Rail Journeys: Impossible to buy Tickets

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ChristopherJ

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Any examples of rail journeys of which it is/was impossible to buy a ticket?

The Crouch Valley Line (Wickford - Southminster) is not covered by a Penalty Fares Area, stations have no ticket selling facilities outside of peak hours (only at a couple of stations have ticket offices which are staffed at the morning peaks only), services on the line are operated by DOO. To conduct revenue protection staff known as Ticket Examiners (TEs) were employed - these staff were not guards and nor were they Revenue Protection Inspectors (RPIs) and therefore had no power to issue Penalty Fares - they was merely present to sell tickets for the CVL branch line on board the trains.

However, the final two services of the night between Wickford and Southminster were not covered by the agreement of the TEs and therefore had no means of collecting revenue for the last couple of journeys, the trains were essentially "free for all(s)".

How do I know this? A contact used to get on at Maryland - which has no ticket selling facilities apart from a PERTIS of which he purchased a Permit to Travel for only 5p, travel to Wickford, then change for either of the last two services of the night on the CVL and get off at South Woodham Ferrers without having bought a ticket for the journey - apart from the 5p permit and having not breached any ticketing conditions. He bought a permit, traveled, got to his destination, no one exchanged the permit, he walks off the network having not paid.

Passengers who boarded at intermediate stations on the CVL at that time of night also got a free ride on the branch - due to the absence of a TE.

This was the situation under NX operation - don't know if it has changed under Albelio.
 
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Flamingo

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Some bean-counter obviously worked out that it was worth agreeing to run the trains to get the franchise, but not worth employing somebody to collect the fares, as the perceived revenue would not cover the cost of employing the collector.

It seems to make sense to a certain type of manager.
 

John @ home

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Any examples of rail journeys of which it is/was impossible to buy a ticket?
"Alloa and Ebbw Vale Parkway stations both opened in 2008, and both have several hundred thousand passengers annually. Four years after opening, one symptom of the fragmented railway system is that it is still not possible to buy a railway ticket for any fare between Alloa and Ebbw Vale Parkway. This is a failure of regulation."

http://www.railforums.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=11902&d=1341347806
 

Flamingo

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"Alloa and Ebbw Vale Parkway stations both opened in 2008, and both have several hundred thousand passengers annually. Four years after opening, one symptom of the fragmented railway system is that it is still not possible to buy a railway ticket for any fare between Alloa and Ebbw Vale Parkway. This is a failure of regulation."

http://www.railforums.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=11902&d=1341347806

Whilst not disagreeing that tickets should be available, I wonder quite how many people have been inconvenienced by the inability to buy such a ticket?

Not to mention the fact that as soon as it is introduced, the first thing that will happwn is someone will figure out a split on it, and say how disgraceful it is that the sp'it is not being offered in lieu of the direct fare:
 

lyndhurst25

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I recently e-mailed Northern about the inability to buy tickets to/from Brigg or Kirton Lindsey and a whole bunch of stations in the central part of South Yorkshire (Meadowhall, Rotherham, Swinton, Mexborough, Bolton, Thurnscoe, Goldthorpe, Chapletown). This is the reply that they have just come back with -

"It is to do with how fares are held within the system, for long distance flows fares are priced on clusters and Brigg is held within one of the clusters.

The reason why there are only limited flows nearby is presumably to do with the fact you cannot actually get to Brigg etc as there is a very limited service to it - presumably my predecessors decided it was not worth creating flows to Brigg etc as a result."


I'm not sure if that is an acceptable excuse and I'm wondering how to reply. Are there any other groups of stations for which there are no through fares?

(Incidentally I can find fares from Alloa to Ebbw Vale on brfares.com - maybe the problem has been fixed?)
 

John @ home

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I can find fares from Alloa to Ebbw Vale on brfares.com - maybe the problem has been fixed?
Yes, I have now discovered that these fares have appeared in the NFM 11 (Jan-May 2012) edition of The Manual but are not in the corresponding CD sold to the public.
 

kieron

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You may be able to buy singles and advances between Alloa and Ebbw Vale Parkway, but I can't buy a ticket from Wrexham Central to Chester (a journey of 12.5 miles) anywhere. That's a failure of something or other.
 

bb21

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What happens then if a passenger wants to travel between these two places? Does the guard just sell a ticket to/from Wrexham General?
 

Greenback

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I'd be surprised if, in practice, Wrexham General to Chester tickets aren't treated as Wrexham Stations.
 

kieron

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In practice, I doubt many people actually want to travel between Wrexham Central and Chester (or the other stations from which there are also no tickets, likely because they are calculated by Arriva based on the Chester ones).

There aren't many good connections at Wrexham General or Shotton, the two Wrexham stations aren't that far apart by road and there are frequent 'buses which stop outside Wrexham General.

To add to this, the last Bidston-Wrexham train (which lets someone return from Chester at 22:56, half an hour after the last direct train) only goes as far as Wrexham General before returning empty to Chester.
 

DJ737

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G'day

Noticed none of the TOC's offer Fishguard & Goodwick as an origin or destination for online bookings.

National Rail do recognise Fishguard & Goodwick as a valid origin/destination and even quote a anytime single from Fishguard & Goodwick to Fishguard Harbour for £0.70p

Is this the cheapest anytime single between two stations in the UK?

Cheers
DJ737
Melbourne, Australia
 

bb21

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Lichfield City - Lichfield Trent Valley Anytime Day Single is 50p.

I believe this one is the cheapest undiscounted Adult fare.

[Pedant Alert] £0.70p is an incorrect notation. It is either £0.70 or 70p. :p [/Pedant Alert]
 

Mutant Lemming

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Any examples of rail journeys of which it is/was impossible to buy a ticket?


Passengers who boarded at intermediate stations on the CVL at that time of night also got a free ride on the branch - due to the absence of a TE.

This was the situation under NX operation - don't know if it has changed under Albelio.

I had mentioned this in a previous thread as it wasn't just late night but early evening services too. They actually did have on train staff but they weren't there to sell tickets they were actually security staff to stop the local ferral youth from smashing up the train. There were kids openly dealing in 'something' at Burnham and Southminster stations. Can understand the reluctance of someone working those trains to actually challenge people to pay a fare.
 

simonm

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I understand people have problems buying tickets to Okehampton when FGW run their Sunday service to there. Something to do with the Council paying for the service, possibly? Have also had a mate who was not allowed to use his ALR to there!!!
 
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