to continue in passenger service beyond Cheshunt as the units were required to stable at Stortford, and to avoid the driver having to wake up anyone who had nodded off, no staff at Cheshunt at that time of night. Now there is no requirement for the units to go there, that dubious duty falls to the new station staff. Strikes me as a small price to pay compared to the big improvements to the Sunday timetable for example.

The 2345 appears to continue to operate but TfL has failed to get its act together and has published a timetable of ITS OWN TRAINS ONLY! This is very unhelpful, but consistent with its approach to publicity in respect of Southern services between New Cross Gate and West Croydon etc. A little note "LE" appears against Liverpool Street, Hackney Downs, Seven Sisters, Edmonton Green and Cheshunt stations pointing you towards Abellio timetables for more information. Of course Abellio shows only its own services and the Network Rail website, which may ultimately show the combined service, is, less than two weeks before the changeover, devoid of any public timetables at all. So much for serving the customer!

Quite why TfL takes this attitude defeats my understanding. It does, for instance, mean that half the peak service between Edmonton Green and Cheshunt doesn't appear in the timetable it publishes for a line it has made a big fuss about taking over.

 

[306024]

Good points well made. At least for the West Anglia timetable up until December hang on to the timetables produced by Abellio starting 17 May for the two weeks before TfL take over, they show everything and don't change on 31 May.

 

[Clip]

The 2345 appears to continue to operate but TfL has failed to get its act together and has published a timetable of ITS OWN TRAINS ONLY! This is very unhelpful, but consistent with its approach to publicity in respect of Southern services between New Cross Gate and West Croydon etc. A little note "LE" appears against Liverpool Street, Hackney Downs, Seven Sisters, Edmonton Green and Cheshunt stations pointing you towards Abellio timetables for more information. Of course Abellio shows only its own services and the Network Rail website, which may ultimately show the combined service, is, less than two weeks before the changeover, devoid of any public timetables at all. So much for serving the customer!

Quite why TfL takes this attitude defeats my understanding. It does, for instance, mean that half the peak service between Edmonton Green and Cheshunt doesn't appear in the timetable it publishes for a line it has made a big fuss about taking over.

But TfL taking over is going to be awesome we were all told and improve everything we were told.

This is just the start and is shoddy to say the very least. They have come on leaps and bounds but not taking into account other rail services that also stop at their stations and beyond is undoing all their good work with LO.

 

[Starmill]

Only silly if you believe that "travel has an intrinsic positive utility and is valued for its own sake, not just as a means of reaching a destination." If as you say it is unlikely that anyone will be there to be inconvenienced, how can it be silly?

Whatever you say mate. :roll: Won't waste my keystrokes.

 

[306024]

But TfL taking over is going to be awesome we were all told and improve everything we were told.

Surely there is only room for one awesome operator in the industry

Whatever you say mate. :roll: Won't waste my keystrokes.

Please accept my apologies for entering the debate and having a joke :roll:

 

[LeeLivery]

The 2345 appears to continue to operate but TfL has failed to get its act together and has published a timetable of ITS OWN TRAINS ONLY! This is very unhelpful, but consistent with its approach to publicity in respect of Southern services between New Cross Gate and West Croydon etc. A little note "LE" appears against Liverpool Street, Hackney Downs, Seven Sisters, Edmonton Green and Cheshunt stations pointing you towards Abellio timetables for more information. Of course Abellio shows only its own services and the Network Rail website, which may ultimately show the combined service, is, less than two weeks before the changeover, devoid of any public timetables at all. So much for serving the customer!

Quite why TfL takes this attitude defeats my understanding. It does, for instance, mean that half the peak service between Edmonton Green and Cheshunt doesn't appear in the timetable it publishes for a line it has made a big fuss about taking over.

Agreed. It's also made it more confusing because they've put the double arrow at stations which are only served at peaks by AGA. They should really make it clear, as AGA running fast peak services will help LO to have less packed trains.

