Potential New Central Pennine Rail Line (Colne-Skipton)

[SustainRail2]

[SELRAP has been moving boulders over the last few months from behind closed doors in order to see this New East-West rail link via Skipton and Colne come to reality, which would address some of the region's transport issues.

Planners and policy makers of all political parties, at both local and national level, now accept that capcity issues on the rail network are an issue. And are embracing the conjecture that low cost, low risk East-West rail route via Skipton and Colne will add capacity, flexibility and resilience to the entire pan Northern network.

A recent report by Cushman & Wakefield and SYSTRA commissioned by the Lancashire LEP together with West Yorkshire Combined Authority and York, North Yorkshire and East Riding LEP to explore the potential economic benefits that might arise across the North of England from enhanced connectivity between Lancashire and North and West Yorkshire.
The purpose of this was to develop a strategic and economic narrative to provide an evidence base to support the case for potential investment and intervention in rail/road based connectivity across these three functional economic geographies.

Overall, this report found a robust and compelling quantitive and qualitative economic case for enhanced East-West Rail connectivity across the Central corridor, (as opposed to Road) travel though non scheme specific, the report cites Skipton to Colne line stating that it would join two discreet parts of the rail network and provide a more coherent network across the study area as a whole.

Benefits of reopening the Skipton to Colne line show to be significantly in excess of other tests undertaken within study.... with additional benefits to other parts of the corridor via re-routing of existing flows; freight etc all.

Reopening the Skipton to Colne line and upgrading the Colne branch will make more effective use of existing infrastructure.

Skipton to Colne route would be a catalyst for economic growth & connect people to places of employment, promote job creation..... effectively bringing manufacturing and their employees closer together. With similararly profound impact re housing, leisure opportunities, tourism etc all.

Reopening Skipton to Colne route has potential to add a third more in terms of overall benefits to the 25% improvements already demanded by Transport for the North, (Transformational)

Modelling within the study shows that Reopening the Skipton to Colne rail line translates to a £43.5 million increase in Gross Domestic Product PA: ie. line pays for itself in under 3 years!

 

[neonison]

This one seems to have been bubbling for years.

I see the point about improving access of Burnley /Nelson / Colne to Skipton but do wonder what additional benefits this really brings over improvements to the Copy Pit / Colne Valley Line schedules and the reopening of Clitheroe to Hellifield (reverse in reinstated bay) to the overall Lancs / West Yorkshire corridor.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I honestly struggle to see what gaps Skipton-Colne plugs. The existing Copy Pit route already connects the East Lancashire towns with the substantial population centres of West Yorkshire (Halifax, Bratfud and Leeds), and since the Todmorden Curve got reinstated, Accy and especially Burnley have gained direct rail access to what is the primary retail / business etc destination for the region.

As soon as we start saying 'well, this route could take x, y and z off the existing network', i.e. essentially selling it as a diversionary route then my belief in the benefits of such a link diminish even quicker - as The Planner (and others!) say, diversionary potential doesn't make a business case.

I will give you the fact that Pendle is on its arse and has been for a very long while, but I fail to see how Selrap solves it. The existing (and serving much larger conurbations) Copy Pit services mean that essentially you need to limit viable usage to Nelson and Colne towards Leeds, and Central and East Lancashire to Skipton and Craven, as well as, in fairness, any footfall from Earby. Whilst Skipton has tourist potential, I don't see how it's a huge draw for people from across the Pennines, and looking further down the line, I doubt highly demand from Keighley and Bingley into Pendle and East Lancashire is high enough to justify the cost of reopening.

Before anyone says anything, I am a native of the area and care deeply about it. However, I just don't see how this is the saviour many claim it to be.

 

[daodao]

The existing Copy Pit route already connects the East Lancashire towns with the substantial population centres of West Yorkshire (Halifax, Bradford and Leeds).

Precisely. The proposed reopening of the Skipton-Colne link has no strategic benefit. Can it be justified on local benefits alone?

 

[yorksrob]

Put simply, it would give residents of Colne/Nelson etc access to employment opportunities in the Aire Valley (and residents of the Aire Valley greater leisure opportunity in Blackpool).

I think it's certainly worth considering a basic single track link on this basis.

