trainmania100
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Fingers crossed it's back in service soon
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Possible 313 fire at Shoreham - 25/01
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Update on 313201 courtesy of Part Time Spotter's excellent blog: https://partimespotter.wordpress.com/2019/02/12/313201-is-still-in-the-sick-bay-2.
It is still at Lovers Walk and reportedly requires the control wire to be replaced in full.
It is still at Lovers Walk and reportedly requires the control wire to be replaced in full.
trainmania100
Established Member
Yeah saw that, no idea how big a job that is, I'd assume control wire probably controls the traction motors?
The 455s have 46 units for 42 diagrams. The 377s have some slack, the number of diagrams reduced last May. So the easiest solution is to put a four car 377 on a 313 diagram if required.
tsr
Established Member
Where there's a will there's a way. A number of services do split/attach and run to depots or sidings in the shoulder peaks - largely in view of the fact that many routes do still have peak time "extra" services. The Shepherds Bush shuttle services identified above are a fairly reasonable place to nick a 377 or two off peak, although I don't know "off the top of my head" how many 313 diagrams operate purely in the middle of the day. (However, Lovers Walk have previously had a habit of having one or two such diagrams through the day.)
You could even run a train in service from Shepherds Bush all the way through to Brighton, do quite a few shorter coastal runs, then send it back north for the evening peak, albeit you might have to do a bit of advanced juggling, given that some of the WLL extras start quite early in the evening.
The reason for some trains not splitting and attaching so much is twofold: firstly to ensure greater fleet reliability in the Metro North area, and to put it more bluntly, to reduce platform occupation by trains which have failed to split and attach correctly; and secondly to add capacity on some Metro routes around certain hotspot times, like the school run and the first and last off peak trains. It has relatively little to do with crew resourcing and certainly nothing to do with depot space.
(Funnily enough, as I type, another train is having problems detaching at Purley...)
Anyway, it's all a bit academic as I'm sure the Fleet overlords are thinking of something different!
Platforms 4 & 5 at East Croydon have permissive working. Some of the staff (mainly reliefs who also work at locations such as Purley) are trained to do it and some aren't. The training course isn't that long at all and if it was needed I'm sure it would be implemented.
tsr
Established Member
If you look more closely, the 455s have been notably short today, including several cancellations this morning, and it's not an isolated issue by any stretch of the imagination. The 377s are also pretty stretched covering 313 work and it's not really fully sustainable.
My point is that the 455s cannot cover any extra work, so we are in agreement. If I recall correctly there were only 40 diagrams at the start of last year which increased to 42 in May. I'm slightly surprised that Southern cannot get 16 of the 19 313s in service each day. Hornsey has to cover 41 diagrams with only three spares and they usually manage it.
From memory, generally one stopper during the day is the major exam, the minor exams typically were done overnight to improve unit availability, if the minor exam is not completed on time and you have a long term stopper (like 201 currently) your slack is easily eaten up. I remember one time a 6 car ECS had degraded brake issues, which meant both units had to be held until the issue was identified (not a short job). Things can, and do often snowball, there is massive pressure on the night shift to get units out
Sunset route
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Permissive working either splitting, attaching or platform sharing is not permitted at East Croydon on any platforms even though the interlocking and signalling would still allow it on platforms 4 and 5.
thats what i imagine. Was it ever in regular use?
tsr
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Interesting, just checked and both my paper copy and the online copy of the Sectional Appendix specifically say it's authorised on those two platforms... can't recall seeing any notices to the contrary either.
tsr
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Sunset route
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The “Special Box Instructions” (SBI) do not allow for it. I beleive it was one of those locations that were risk assessed after the “Stafford” accident and the authority was removed even though the signalling still allows for it. Redhill platform 3 for atttaching and platform sharing is another location.
They designed permissive working into platform 7 at Gatwick, but likewise that’s also prohibited.
So on these grounds there is nowhere to break up an 8 car 377/2 diagram to pinch a unit to cover for a 313 unless it’s done in a depot, Brighton station or possibly extend to Redhill and send one unit south and the other unit north?
Sunset route
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Maybe when TBASC was first commissioned up until the wider effects of the “Stafford” accident came into effect.
I’ve used permissive working to allow an asssiting train to asssit a failed train a fair few years back now after doing all the necessary comms with all the drivers concerned.
Islineclear3_1
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Any updates on 313.201 please? Is it likely to return to service or is it being robbed of parts?
XCTurbostar
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..If only there was some 313s and 314s from another operator being scrapped soon which the parts could be robbed from... 
Surreytraveller
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Or even from the same operator..If only there was some 313s and 314s from another operator being scrapped soon which the parts could be robbed from...
Different ROSCOs from all the other PEPs though...
Cant remember the class, but there was some PEP stock scrapped around 2012-2013. Eversholt did a reclaim exercise where they obtained a load of reuseable parts during the scrapping process, to be used to keep other fleets going. I was party to some of the photos of the reclaimed parts, although I no longer have access to these
LOL The Irony
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The South Eastern 508's?
trainmania100
Established Member
Any chance that parts will be used from the 313/0 that's been retired with great Northern? I heard 026 I think it was, is due a major exam and is out of milesThere are rumors she may live again
BRblue
Member
Big Blue is back up and running, and in service.
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trainmania100
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Diagrams
Islineclear3_1
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Glad to see Big Blue Phoenix back in the land of the living...hope she makes it through the day/week
Ash Bridge
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I've just been speaking to a friend who lives down in Worthing, he told me that he photographed 201 at that location yesterday morning and the first thing that struck him was how clean and tidy it was externally compared to its condition prior to the fire.
What does MA mean?
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