Proof-reading the PTT?

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43106

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I've just downloaded the PDF of the National Rail Timetable, and I've spotted something on the front sheet of it. NR are asking for "volunteers...to be involved in the draft and final editing stage of the National Rail Timetable production..."
By the looks of it, NR are asking for members of the public to do THEIR work AND not pay them. Desperation by NR, or am I (almost certainly) missing something?
 
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Ivo

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So we'll know who to blame for the errors in the next one then:).

I've already played that one on my Uni. They know to blame me if the new Saturday and Holiday bus timetables don't work, and to look elsewhere if the main timetable doesn't work. As it turns out, only one is working. Guess which one is failing...

Correct - the one I didn't influence <D
 

IanD

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Also signed up a week or so ago. Can't complain about the inaccuracies and then not take the opportunity to do something about it!

Got a reply asking which routes/table I was particularly interested in.
 

johnnychips

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I think this is a great idea. It is a particularly annoying feature when one train arrives at a place at a certain time and then you look to the right to departures and another train has left earlier. (And it's not due to minimum connections). I might sign up.
 

DaveNewcastle

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The 'Invitation' to participate is not simply a request for 'proof-reading'. It requires making an analysis of the proposals from a user's point of view and reporting them appropriately to inform its presentation.

One of the frequent criticisms of the rail industry (which I will subscribe to) is a lack of transparency, accountability, scrutiny and responsibility. So it concerns me that people from this forum might, on the one hand, wish to assist, but on the other hand, not wish to be transparent, accountable, subject to scrutiny and to accept responsibiity.
Concealing personal details looks to me like a wish to avoid (or in some way to be exempted from) those standards of professional conduct.

I hope that no one here wishes to avoid taking responsibility for their actions and being publically accountable.
 

Clip

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I've just downloaded the PDF of the National Rail Timetable, and I've spotted something on the front sheet of it. NR are asking for "volunteers...to be involved in the draft and final editing stage of the National Rail Timetable production..."
By the looks of it, NR are asking for members of the public to do THEIR work AND not pay them. Desperation by NR, or am I (almost certainly) missing something?

I think you may be. There are enough enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data all the time and im sure they would love to do it to try and make sure it works.

And you're saying it like its a bad thing.
 

Ivo

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I hope that no one here wishes to avoid taking responsibility for their actions and being publically accountable.

To me, the larger scale aside it is no different to University. I for one am more than happy to go ahead with this. If anything, it constitutes a challenge; if my scheduling (and analytical) skills are what I claim they are this is one way to prove I know what I'm doing...
 

6Gman

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I think you may be. There are enough enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data all the time and im sure they would love to do it to try and make sure it works.

And you're saying it like its a bad thing.

What a horrible mental image that prompts.

I hope you meant pore !

;)
 

wintonian

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The 'Invitation' to participate is not simply a request for 'proof-reading'. It requires making an analysis of the proposals from a user's point of view and reporting them appropriately to inform its presentation.

One of the frequent criticisms of the rail industry (which I will subscribe to) is a lack of transparency, accountability, scrutiny and responsibility. So it concerns me that people from this forum might, on the one hand, wish to assist, but on the other hand, not wish to be transparent, accountable, subject to scrutiny and to accept responsibiity.
Concealing personal details looks to me like a wish to avoid (or in some way to be exempted from) those standards of professional conduct.

I hope that no one here wishes to avoid taking responsibility for their actions and being publically accountable.

I certainly do not wish to escape responsibility or cloud over transparency.

However they seem to be less than transparent in their advert by asking for people to get involved without saying exactly what involved means, and the lack such of detail makes me a little suspicious. Accordingly I have no intention of being involved untill I am clear on what it is they are asking people to do and in the meantime wish to protect my personal data.
 

43106

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I think you may be. There are enough enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data all the time and I'm sure they would love to do it to try and make sure it works.

And you're saying it like its a bad thing.

Well, I classify myself as one of those "...enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data..." The point I was trying (and failing) to make was... why involve the public? Don't NR have any confidence in their own staff? If NR are going to get Joe Public to do the work of paid NR staff, why shouldn't the public receive a wage for it?
I can only assume that NR are looking for a fresh pair of eyes - loads of 'em!
 

causton

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Well, I classify myself as one of those "...enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data..." The point I was trying (and failing) to make was... why involve the public? Don't NR have any confidence in their own staff? If NR are going to get Joe Public to do the work of paid NR staff, why shouldn't the public receive a wage for it?
I can only assume that NR are looking for a fresh pair of eyes - loads of 'em!

Saves taxes ;)

Basically, if they employed You to do it, the money would go:

You (as taxes) -> Government -> NR -> You (as wages)

Cut out the middlemen and bob's your uncle, simple! :D

(No, I *am* joking... although tempted to sign up!)
 

jamesr

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The 'Invitation' to participate is not simply a request for 'proof-reading'. It requires making an analysis of the proposals from a user's point of view and reporting them appropriately to inform its presentation.