 

[47802]

I'm sure the money could be better spent elsewhere. The likely level of traffic doesn't justify reopening on its own so lets now try and claim its a new strategic Transpennine route, I get fed up of this kind of rubbish and somebody needs to put a stop to it.

 

[yorksrob]

I'm sure the money could be better spent elsewhere. The likely level of traffic doesn't justify reopening on its own so lets now try and claim its a new strategic Transpennine route, I get fed up of this kind of rubbish and somebody needs to put a stop to this kind of nonsense.

We need a system that properly evaluates the benefits of local railways to local communities so that campaigns don't have to resort to hyperbole.

I'd also like to see a proportion of the transport budget set aside specifically for these sorts of rail improvements, rather than everything automatically going to 'Grandes projects'.

 

[The Planner]

(and residents of the Aire Valley greater leisure opportunity in Blackpool).

There's an oxymoron if ever I saw one, it isn't the 1950s anymore.

 

[yorksrob]

There's an oxymoron if ever I saw one, it isn't the 1950s anymore.

I think people are more likely to make day trips to the cost, rather then a weeks holiday as may have been the case during the 1950's.

I myself have made leisure trips to Blackpool (and I am far too young to have experienced the 1950's).

 

[PR1Berske]

I'm sure the money could be better spent elsewhere. The likely level of traffic doesn't justify reopening on its own so lets now try and claim its a new strategic Transpennine route, I get fed up of this kind of rubbish and somebody needs to put a stop to it.

But money isn't being well spent elsewhere. I fully support connecting Colne with Skipton as proof of using directed funding at source. I'd rather see a hundred such projects than one HS2.

 

[Ianno87]

I think people are more likely to make day trips to the cost, rather then a weeks holiday as may have been the case during the 1950's.

I myself have made leisure trips to Blackpool (and I am far too young to have experienced the 1950's).

A few day trippers to Blackpool don't make business cases, I'm afraid.

 

[PR1Berske]

A few day trippers to Blackpool don't make business cases, I'm afraid.

But potential opportunity to access the newly electrified Blackpool/Manchester lines do. Sell the reopening to Skipton as greater opportunity to access Manchester and Manchester Airport and you've got a deal. The East Lancs line could become a spine from which runs numerous Manc services, all we need is a bit of imagination.

 

[Ianno87]

But potential opportunity to access the newly electrified Blackpool/Manchester lines do. Sell the reopening to Skipton as greater opportunity to access Manchester and Manchester Airport and you've got a deal. The East Lancs line could become a spine from which runs numerous Manc services, all we need is a bit of imagination.

I agree that Keighley/Skipton are poorly connected to Manchester. If a direct rail link existed, I'm sure it would have a respectable level of usage.

Peoblem is, Skipton probably has very little potential for population growth, and Keighley/Worth Valley already has a fairly high population density who can access Manchester relatively easily and quickly by railheading to Hebden Bridge (much faster than a train journey via Colne/Burnley). So I think the opportunity for genuinely new rail based demand is relatively limited to justify this link.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love there to be a good case for this line to kick some life into the Pendle valley. But I don't think there is sadly (the main flows being largely catered for by the Copy Pit route), and the money could be better spent elsewhere.

 

[urbophile]

But potential opportunity to access the newly electrified Blackpool/Manchester lines do. Sell the reopening to Skipton as greater opportunity to access Manchester and Manchester Airport and you've got a deal. The East Lancs line could become a spine from which runs numerous Manc services, all we need is a bit of imagination.

Having grown up in the Skipton area I remember several interminable steam train journeys to Manchester. But it would have taken much much longer to get there via Leeds. Re-opening (and electrifying) Skipton - Colne - Manchester would be an alternative route across the Pennines and would help to reinvigorate that very depressed area of East Lancashire. As well as providing a quicker route to Manchester for Skipton and the Aire Valley as far as Bradford at least. I know it's not the greatest centre of population and compared to HS2/HS3 etc is hardly a priority. But the continuing decline of a once flourishing industrial area, and the increasing damage to the environment caused by the increase in road traffic, are two good arguments in favour of what would be a low-cost improvement to the network.

