Parliamentary services and stations in next Northern Franchise

[thenorthern]

With Arriva it's difficult to say what they would go given a lot has changed since they were last awarded a franchise and they are currently undergoing restructuring and DB are set to float part of the business on the London Stock Exchange.

I wonder if with a bit of White Spirit they could remove the Northern Rail livery from the trains and underneath find the old Arriva Trains Northern Livery to save money on doing a complete re-paint.

 

[pemma]

They wouldn`t find it on that many trains. ATN`s 150s still had RR livery, while their 155s, 144s, 321s and 333s had Metro Train livery. The 158s had either Metro or TPE liveries. While 4 of the 156s which had ATN livery went to EMT.

It might be easier to find trains in the Northern fleet which used to have Central liveries.

 

[thenorthern]

Am I right in thinking that Thameslink is the only TOC brand name to have disappeared from the railway network and then return at a later date?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Am I right in thinking that Thameslink is the only TOC brand name to have disappeared from the railway network and then return at a later date?

Sort of, though the Thameslink name was a Network SouthEast invention rather than one that came about with privatisation.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I wonder if with a bit of White Spirit they could remove the Northern Rail livery from the trains and underneath find the old Arriva Trains Northern Livery to save money on doing a complete re-paint.

Not being au fait with that matter, are any of the Northern Rail fleet vinyl rather that paint applied in their external coatings?

 

[pemma]

Am I right in thinking that Thameslink is the only TOC brand name to have disappeared from the railway network and then return at a later date?

What about Merseyrail?

MTL operated services under the 'Merseyrail Electrics' name, then when Arriva bought the business it became 'Arriva Trains Merseyside' and then became 'Merseyrail' again under the current Abellio/Serco operations (officially registered as Merseyrail Electrics 2002 Limited.)

 

[thenorthern]

What about Merseyrail?

MTL operated services under the 'Merseyrail Electrics' name, then when Arriva bought the business it became 'Arriva Trains Merseyside' and then became 'Merseyrail' again under the current Abellio/Serco operations (officially registered as Merseyrail Electrics 2002 Limited.)

Good point I hadn't thought of that one.

Although not necessarily Parliamentary stations one thing Northern Rail did do that I was impressed with was end the system that had been in place for many years at several Tyneside stations which each received only a handful of trains each day.

 

[kieron]

The airshow has not been cancelled, but postponed until next May.

Although the presence of the Avro Vulcan bomber at the show has been cancelled as it will have been grounded by then.

I suppose it's lucky for the Rhyl show that the CAA have only restricted manoeuvres over land.

 

[Class 170101]

Pre-May 2016 timetable change the new operator will just keep everything as Northern have left it, then they can start implementing changes to diagrams and services with the first major changes likely to be the December 2017 timetable change.

Depends when the timetable bid date is. I have a feeling the Winter LTP TT has to be bid around March 2016 (for a start date in December 2016) - that doesn't leave much time for incoming bidders to change things.

 

[WatcherZero]

What about Merseyrail?

MTL operated services under the 'Merseyrail Electrics' name, then when Arriva bought the business it became 'Arriva Trains Merseyside' and then became 'Merseyrail' again under the current Abellio/Serco operations (officially registered as Merseyrail Electrics 2002 Limited.)

Wasnt that because in 2002 the PTE took over franchising and mandated the name be used rather thanthe operator choosing the branding independently.

 

[thenorthern]

Wasnt that because in 2002 the PTE took over franchising and mandated the name be used rather thanthe operator choosing the branding independently.

That maybe the case as Arriva operated the line as Arriva Trains Merseyside.

 

[childwallblues]

I reside next to this line and it's surprisingly quite busy Mon-Sat. the trains generally are the Freightliner operated waste containers to from Runcorn every couple of hours or so (both directions) also less frequently are the Heavyhaul workings plus a few light engine moves, sometimes up to 5 66/70s coupled together. DBS also run the Warrington-Doncaster Europort service this way (Mon-Weds.)conveying new Citroen commercial vehicles plus several aggregate type trains daily, it also seems a popular route for the Northern Belle and other charters, seems just as busy in the night as it is in the daytime, much to my wife's annoyance!

Liverpool to Drax biomass services will be running that way.

 

[thenorthern]

Will anything new happen to Pontefract Baghill in the next franchise? Somehow I doubt it.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Will anything new happen to Pontefract Baghill in the next franchise? Somehow I doubt it.