 

[badassunicorn]

So what if any GA services will run scheduled via Southbury after the split? There are also a lot of rumors that LOROL won't let GA send trains round there during disruption? Can they do that?

 

[swt_passenger]

Agreed. It's also made it more confusing because they've put the double arrow at stations which are only served at peaks by AGA. They should really make it clear, as AGA running fast peak services will help LO to have less packed trains.

Using the NRTT code 'LE' appears petty to me, and possibly intentionally confusing to the average member of the public, who'd perhaps expect to see GA?

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

...There are also a lot of rumors that LOROL won't let GA send trains round there during disruption? Can they do that?

Not at all, it will be down to NR's regulating decisions at the time surely? Are there any signs of preferential treatment on other common lines of route on NR infrastructure?

 

[dk1]

I was always under the impression that it was simply when they were built sockets weren't seen as such a big thing (not as many mobile phones that needed constant charging) so putting them at every table was seen as being sufficient.

I wondered that but then the Voyager fleet had then at every seat.

 

[badassunicorn]

Using the NRTT code 'LE' appears petty to me, and possibly intentionally confusing to the average member of the public, who'd perhaps expect to see GA?

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---



Not at all, it will be down to NR's regulating decisions at the time surely? Are there any signs of preferential treatment on other common lines of route on NR infrastructure?

What does LE stand for?

 

[swt_passenger]

What does LE stand for?

Is it London Eastern? I think it has been fairly consistent in the NRTT for a while, but not exactly well understood by the public.

Similarly I wonder if VTEC will still show as GR in the next version?

 

[greatkingrat]

So what if any GA services will run scheduled via Southbury after the split? There are also a lot of rumors that LOROL won't let GA send trains round there during disruption? Can they do that?

There are 4 SB in the AM peak and 5 NB in the PM peak to/from Hertford East. Plus a few late night trains that can presumably run either way depending on what engineering work is happening.

I think GA services would still be able to go via Seven Sisters during disruption, however it may be a regulating issue, eg in the past GA could choose to delay a stopper a few minutes to allow a diverted fast train to get out first, while in the future the LO service may get priority and the fast train forced to follow it.

 

[LeeLivery]

What does LE stand for?

I've been wondering this since 'one' Railway.

 

[Philip C]

So what if any GA services will run scheduled via Southbury after the split? There are also a lot of rumors that LOROL won't let GA send trains round there during disruption? Can they do that?

I can spot:
WEEKDAYS
0627SX, 0657SX, 0727SX, 0757SX, 2339SX Hertford East - Liverpool Street
0438SO, 2251SX Cambridge - Liverpool Street
2330SX, 2345SX Stansted Airport - Liverpool Street
SUNDAYS
2330, 2345 Stansted Airport - Liverpool Street

WEEKDAYS
1641SX, 1711SX, 1741SX, 1811SX, 1841SX L St - Hertford East

And that appears to be the lot.

MY PREVIOUS ASSERTION THAT THE 2345 ex. LIVERPOOL STREET CONTINUED TO RUN VIA SEVEN SISTERS WAS WRONG! Sorry. Abellio has also produced an interim timetable (Table D) showing all services running via Seven Sisters. My comments about TfL stand (at least for now!)

I've yet to spot any train running via Seven Sisters and South Tottenham - Any offers?

 

[badassunicorn]

Is it up to the signaller as to which train out of two TOC's gets priority? Would a 1B Stanex take priority over a 2U?

 

[TheEdge]

I've been wondering this since 'one' Railway.

It is London Eastern. I think its the official name of the company holding the franchise, or leasing it out, or something!

 

[badassunicorn]

Its funny you mention it actually, as I see a lot of company documents with LER and London Eastern Railway but I've never been able to find any reason for it or uses anywhere else

 

[LeeLivery]

It is London Eastern. I think its the official name of the company holding the franchise, or leasing it out, or something!

Ahhh yes! I quick search comes up with London Eastern Railway ltd being registered by National Express. Like GR, why hasn't that changed?