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Plymouth Bretonide Bus station redevelopment plans.

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83G/84D

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£42m leisure complex to replace bus station

Plans to redevelop Plymouth's Bretonside bus station into £42m leisure complex have been announced.

The proposals include a 12-screen cinema, 13 restaurants and 400 car park spaces on the site.

A multimillion-pound coach hub is also planned for the Mayflower West End car park which is earmarked for demolition.

British Land, the owners of Drake Circus, is the company behind the project and claim it could create 350 jobs and 260 construction jobs.

Councillor Mark Lowry, cabinet member for finance at Plymouth City Council, said: "For a long time we have recognised that Bretonside has long passed its sell-by date.

"We also want to keep shoppers coming into the West End. These schemes have the potential to address both of these."

The proposal includes a venture between the council and Plymouth University to transform Taylor Maxwell House, which currently houses a shop on the ground level and empty offices above, with facilities for fledgling businesses in a central location.

Professor Julian Beer, from the university, said: "The new innovation centre will offer a pathway into the city's economy and marketplace for talented graduates and young entrepreneurs."
Link:- www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-26737542


No mention of a replacement bus station. The old Bretonside bus station won't be missed but one wonders if the bus companies can manage without a replacement. Perhaps a site has yet to be located.
 
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feline1

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Demolish a bus station and replace it with a 400-space carpark?

That's one helluva commitment to sustainable public transport.

One wonders if Jeremy Clarkson will be invited to personally smash up the old bus station with a HAMMER.<D
 

Surreyman

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Demolish a bus station and replace it with a 400-space carpark?

That's one helluva commitment to sustainable public transport.

One wonders if Jeremy Clarkson will be invited to personally smash up the old bus station with a HAMMER.<D

i agree with your comments but Bretonside has to be one of the most unpleasant bus stations in the UK, last time i walked around it (early evening but daylight) It felt menacing and I couldn't get out quick enough.
 

Temple Meads

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i agree with your comments but Bretonside has to be one of the most unpleasant bus stations in the UK, last time i walked around it (early evening but daylight) It felt menacing and I couldn't get out quick enough.

Agreed, Bretonside really is rather grim, although Exeter isn't far behind IMO.
 

455driver

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Just seen that on the news, Plymouth really needs another poxy cinema and the present car parks are never full either.

The idea to put the new bus station at the bottom of town (on the present site of a car park) sounds good until you actually look at the vehicular access to it!
 

Rich McLean

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There will now be an Vue, Odeon, Cineworld and the Reel Cinema all in Plymouth.

The Large Majority of Buses in Plymouth don't use Bretonside anymore. Most use Royal Parade these days

Nuts
 
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83G/84D

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Just seen that on the news, Plymouth really needs another poxy cinema and the present car parks are never full either.

The idea to put the new bus station at the bottom of town (on the present site of a car park) sounds good until you actually look at the vehicular access to it!

The article mentions a coach park on the site of a car park not a bus station.
 

83G/84D

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I take it you are being pedantic simply because I used the term bus station instead of coach station! :roll:

No I wasn't being pedantic, the following article mentions a caoch park which I would assume to be a pick up/ drop off / parking area for visiting coach services such as National Holidays etc rather than for scheduled local bus services.

Anyway here is the article in it's entireity so make up your own mind:-



Leisure complex to be built on Bretonside in £50million Plymouth city centre overhaul
By Plymouth Herald | Posted: March 25, 2014
By KEITH ROSSITER Political Reporter @krossiter