Does anyone know the reason why Pontefract Baghill should have a DfT category rating of F1, rather than F2?

 

[Carlisle]

Not being au fait with that matter, are any of the Northern Rail fleet vinyl rather that paint applied in their external coatings?

I don't think any are full body side vinyl on Northern except the few done up as all over advert units

 

[glbotu]

Does anyone know the reason why Pontefract Baghill should have a DfT category rating of F1, rather than F2?

Could you explain F1/F2 categories?

 

[swt_passenger]

Could you explain F1/F2 categories?

It's from the definitions in the Green/Hall Better Rail Stations report presented to DfT back in Nov 2009.

An F station is the most basic unstaffed station, but the subdivision into F1 and F2 is based on passenger numbers, specifically an F2 station would not get a TVM, or a carpark.

Unstaffed ‘F’ Stations
1,192 unstaffed stations which form almost half the total number of stations. The ‘F’ stations are further sub-divided into F1 (basic) and F2 (below 100,000 journeys per annum) to avoid the provision of unnecessary facilities at the very small stations. Trips are typically up to 250,000 per annum and ticket revenue up to £1 million.

http://collections.europarchive.org...er/stations/betterrailstations/pdf/report.pdf

 

[glbotu]

Excellent, thanks.

 

[adrock1976]

Regarding the present parliamentary/limited service routes and stations, and in relation to the earlier DfT document, I have a few thoughts in my mind in how to improve the services.

1) The section of the Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire Railway between Sheffield Midland and Worksop/Retford is to have its frequency doubled from every 60 minutes to every 30 minutes by means of a short working. The Sheffield - Lincoln Central service to remain every 60 minutes at present, with a short working between Sheffield and Retford every 60 minutes. This would combine to give a frequency of every 30 minutes between Sheffield and Retford, also retimed slightly to give better connections from the Nottingham - Worksop service. The Sheffield - Retford service could be extended every 2 hours to Grimsby Town/Cleethorpes via Brigg as an experimental service.

2) The present Sheffield Midland - York via Pontefract Baghill to be improved to every 2 hours thoughout the day. This would provide Pontefract with improved access to the Intercity network on a north-south axis.

3) The proposed Manchester Victoria - Chester/Ellesmere Port service via Warrington Bank Quay to operate every 60 minutes between Manchester Victoria and Helsby, with one train every 2 hours continuing to Chester and one every 2 hours to Ellesmere Port. This would improve the frequency between Ellesmere Port and Warrington BQ/Manchester, and would have the potential of attracting some passengers at Ince & Elton as there appears to be a recentish residential development south of that station.

4) The Halton Curve when the works are completed to have a Liverpool Lime Street - Chester service every 60 minutes, with one train every 2 hours continuing to Holyhead, and one train every 2 hours continuing to Cardiff Central via Wrexham, Shrewsbury, and Hereford. Perhaps a partnership could be formed with the operaters of the Wales & Borders/Welsh Government in regards to developing such a service?

5) The present Leeds City - Knottingley service to be extended every 2 hours to Goole as an experimental service. This would greatly improve the present level of service it presently receives.

6) The famous Stockport - Stalybridge Fridays Only service to remain as a shuttle between those points for the time being, but to operate every 2 hours daily. In time, this could gradually be increased to every 60 minutes, and maybe operate as a local Stockport - Huddersfield all stations service. This would obviously have to have a good connection at Stalybridge for Manchester to and from the local stations between Huddersfield and Stalybridge, and may or may not reduce some of the congestion along the route.

By starting off with a 2 hourly service, this means that the service level could be increased from there, as was demonstrated on the Great Central Railway/Great Western Railway Alternative Route when Network SouthEast introduced the London Marylebone - Birmingham Snow Hill service back in 1993. That route now sees 2 trains every hour today after going from every 2 hours - every 60 minutes - 2 trains per hour.

 

[Bletchleyite]

6) The famous Stockport - Stalybridge Fridays Only service to remain as a shuttle between those points for the time being, but to operate every 2 hours daily. In time, this could gradually be increased to every 60 minutes, and maybe operate as a local Stockport - Huddersfield all stations service. This would obviously have to have a good connection at Stalybridge for Manchester to and from the local stations between Huddersfield and Stalybridge, and may or may not reduce some of the congestion along the route.

This train lost much of its raison d'etre when TPE services were concentrated on Piccadilly. Now some are moving or have moved back to Vic, an hourly service would potentially be useful again.