Query about Route VIA HIGH WYC&SHR

[rratgerg]

Is there a list of TOCs that tickets with this routing are valid on?

Obviously will include Chiltern and ATW.

Specifically: is it valid on CrossCountry between Banbury and Birmingham? Is it valid on London Midland between Birmingham and Shrewsbury? Is it valid on Virgin between Crewe and Chester?

Please also state your source for the information provided. These are all valid routes on the ticket.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It is valid via any Permitted Route that passes through High Wycombe and Shrewsbury. There is no TOC restriction, as if there was it would be shown as part of the route (e.g. it'd be ATW+CHILTERN or something).

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

If you search for tickets Chester-Marylebone it will throw up ones marked ATW+CH.
But when you try and book a journey, the planners will offer routes involving LM between Crewe and Birmingham (with ATW Chester-Crewe), but not with Virgin on either sector.
But you don't have to go via Shrewsbury, or solely on ATW to Birmingham.

Try the ATW (or VT!) site, select slower/cheaper fares and click on trains available with the ATW+CH fare, and you will get the LM options.
I guess LM Shrewsbury-Birmingham is also allowed, but it doesn't often work for longer distance journeys.
I'm not sure if you can use LM Birmingham-Leamington as well as CH.

My guess it is really a "not intercity TOC" fare, so excludes VT/XC/GW.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It is valid on all permitted routes that take you through Shrewsbury and High Wycombe. There is no TOC restriction.

Without knowing the origin and destination and type of ticket it's impossible to say for certain, but in general it would be valid on ATW and LM from Shrewsbury to Birmingham. It would also be valid on LM Birmingham-Leamington Spa and XC Birmingham-Banbury. It should also be valid on Virgin Trains and LM Birmingham-Coventry, but expect more hassle, especially on VT.

I can get VTEC with the Wrexham General off-peak day Travelcard VIA HIGH WYCOMBE to book me on VT Wrexham-Rugby and then VT Rugby-Coventry, for instance, as well as VT Birmingham-Coventry. Although not the super off-peak day Travelcard...

 

[rratgerg]

Thanks, I should have quoted this from another thread:

There is an error in the electronic restriction data used by booking engines - there is an explicit list of train companies that fares with the route "VIA HIGH WYC&SHR" may be used on

Are you saying this is not correct, that there is no such list?

 

[Bletchleyite]

There should not be any such list, as that routeing specifies locations, not TOCs.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Are you saying this is not correct, that there is no such list?

There is such a list, but it's not legally enforceable as the restriction is not shown on the ticket. It's not clear what question you are asking here.

 

[Tetchytyke]

There is such a list, but it's not legally enforceable as the restriction is not shown on the ticket.

Are you able to show us where the list is? I can't see it on your BRFares website, but I can see the restriction barring trains arriving or departing from London Euston at any time.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What origin and destination are these tickets? I can't see them.

 

[gray1404]

I see no reason why you could not use it between Oxford and Birmingham on XC. Assuming you would have come out of London on the Chiltern service and changing at Oxford (which would have called/passed through High Wycombe on the way and then taken the new Oxford link). Perhaps somebody could please confirm this is all allowed?

 

[furlong]

Report cases like these to the ORR, and if it doesn't act, try to get Which? interested in mounting their own investigation to put pressure on the ORR.

 

[greatkingrat]

What origin and destination are these tickets? I can't see them.

Tickets from suburban London stations to North and Mid Wales.

A London Terminals - Holyhead ticket is routed "CH & ATW ONLY", but a Clapham Junction - Holyhead ticket is routed "+VIA HIGH WYC&SHR" in order to allow the use of Southern or SWT connections, however this then has the consequence of also allowing Virgin / XC etc to be used for part of the journey.

 

[John @ home]

We're not making much progress in answering the question in the rratgerg's first sentence:

Is there a list of TOCs that tickets with ... routing [VIA HIGH WYC&SHR] are valid on?

In order to answer this, we need to know the origin and destination for the particular ticket routed VIA HIGH WYC&SHR.

I should have quoted this from another thread:

There is an error in the electronic restriction data used by booking engines - there is an explicit list of train companies that fares with the route "VIA HIGH WYC&SHR" may be used on

Indigo2's comment refers to a Standard SUPER OFFPEAK RETURN BORTH - HANWELL Route ✠VIA HIGH WYC&SHR, which is stated in this post to cost £29.70. The price puzzles me. Both brfares.com and Avantix Traveller NFM 26 quote an Adult price of £65.50 (or £43.25 with an appropriate Railcard).

Is this the ticket which interests rratgerg? If not, we still need an answer to Neil's question:

What origin and destination are these tickets?

 

[gray1404]

Is there a chance I will have problems:

In light of some of the posts in D&P (this one being the most recent http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=141219&page=6 - although not directly related to this, still shows the stance taken by XC), I wondered if anyone thinks I might have problems using the fare below on XC between Birmingham and Oxford.

Super Off Peak Return, Chester to Brighton: Route +VIA HIGH WYC&SHR

My proposal would be to travel Chester - Birmingham (either direct or via Crewe) - Oxford (will stop off here on either outward or return journey) - Biecester Village (for some shopping) - London Marylebone - LU to one to a London Terminal with a service towards Brighton (not decided which one yet).

Given the current attitude on XC and passengers being reported by TM's then receiving letters from TIL, am I likely to have problems?

 

[Paul Kelly]

I don't think that's a permitted route. As far as I can see you need to use map combination BC+GC to get from Chester to London, but GC doesn't have a link between Banbury Group and Oxford.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

I don't think that's a permitted route.

I would have thought you were expected to take the direct line, Banbury, Bicester North, High Wycombe and not detour via Oxford.

 

[gray1404]

I don't think that's a permitted route. As far as I can see you need to use map combination BC+GC to get from Chester to London, but GC doesn't have a link between Banbury Group and Oxford.

Thanks for looking into this! Such a shame that link isn't included.

So once in Birmingham it would mean the only viable option, on a ticket with this routing would be to travel on Chiltern Railways on a Marylebone service (which would of course go via High Wycombe).

Just looking at the CH route map. Would it still be possible to get to Biecester Village if I alighted at Biecester North?

I can do without going to Oxford in all honesty. Are places such as Warwick, Leamington Spa or Banbury worth a visit? I have never been to any of the 3.

 

[67018]

Thanks for looking into this! Such a shame that link isn't included.

So once in Birmingham it would mean the only viable option, on a ticket with this routing would be to travel on Chiltern Railways on a Marylebone service (which would of course go via High Wycombe).

Just looking at the CH route map. Would it still be possible to get to Biecester Village if I alighted at Biecester North?

I can do without going to Oxford in all honesty. Are places such as Warwick, Leamington Spa or Banbury worth a visit? I have never been to any of the 3.

Bicester Village is fairly easy to walk to from Bicester North station, about 20 minutes through the town centre. There's a shuttle bus but not worth it in my view.

Warwick is a good place to visit if you like historic towns. The castle is a major attraction (with a price to match). Leamington and Banbury are both reasonably pleasant places to wander round.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

So once in Birmingham it would mean the only viable option, on a ticket with this routing would be to travel on Chiltern Railways on a Marylebone service (which would of course go via High Wycombe)..

I don't think anything prevents you from travelling via Coventry. So you could travel from New Street by Cross Country and change to a Marylebone service at Leamington or Banbury. If you are coming into New Street from the North or West, it avoids the walk from New Street to Moor Street.