THE decrepit Bretonside bus station is to be torn down and a 12-screen cinema and restaurant complex will be built in its place.
The bus station will be moved to a new “coach hub” on the old Mayflower West car park.
The schemes are part of a £50million transformation of Plymouth city centre unveiled this afternoon by council leader Tudor Evans.
British Land, which owns Drake Circus and is the UK’s largest listed retail landlord, is to buy Bretonside coach station.
The company will build a cinema complex, including an Imax cinema in a £42million development, which is to open in 2017.
The new complex will restore the links between the city centre and the Barbican and waterfront.
‘Drake Circus Leisure’ includes a 12-screen cinema complex, 13 restaurants and parking for 420 cars on two levels.
Cllr Evans said: “This is a company with a proven record of delivering in Plymouth and for Plymouth, and while it is early days this looks an incredibly exciting prospect.
“Our city centre supports more than 14,000 jobs and 14 per cent of the workforce, but we need to need to mix things up a bit, bring more business and a wider offer into the city centre – which in turn brings in more people to shop, eat and enjoy what we have here.”
Cllr Mark Lowry, the Cabinet member for finance , said: “For a long time we have recognised that Bretonside has long passed its sell-by date. We also want to keep shoppers coming into the West End. These two schemes have the potential to address both of these.”
He said British Land had been “talking to the market” and already had sufficient interest in the development.
The ambitious city centre plan will see improvements to Old Town Street and Frankfort Gate, and a new children’s play area in Armada Way.
The city council will open a new front office for 80 staff in the old Lawson Building in New George Street.
The council is moving out of the Civic Centre by the end of this year and the building will be handed over to Argyle boss James Brent to redevelop as a hotel.
The city centre has already seen a £7.3million refurbishment of the Theatre Royal and its surrounds.
The university is building a £7million performing arts centre on North Hill, and Plymouth College of Art is spending £8million on its new workshops at Drake Circus.

The historic Drake’s Reservoir on North Hill has been restored thanks to £1.4million of Heritage Lottery Fund cash.
Meanwhile, the city is bidding to transform the City Museum into £24million History Centre.
Cllr Lowry said plans to redevelop Colin Campbell Court in the West End were pushing ahead.
As part of the proposals a new £2million multi-million pound coach hub is envisaged on the site of the soon-to-be-demolished Mayflower West car park, in the West End.
There will also be street-level public parking for 120 cars.
The agreement means that both Bretonside and the West End of Plymouth will see investment worth millions of pounds, which in turn will generate a new level of interest in both areas. It will also create almost 350 operational jobs and around 260 construction jobs.
Doug Fletcher, chair of the City Centre Company, said: “I am delighted to see the council prioritising the city centre given its importance to Plymouth.
“The Plan for the City Centre is to be welcomed and in particular it is pleasing that the West End is being prioritised with a new coach station and council premises becoming major new anchors and driving vital footfall.”
Conservative Opposition Leader Cllr Ian Bowyer said: “There are some potential problems with these proposals.
"Naturally we welcome and support the general policy of bringing forward plans to revitalise and redevelop our city centre but plans are plans and we need to see action to make it happen."
He said Government policies had put in place an economic recovery, but added: "I do wonder whether the council has factored in the amazing growth in internet shopping when deciding to how to best support the city’s traders and shoppers.
"Is the local economy strong enough to support and sustain another 13 restaurants on the Viaduct?
"How will this impact on the Barbican, the Hoe, and Royal William Yard?"
He said he wished the plans had reconnected the bombed-out Charles Church to the city.
Cllr Ian Darcy, the Conservative spokesman for economic development, was concerned about “cinema saturation” in the city.
"I doubt there is demand for a further 12 screens in the City Centre, less than a mile from the existing offering at Coxside.
"These plans seem to concentrate on leisure activities, rather than bringing full-time quality jobs to Plymouth."
He was also concerned about the impact of the Bretonside plans on independent traders in the West End.
"This could turn out to be the final nail in the coffin for the West End.
"We have been pressing Labour to produce a strategic plan to address the future for our city centre yet all we seem to get is ad hoc tinkering around the edges.
"It’s time the council got serious about the city centre.”
Bretonside redevelopment
The £42million Drake Circus Leisure development at Bretonside will see extensive improvements to public areas with features, installations seating and planting.
Stairs will lead through the development, from Bretonside to Exeter Street and Old Town Street, transforming the link between the city centre and the Barbican and Waterfront.
The scheme will make it more attractive and easier for visitors and shoppers to move from one to the other.
Exeter Street Viaduct will become a “shared space” road, with bus stops outside the new development.
“We intend to remove all the ugly and dated street furniture and put in natural materials to upgrade that part of the city,” Cllr Lowry said.
Passers by along what is now Exeter Street Viaduct will see restaurant windows instead of blank walls.
The restaurants themselves will have views to the south of Sutton Harbour and the Barbican.
“We have spent a lot of time ensuring that this addresses our needs as a city,” Cllr Lowry said.
The developments are all subject to the normal planning procedures, and will require detailed design.
Cllr Lowry said: “For some time we have been trying to redevelop Bretonside because it’s something of an eyesore and people constantly write to The Herald about it.”
He was confident that the project would go ahead. “British Land does not need to borrow the money to do this. It’s a FTSE 100 company with hundreds of millions in cash and clearly is looking to spend some of that in a productive way.”
The project has taken 12 to 18 months to get to this stage, and has involved land deals, due diligence processes and legal agreements to be drawn up.
The new development will bring in about £1million a year in business rates for the council, which will help to pay for public services.
New coach station
The Mayflower Coach Station on the footprint of the old Mayflower West car park will be a hub for intercity coach services.
There will be seven bays for long-distance coach services, waiting room, booking office, toilets and
significant improvements to the look and feel of the streets around the site as well as more parking.
The existing accesses to the Mayflower West car park will be retained and improved.
The bridge link to Sainsbury’s will be demolished.
The coach station will also have a taxi rank.
Passengers will be able to get to their coaches through these entrances or through a new gateway, ticket office and waiting area in Taylor Maxwell House.
Cllr Lowry said: “People arriving or leaving will be in the town and can use all the city’s facilities.
“They will also be closer to the train station if necessary.
“We have estimated that the coach station alone will bring 200,000 people a year to that part of the city centre.
“This forms a substantial part of our plan to support and revitalise the city centre. There is still a long way to go, but this shows our commitment.”
He said the sale of the Bretonside site to British Land will over the cost of redeveloping the Mayflower West site.
Innovation centre
The council has bought Taylor Maxwell House, which is home to an Iceland store on the ground level and empty offices above.
The council is working with Plymouth University in a joint venture to create an ‘innovation centre’ in the now empty offices.