 

[edwin_m]

National Rail shows times from Skipton to Manchester via Leeds this afternoon varying from 1hr 46min up to 2hr. The fastest I can find from Colne is 1hr 47min with a 5min connection at Blackburn. So a faster Manchester journey via a re-opened Colne-Skipton route would also require faster services between Colne and Manchester, which would also require extra infrastructure south of Colne to increase capacity. The time advantage via Leeds will increase in future as Leeds-Manchester trains are accelerated whereas those via Blackburn are unlikely to change very much, and obviously from stations east of Skipton the time saving via Leeds will be more.

Hence I can't see that quicker journeys to Manchester can be used to justify this re-opening.

 

[Robertj21a]

....'The line pays for itself in 3 years'.......

Even if I could see any real justification for reinstating the link (and I can't), it's extremely unlikely that it would have a payback in anything like such a short time - as usual, the figures will be full of guesses, estimates and inflated hopes.

 

[The Lad]

At the moment the X43 bus is doing a fair job of making the Manchester link from Skipton.

 

[Jonny]

What are you going to do about Colne to Rose Hill/Gannow? That would need significant investment as well.

 

[yorksrob]

A few day trippers to Blackpool don't make business cases, I'm afraid.

You obviously forgot to read the first part of my post regarding employment opportunities in the Aire Valley and Leeds for residents of Nelson and Colne.

 

[urbophile]

National Rail shows times from Skipton to Manchester via Leeds this afternoon varying from 1hr 46min up to 2hr. The fastest I can find from Colne is 1hr 47min with a 5min connection at Blackburn. So a faster Manchester journey via a re-opened Colne-Skipton route would also require faster services between Colne and Manchester, which would also require extra infrastructure south of Colne to increase capacity. The time advantage via Leeds will increase in future as Leeds-Manchester trains are accelerated whereas those via Blackburn are unlikely to change very much, and obviously from stations east of Skipton the time saving via Leeds will be more.

Hence I can't see that quicker journeys to Manchester can be used to justify this re-opening.

I take your point. I'm a bit vague about the available route(s) from Colne to Manchester: I know the direct line through Bury is long gone, but I didn't realise that via Blackburn was the nearest – that is a detour! Just shows how the East Lancashire towns have been sidelined.

 

[30907]

At the moment the X43 bus is doing a fair job of making the Manchester link from Skipton.

The X43 has the advantage of a more direct route than a potential train, but whenever I see it at the Skipton end, admittedly off peak, it's pretty much empty, which makes me wonder about the possible market.

I'm aware of a fair bit of car commuting into Skipton, including on the A59 from the Ribble Valley, but I wonder how much of that is from the Building Society offices out by the bypass?

 

[bluenoxid]

We need a system that properly evaluates the benefits of local railways to local communities so that campaigns don't have to resort to hyperbole.

I'd also like to see a proportion of the transport budget set aside specifically for these sorts of rail improvements, rather than everything automatically going to 'Grandes projects'.

Rail projects are grand projects. They quickly hoover up money to 8 figure sums. I can see justification of further rounds of the New Stations Fund but everything else should be treat as a stand alone mega project

The proposal is a massive project and it would be transformative. There are a lot of trucks moving across the Pennines on the M62. I just don't think it will do enough to attract people and freight.

My view is that the campaigners need to focus on opening up the route from the east. Services could be extended from Skipton to a park and ride for Earby at at West Craven Drive.

There are four challenges for a full route opening. To open Skipton to Earby only requires one of these to be overcome and avoids the issue with the A56. It allows for the demonstration of the local input.

Vivary Way
Canal at Foulridge
A56 in Earby
River Aire near Skipton

The A56 is the most challenging circumstance, with a need to create a bypass/diversion for the road or railway to avoid a Level Crossing.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

The problem with Skipton to Colne is that while it is an obvious "missing link" the cost of reinstatement would be enormous. bluenoxid has highlighted the four biggest obstacles each of which would be likely to cost a seven or even eight figure sum to solve, and that's before you consider the cost of restoring earthworks, drainage, trackwork, etc. And the route has been obstructed in other places too, mostly by small local roads to improve access to farms.

If the line was an existing freight only route which simply needed upgrading to passenger standards then it would be close to a no-brainer. But it isn't. Quite simply there are far better ways to spend public money than on this idea. And exactly the same points can be made about various other possible re-openings which we discuss on here at fairly regular intervals.

 

[Darandio]

I think people are more likely to make day trips to the cost, rather then a weeks holiday as may have been the case during the 1950's.

