Prototype HST Power Car 41001 to return to York

Discussion in 'Railtours & Preservation' started by 254024, 9 Oct 2019.

  1. Edders23

    Edders23 Member

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    HMMMM.................was it the 125 group refusing or the management at GCR(N) to me it would seem very strange that any preservation group restoring and maintaining heritage vehicles would do so unless they had no one available to attend on the chosen day

    As for security issues there was a very serious spate of vandalism at the GCR(N) but i didn't think the HST was affected

    There was a similar issue with loan agreements for the 84 and Glorious so i suspect that the NRM has unreasonably high expectations of what they are getting with these agreements
     
  2. Entertexthere

    Entertexthere Member

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    It's a shame that it's going back to being stuffed at York after so much hard work has been poured in by Volunteers, but it clearly appears that the group violated the terms set by the NRM. Hopefully they decide to acquire a production HST (or two) in some time. Could they not purchase one of the stored GWR power cars or is there a reason as to otherwise?
     
  3. EM2

    EM2 Established Member

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    I'm not really up on the story here, so can some briefly explain whether I've got this right:
    41001 is owned by the NRM.
    They did nothing with it, so the 125 Group raised money and restored it.
    The 125 Group were allowed, by agreement by the NRM, to run it for a certain length of time.
    For whatever reason(s) (some given earlier in the thread), the NRM have decided not to renew this agreement.
    Where does the Science Museum come into it?
     
  4. matt

    matt Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    The NRM is part of the Science Museum group
     
  5. Ianno87

    Ianno87 Established Member

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    This is turning into the railway's response to yesterday's Coleen Rooney / Rebekah Vardy sopat...

    Some quite spectacular anti-NRM frothing on display....
     
  6. 254024

    254024 New Member

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    Tweet from 125 Group in response to NRM statement ...

    https://twitter.com/125Group/status/1182335571005464576

     
  7. Darandio

    Darandio Established Member

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    Even more so following that 125 Group Tweet, that was the Vardy response!
     
  8. 86246

    86246 Member

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    I’m not going to take sides here as I really don’t know what has happened.

    It is very disappointing that this has happened to the relationship between the 125 Group and the NRM.
     
    Last edited: 10 Oct 2019
  9. 433N

    433N Member

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    If I were the 125group, I would be hurt that the NRM hadn't phoned them to try to resolve the issue(s) before making these accusations. ;)
     
  10. gordonjahn

    gordonjahn Member

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    Very much this.

    Now for my uninformed wibble:

    The messages from the 125 Group seem much more measured and considered than the 4 part Tweet rebuttal from NRM.

    It could just be a change of personnel at NRM and the new person never agreed the loan should have taken place and was never going to renew but are now faced with a PR battle and have come out with nonsense.
     
  11. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I have say it comes to something when a small group of enthusiasts are sounding more professional and measured than a national scale organisation....

    If I were in charge of the NRM I'd be furious at whoever authorised that statement with that wording. And if it was me I'd be expecting a please explain from my board!
     
  12. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    I notice the enthusiast hatred for the NRM has come to flooding out once again and the instant willingness to take against them is apparent! I suspect few, if any, here actually know what has gone on.

    Don't get me wrong it is a sad decision that does not one any credit but it is the NRM toy and they can do what they like. They don't owe you anything.
     
    Last edited: 10 Oct 2019
  13. Edders23

    Edders23 Member

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    well what do you expect they put all their financial eggs in one basket with the flying money pit and expected everyone to accept everything else playing second fiddle

    If you put 10 enthusiasts in a room and asked which was their favourite you would get 10 different answers. Enthusiasts love all trains whereas your average Joe who is only slightly interested would be more enthused by one "iconic train"

    and the NRM are interested in average Joes not enthusiasts
     
  14. Kite159

    Kite159 Veteran Member

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    Who wants to bet that 41001 will end up shunted away into a corner of the 'overflow' museum at Shildon when another kettle takes its place in York?
     
  15. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    So? It is theirs. It would be sad but if they want to lock it in a barn for 40 years they can!