The centre would house start-ups businesses run by graduates.
Professor Julian Beer, the university’s Pro Vice-Chancellor (regional enterprise), said: “The new innovation centre will offer a pathway into the city’s economy and marketplace for talented graduates and young entrepreneurs, and will work in tandem with our Formation Zone incubation spaces here on campus, the Science Park, and the GAIN network.
“From our experience of running the hugely successful Innovation Centres in Cornwall, such creative ecosystems offer a great opportunity for businesses to work together and develop joint pitches and expertise.”
Shopping evolves
Cllr Lowry said the change in shopping behaviour made the city centre transformation essential.
The average UK consumer now spends £2,500 a year online. Online spending grew 12per cent last year.
“We have to think differently about how the city centre feels.”
Paul Barnard said that 14per cent of the city’s jobs are in the city centre, and the council has a strong track record of resisting out-of-town shopping developments.



Read more: http://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/Lei...tory-20849595-detail/story.html#ixzz2x6I5hQ19
 

richw

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Do scheduled bus services even use the current bus station? I was photographing coaches there and not a single bus service entered other than to park up between services. I was there for around 30 minutes mid week afternoon a few weeks back.
If bus services aren't using it then they don't need a bus station.
It was full of coaches though, coming and going.
 

455driver

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There are a few services that use it.

If the site at the bottom of town is the one I think it is (Colin Campbell Court carpark) then it is going to be quite a squeeze to get everything in there!
 

Rich McLean

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There are a few services that use it.

If the site at the bottom of town is the one I think it is (Colin Campbell Court carpark) then it is going to be quite a squeeze to get everything in there!

It's proposed to be located at the current site of Mayflower west car park, between Cornwall street and Mayflower street, at the west end
 

richw

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There are a few services that use it.

If the site at the bottom of town is the one I think it is (Colin Campbell Court carpark) then it is going to be quite a squeeze to get everything in there!

It says Mayflower car park is the one going to be demolished for the coach station in the article
Mayflower is the multistory by Iceland. I understand the structure is crumbling, and the car park was closed for quite some time for structural safety issues.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=ma...B64CL00GwFllYXlqPyIG8g&cbp=12,148.61,,0,24.81
Street view allows you to go in further. but I have used at this position to show the surrounding shops for point of reference.
You can see the size of the car park at present on street view, it is a big area.
 