I myself have made leisure trips to Blackpool (and I am far too young to have experienced the 1950's).

Except once they suffer the 'experience' that is Blackpool North, they will never go back!

 

[Grumpy]

You obviously forgot to read the first part of my post regarding employment opportunities in the Aire Valley and Leeds for residents of Nelson and Colne.

I suspect a significant proportion of the cars parked around Steeton railway station have come from the Colne area. For those not wishing to use cars there is a direct bus from Colne/Nelson to Keighley at approx. 30 minute intervals. It is difficult to see how a train, running the long way round via Skipton, would improve on this very much.

 

[edwin_m]

I take your point. I'm a bit vague about the available route(s) from Colne to Manchester: I know the direct line through Bury is long gone, but I didn't realise that via Blackburn was the nearest – that is a detour! Just shows how the East Lancashire towns have been sidelined.

There's also the possibility of changing at Rose Grove to the Todmorden Curve service, though anyone who's actually been there would probably dismiss that option even if the connections worked. When I checked on National Rail it also threw up an option doubling back at Accrington and again at Hebden Bridge. It's sometimes also quicker to go via Preston.

 

[snowball]

There are four challenges for a full route opening. To open Skipton to Earby only requires one of these to be overcome and avoids the issue with the A56. It allows for the demonstration of the local input.

Vivary Way
Canal at Foulridge
A56 in Earby
River Aire near Skipton

The A56 is the most challenging circumstance, with a need to create a bypass/diversion for the road or railway to avoid a Level Crossing.

Also, approaching Skipton, you'd either need a new bridge under the A629 bypass, or a longish deviation from the original route to join the Settle-Skipton line (on a curve) west of where it goes under the bypass.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

There was some mention somewhere of it being attractive to freight .....biomass to Drax and Intermodal.

Don't think so somehow.

Some good objective comments on this thread , by people who either know or live in the area. We looked at it in some detail for the ATOC Connecting Communities project - you basically have to build a brand new railway. Formation either lost , or would not meet existing standards. Particularly awkward at the Skipton end. (as pointed out above)

However "Rail" will carry on talking it up - and insisting that "everyone" supports it - as opposed to being prepared to put hard cash up for it. (and revenue support)

 

[yorksrob]

There was some mention somewhere of it being attractive to freight .....biomass to Drax and Intermodal.

Don't think so somehow.

Some good objective comments on this thread , by people who either know or live in the area. We looked at it in some detail for the ATOC Connecting Communities project - you basically have to build a brand new railway. Formation either lost , or would not meet existing standards. Particularly awkward at the Skipton end. (as pointed out above)

However "Rail" will carry on talking it up - and insisting that "everyone" supports it - as opposed to being prepared to put hard cash up for it. (and revenue support)

Perhaps the standards need reviewing. Obviously lost bridges need replacing, however the majority of the formation is in place.

The ATOC Connecting communities project was essentially a good idea. What I would like to see is funding set aside for these sort of medium sized projects with them competing with eachother for that funding on their own merits. I can think of a few re-openings which I would prioritise over Skipton-Colne such as Okehampton-Bere Alston and Matlock-Chinley. As it is, none of them go ahead because they get sucked into the slipstream of much larger capital projects which hoover up the investment.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Perhaps the standards need reviewing. Obviously lost bridges need replacing, however the majority of the formation is in place.

The ATOC Connecting communities project was essentially a good idea. What I would like to see is funding set aside for these sort of medium sized projects with them competing with eachother for that funding on their own merits. I can think of a few re-openings which I would prioritise over Skipton-Colne such as Okehampton-Bere Alston and Matlock-Chinley. As it is, none of them go ahead because they get sucked into the slipstream of much larger capital projects which hoover up the investment.

We did use a fully qualified Civil Engineer - and it was pointed out that though "everything is possible" - there is a cost. Trouble is Group Standards etc are horribly difficult to challenge.

Excellent point on a "competition" fund for projects - trouble is Government puts these in , and then pulls them - the Rail Partneship Fund - which I sat on as a decision maker put in some excellent schemes (the very best being Norwich to Cambridge by Anglia) - and in your neck of the woods the Sunday service to Clithero (though Colne was pulled interestingly and the train diverted to the former.(not much use) - just as it was getting together nicely - the funding was cancelled for all new schemes. A great shame.