    BTW this post shows the issues many here have with the NRM and in particular fail to understand t=what the museum is there for
     
  16. Malcmal

    Malcmal Member

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    "National Collection" - the clue is in there!!! This is NOT someone's private stash of goodies - this is meant to be for the nation. Also after a quick look at the Facebook page for D9002 I see a similar story happened there back in March.
     
  17. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    What are you talking about? You seem to have no idea what those words mean and you are inposing your own view as if it is correct!
     
  18. Malcmal

    Malcmal Member

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    That the NRM is supposed to be there for the national good and as such it would be totally unacceptable if there were to "lock it in a barn for 40 years".

    Is this entity funded entirely privately? I had a quick Google and couldn't figure that out. I would imagine there is some state input to the Science Museum Group.
     
  19. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    No still no idea what you sre talking about. How much stuff in the national collection is on show?

    Do you think everything item owned by the national gallery is on show all the time?

    Also why do you think the nrm funding source gives you any right to wibble on about a decuson you dont like? Do you think the government care about a prototype hst?
     
  20. Ianno87

    Ianno87 Established Member

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    Given they're funded by 'average joes', i.e. the taxpayer, seems pretty reasonable.

    Enthusiasts aren't exactly short of heritage railways elsewhere are they?
     
    Last edited: 10 Oct 2019
  21. Malcmal

    Malcmal Member

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    Frankly I think YOU are the one who is confused!! You just said that the NRM has the God given right to lock 41001 away in a barn for 40 years when there is a group wanting to love and care for this vehicle and expose it to more public viewing than any museum could hope for.
     
  22. E759

    E759 Member

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    Over two and a half million people have visited Locomotion. Great location for the prototype HST alongside another prototype DP1.
     
  23. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    Far too much hysterical reaction to this.

    It's the NRM's asset, they can do with it what they want. If their plans have changed and they don't want to renew the loan agreement, it is their prerogative to do so. If they think that 41001 doesn't need to be on display, likewise. Some people may not like it, but what is displayed is rightly down to the NRM making decisions in the context of its overall objectives. It is not a talent contest as to what gets put on show - that's how you end up with "Boaty McBoatface" - and there is simply not enough space to have everything on display.
     
  24. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    The point is very simple: The nrm can do what they like with thier asset. If they dont want to show it they dont have to. You clearly seem unable to understand that very simple point

    It is also clesr you have no idea about the people the nrm are trying to attract. It isnt trainspotters. It is families with nothing more than a passing intrest in Thomas and trains having a free day out.

    Guess how much the prototype hst means to them? That's right: next to nowt. They are going to see mallard and flying scotsman and the bullet train not a diesel train.
     
  25. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    Thank you. A sensible post
     
  26. Malcmal

    Malcmal Member

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    If, as I assume, the NRM are funded by public monies then they are very much answerable to the people. Yes the museum exists for the unwashed masses - I am not arguing this point. But you were very clear about their supposed right to do whatever they want without answering to anyone!!
     
  27. rdlover777

    rdlover777 Member

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    i jokingly said this to a mate of mine when he told me the news and i'll say it here. I guess its time we rebuild 41002
     
  28. Ianno87

    Ianno87 Established Member

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    The NRM is one of the places that gave little me 'the bug', and I'll always be grateful for that. It's not the niche stuff that does that, it's the Mallards and the Flying Scotsmans and the Shinkansens that do that.
     
  29. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    Sorry for being a dyslexic. I must try harder not to annoy the pedants.

    I also notice you have no answer to the points I raise. You are fundamentally mistaken in your view. You are welcome to express it by all means but it is wrong.

    The NRM are part of the Science Museum Group. This is a a a non-departmental public body, operating within the public sector but separately from its associated sponsoring government department, the Department for Culture, Media and Sport. I also belvie there is a charity with a board of trustees overseeing things. THAT is who the NRM reports to. Not you or the public.


    I agree with you on both points
     
  30. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    They are answerable though. In terms of visitors they attract. In terms of objectives from the SMG, and ultimately from the Department for Culture, Media and Sport.
     

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