455driver

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Thanks, I know the one you mean, it is going to be a very small site with very restricted access, the plans will be an interesting read.
 

plymothian

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Whilst the present bus station in its current state is deplorable, it is much better than any alternative that would be proposed on any brownfield site that wouldn't involve demolishing existing buildings.

The Mayflower coach park would
(i) be too small for all the visiting coaches to park up - it would be a drop and go station, leaving the problem of where the coaches are supposed to park.
(ii) be too small to accommodate the service buses that use Bretonside, thus pushing them on to Royal Parade - which is over capacity as it is at the moment.
(iii) increase pressure on Mayflower Street, which is too narrow for the amount of traffic using it at present.
(iv) not be able to accommodate any service buses on layover. Even more so for late drivers' meal breaks (there's not enough capacity at the depots to accommodate layover buses).

Bretonside as a site is ideal to be redeveloped BUT still incorporating a bus/coach station.
(i) the buildings under the 'viaduct' are not structurally integral, and so can be stripped out and realigned to provide better waiting facilities.
(ii) an upper deck can be built level with the 'viaduct' if necessary, which can either accommodate local bus services (with coaches downstairs), or retail development.
(iii) lifts can be easily installed to link upper and lower decks.
(iv) if an upper deck is not wanted, then simple shelters/RTI/canopy can be provided
(v) relocate some bus departures from Royal Parade [this however will not happen, because service bus users are inherently lazy and won't want to walk that far!]
(vi) employ a bus station controller/assistant to patrol the area and provide assistance.
 
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83G/84D

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Plymothian - You talk a lot of sense and your proposals are well thought out and would actually work.

Shame the council and developers don't think like you, they should be encouraging people to get out of their cars and use public transport into the City. All these plans will do is create more car parking and congestion on the roads.
 
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Greenback

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I like Plymouth, but that is despite not because of some of the decisions that have been taken by the local authorities down the years. The city has much to commend it, but also some very ugly bits, of which Bretonside is one.
 

plymothian

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Bretonside is only a dump because its been allowed to get that way because no one has bothered with it aside a lick of paint when it needed proper investment and vision. Like all councils there is little want to invest in transport aside road schemes under the guise of safety.

I suspect, like all previous Bretonside plans, this has come out because there's an election due and/or the sale of the land is worth a quick buck.

Once the Mayflower has been built, how long will it be left high and dry to decay through lack of investment?
 

Greenback

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I'm sure that you're right and that is the case with all of the other ugly bits. The point is, as you say, that the authorities allow this to happen.

I'm sorry for Plymouth, particularly as there has always been a bit of affinity between this area and the south west. A lot of my friends chose to attend Plymouth Uni at various times, so there was a lot of travelling between Swansea and Plymouth to be done back in the day!
 

cambsy

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Plymouth city council is not the only one who has deplorable bus/coach stations in the South West, Exeter and Taunton spring to mind, seems to be a thing down here, that the councils are happy with a shoddy coach/bus station.
 

Rapidash

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At least they have bus stations. Torquay could certainly do with one. The habourside does get a wee bit busy with all the services starting there.
 

BigVince76

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I used to live in Plymouth, I left 12 years ago. The bus station was a squalid mess back then, but I really liked it! I used to go and see punk bands in the cafe at night, oh dear I feel really old.

As an aside from reading this thread I thought I may pay a visit to Plymouth next month because I will be in Exeter for a few days. I just looked at the X38 timetable, when did this get so bad? Back in 2002 the buses where hourly and took just over an hour to do the trip. Now the service is every 2 hours and takes 1:40. This doesn't seem very good, do they still have the cool bendy coaches on the route, I rather liked them!
 

plymothian

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Re X38. No they don't have bendies any more, and the service has to be split to get around the EU rules for long distance routes (so a layover with 'guaranteed connections' had to be introduced at Buckfastleigh) which extended the time.

Re Torquay. It does have a bus station!
 

BigVince76

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Re X38. No they don't have bendies any more, and the service has to be split to get around the EU rules for long distance routes (so a layover with 'guaranteed connections' had to be introduced at Buckfastleigh) which extended the time.

Re Torquay. It does have a bus station!

What was this EU rule supposed to achieve? Or is it a case of Stagecoach trying to dodge some fee or something? Seems a shame the service is so bad, especially while the rail link is broken.
 
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