Porterbrook donate two HST Power Cars to the 125Group

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hexagon789

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Presumably not until the ROSCO has exhausted all options of finding further work for it, then put it up for sale, then assessed bids and then decreed that a preservation group has won. Any of which may or may not happen.
Ah right, I thought it was 'earmarked' for preservation as with 43002.
 

Monty

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Does anyone know what the long term plan is for the group's loco hauled Mk3s? The way I understand is that they have a different electrical system to the HST trailers? So I wonder if they plan to rewire them or sell them on to other groups to fund the purchase of genuine HST trailers..
 

gc4946

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Great news on the power cars!
It'll be interesting whether one of the power cars will be retrofitted with guards van and a Valenta engine and the other power car kept as is showing its later configuration.

They already own TGS 44000 and RFMs 10202/6 (formerly TRUKs 40504/7) respectively but I'm assuming they'll obtain more HST-configured Mk3s in due course.
 

43096

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Press release from Porterbrook: https://www.porterbrook.co.uk/news/historic-hst-power-cars-donated-to-125-group

Historic HST power cars donated to 125 Group
Porterbrook today confirmed that celebrity HST power cars 43048 and 43089 are being donated to the 125 Group.

Power car 43048 ‘TCB Miller MBE’ is named after former BR Chief Engineer (Traction and Rolling Stock) Terry Miller. Terry was the genius behind the 125 mph High Speed Trains that revolutionised InterCity rail travel in the 1970s and 80s.

Power car 43089 was used to power Europe’s first hybrid high speed train in 2007 when it was fitted with a Hitachi battery-assisted diesel-electric traction drive. Named ‘Hayabusa’ the locomotive was used to power Network Rail’s innovative New Measurement Train, which plays a key role in assuring the safety of Britain’s railway. Following the successful hybrid trail the locomotive was repowered with a Valenta engine and returned to frontline passenger service.

Stephen McGurk, Porterbrook’s Chief Commercial Officer said: “We are delighted to continue our partnership with the 125 Group. These iconic power cars represent the very best of British rolling stock engineering and it is right that they should be given a new home that secures their long term future. We are particularly pleased that these two production power cars will be able to replace the prototype that is returning to the NRM.”

Both locomotives are currently in service with East Midlands Railway and will be handed over to the 125 Group once they complete their mainline service in early 2020.

125 Group was founded in 1994 with the aim of preserving a working Inter-City 125 for future generations.
 

xotGD

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Interesting that the Porterbrook press release uses the terms "power car" and "locomotive" interchangeably. I guess that way they can keep us all happy half the time!
 

Flying Phil

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Good that 43089 ".... Following the successful hybrid trail the locomotive was repowered with a Valenta engine and returned to frontline passenger service."
 

hexagon789

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Does anyone know what the long term plan is for the group's loco hauled Mk3s? The way I understand is that they have a different electrical system to the HST trailers? So I wonder if they plan to rewire them or sell them on to other groups to fund the purchase of genuine HST trailers..
I thought they'd already re-wired them as the 41001 could work with them and HST trailers I believe
 

43096

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I thought they'd already re-wired them as the 41001 could work with them and HST trailers I believe
They have not been re-wired, neither for 415V three phase train nor do they have HST 36-way multi-working jumper cables.
 

43096

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superjohn

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41001 supplies standard BR 850V DC train supply, not HST 415V three phase. It can therefore supply standard LHCS.
Was it ever able to supply three phase? I have seen pictures of prototype power cars in service with production stock but I guess they could have been paired with a production power cars.

Example picture from the excellent train testing site here:
http://www.traintesting.com/images/Swindon76pp.jpg
 

43096

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Was it ever able to supply three phase? I have seen pictures of prototype power cars in service with production stock but I guess they could have been paired with a production power cars.

Example picture from the excellent train testing site here:
http://www.traintesting.com/images/Swindon76pp.jpg
One of the power cars - believed to be 41001/43000 - was converted to three phase in 1974. If it was 41001, then it got an older alternator back, probably when BR put an engine back in before it went to the NRM in the 1970s.
 

Speedbird96

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The "Valenta" engine being a standard VP185 used in the rest of the EMR fleet
The press release is referring back to early 2009 when 43089 re-entered service with EMT which at the time did retain its Valenta engine after its battery equipment was removed before receiving its VP185 at the end of 2009.
 

WAO

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It will be interesting to see how the very able 125 Group solve the problems of using their production power cars with what is essentially a prototype (i.e loco-hauled) rake of carriages.

There are at least three issues; the production vehicles have Alliance or swing-head buckeye couplers whereas the coaches will have drop-head, the ETS is 3-phase not high voltage and the control circuits are via different systems (36-way versus TDM). IIRC, the group did actually operate 41001 together with a production power car during a HST visit, so possibilities must exist.

The group are likely to prefer the loco-hauled arrangement as the set needs to be hauled conventionally and I note the repaint in Swallow livery. I imagine that the power cars will be dual fitted as far as possible. If so, Mark 3 DVT’s could be added to allow for half sets to be used on heritage lines, both for economy and to fit the shorter platforms.

I hope the information will appear here in due course.

WAO
 

43096

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It will be interesting to see how the very able 125 Group solve the problems of using their production power cars with what is essentially a prototype (i.e loco-hauled) rake of carriages.

There are at least three issues; the production vehicles have Alliance or swing-head buckeye couplers whereas the coaches will have drop-head, the ETS is 3-phase not high voltage and the control circuits are via different systems (36-way versus TDM). IIRC, the group did actually operate 41001 together with a production power car during a HST visit, so possibilities must exist.

The group are likely to prefer the loco-hauled arrangement as the set needs to be hauled conventionally and I note the repaint in Swallow livery. I imagine that the power cars will be dual fitted as far as possible. If so, Mark 3 DVT’s could be added to allow for half sets to be used on heritage lines, both for economy and to fit the shorter platforms.

I hope the information will appear here in due course.

WAO
The couplers are not an issue. LHCS drop head buckeyes are compatible with the HST Alliance coupler (which is not swing-head, by the way). The 125 Group Mark 3s have been used in the past with EMT HST trailers in passenger service, with 41001 providing electric supply to one end and 43048 doing likewise to the HST trailers.
 

Monty

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The LHCS MK3s will probably stay at the GCR(N) and be used as conventional rolling stock with other diesel locomotives. The 125 will undoubtedly acquire more HST trailers in due course.
 

43096

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The LHCS MK3s will probably stay at the GCR(N) and be used as conventional rolling stock with other diesel locomotives. The 125 will undoubtedly acquire more HST trailers in due course.
And your source for that is?
 

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