One of the frequent criticisms of the rail industry (which I will subscribe to) is a lack of transparency, accountability, scrutiny and responsibility. So it concerns me that people from this forum might, on the one hand, wish to assist, but on the other hand, not wish to be transparent, accountable, subject to scrutiny and to accept responsibiity.
Concealing personal details looks to me like a wish to avoid (or in some way to be exempted from) those standards of professional conduct.

I hope that no one here wishes to avoid taking responsibility for their actions and being publically accountable.

But they're not asking for people to be publicly accountable for the timetable they've set. They're asking people to check for typesetting and layout errors in the timetable. The timetable is set. They don't want an "analysis from a user's point of view", they want someone to tell them that they've accidentally put a time in the Yeovil Pen Mill row rather than the Castle Cary row.

People who volunteer to help them don't need to adhere to a "standard of professional conduct"... they will receive the errors people point out and decide whether to act upon them or not. People are so suspicious these days. Not everyone has an ulterior motive!
 

lyndhurst25

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If anyone does volunteer for this perhaps they could suggest that the mileages for Trent Jn to Wrawby Jn could be put back in? They've been missing since at least 1998 and probably since the weekday passenger service ended.

(useful for proving the distance of shortest routes, thereby avoiding the need to consult the Routeing Guide);)
 

IanD

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If anyone does volunteer for this perhaps they could suggest that the mileages for Trent Jn to Wrawby Jn could be put back in? They've been missing since at least 1998 and probably since the weekday passenger service ended.

(useful for proving the distance of shortest routes, thereby avoiding the need to consult the Routeing Guide);)

Why don't you just email them and suggest it. They also ask for general feedback on the first page.
 

The Planner

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Don't NR have any confidence in their own staff? If NR are going to get Joe Public to do the work of paid NR staff, why shouldn't the public receive a wage for it?
I can only assume that NR are looking for a fresh pair of eyes - loads of 'em!

I don't think it is a confidence question at all, the publications team isn't massive and they don't just deal with the PTT publication, they have plenty of other jobs on at the same time.
 

philjo

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Has anyone noticed that all the 00.40 departures from London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly via Crewe have disappeared from Table 65 of the new timetable.

Yes, I had spotted that - seems to be the northbound ones missing. The southbound services are shown.

At least table 65 is one of the ones you can read without a magnifying glass as they have managed to reduce the font size plus this thickness of the paper so the print from the other side shows through!
 

Ivo

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I had a reply yesterday (Tuesday) saying the following:

Dear Volunteer,

Thank you for showing your interest in enhancing the quality of the information in the National Rail Timetable.

Your feedback is valuable to us. Any feedback or comment about missing or erroneous services, connections etc will help us improve the future editions.

Please could you confirm the below details

[see below]

We will review all the volunteer applications and get back to you sometime after the closing date 15th June 2012.

Please note the Draft version of the next timetable, the Winter Edition Dec 2012 to May 2013 will be produced in August. We will get in touch then.

Thanks for your help in advance.

Have a good day!

August doesn't bode too well for me - I will be out-and-about for three weeks straight! :?

The details they required were:

Name, Company/Individual, Designation/Interest in Railway, Contact No., E-mail, Routes/Area, Tables interested in (for providing feedback), Draft/Final/Both TT
 

heart-of-wessex

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I had a reply yesterday (Tuesday) saying the following:



August doesn't bode too well for me - I will be out-and-about for three weeks straight! :?

The details they required were:

Name, Company/Individual, Designation/Interest in Railway, Contact No., E-mail, Routes/Area, Tables interested in (for providing feedback), Draft/Final/Both TT

Don't quite know what to fill in under route/area, I assume it means where you live?

Might go for Final I don't know yet
 

Peter Mugridge

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Well, I classify myself as one of those "...enthusiasts on here who pour over this kind of data..." The point I was trying (and failing) to make was... why involve the public? Don't NR have any confidence in their own staff? If NR are going to get Joe Public to do the work of paid NR staff, why shouldn't the public receive a wage for it?
I can only assume that NR are looking for a fresh pair of eyes - loads of 'em!

Apparently they are doing it not to get people to do NR's job for them but because NR are fed up with the TOCs not checking the tables and then NR take the flak for the resulting inaccuracies. It appears that while some TOCs are meticulous others don't check anything at all and this is why there have been so many errors in the NRTT in the past few years.
 

Ivo

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Apparently they are doing it not to get people to do NR's job for them but because NR are fed up with the TOCs not checking the tables and then NR take the flak for the resulting inaccuracies. It appears that while some TOCs are meticulous others don't check anything at all and this is why there have been so many errors in the NRTT in the past few years.

Why am I not surprised by this? :|
 
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