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Railway Enthusiasts

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anthony263

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Just read a article in the Mail on sunday newpaser, (something i dont normally read) about problems with some railway fans acting like yobs by yelling out of trains and drinking.

There was a brief discussion about this topic this morning on the BBC news.

Another question which i would like answered is how can we make train spotting cool or get more young people interested?

Maybe if we can it might stop them getting involved in crime etc.
 
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Metroland

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You mean this one!

They trundle around Britain’s railway network, harmlessly recreating, it seems, the innocence of a bygone age.

But now train enthusiasts who charter vintage rolling stock for day trips are being warned their hobby could be banned because of drunken and yobbish behaviour.

Enthusiasts have been spotted yelling at people as they pass through stations – an activity dubbed as ‘bellowing’ – and hanging as far as possible out of old-style train windows, known as ‘flailing’.
Peak Army reuion


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ng-ban-claims-yobbish-behaviour.html?ITO=1490

I would say train spotting by its nature isn't cool, but then a minority of enthusiasts are spotters. Although I'm not too keen on the label cool anyway, which always comes across as something dreamt up in a US advertising agency. Anything can be cool if sold the right way remember spotting in the 50s/60s was cool. But then there was a lot of interesting things to see. Trouble is railway enthusiasts and railwaymen are good at running the railways down and anything connected to it. I see one post after another, this is crap, that's crap. Some people are one long essay of half empty. Imagine if it was like that on top gear? If enthusiasts, and especially spotters, want to 'sell' their interest, then one must put a positive spin on things.

Really an interest in railways is an interest in engineering and travel, and that's how it should be promoted. Its no different from any other form of transport. I particular dislike people who don't mind admitting they like cars and especially planes (which lets face it have even more boring designs than modern trains) admitting they like those and not the other. When people think of trainspotters, they think of middle aged men standing at the end of platforms pointlessly collecting numbers from a very boring set of trains these days at most locations. But about that's about 1/10th of enthusiasts IMHO and most of us resent that label as it gives any interest to do with railways a negative image - which doesn't exist in other countries. Sorry, but that's the truth. I still personally welcome people having an interest in trainspotting, because at least its an interest - unlike the people I really dislike who have no interest in anything apart from instant gratification of their lizard brain. Those sort of people lack imagination can't see the beauty, endurance or charm in anything much. I pity them.

Bashing is okay, and so is photography, and I think that can appeal to a wider audience. Actually a good **** up on a train would appeal to a lot of young people - I suppose as long as it didn't get out of hand.

Simulators have made it a bit cooler, and I think modelling has always appealed to everyone. A lot of non-railway enthusiasts can appreciate a lovely model of some kind.

And preserved railways are an excellent thing to get involved in where you can learn a lot of useful skills. The government should be promoting that like mad to young people to give some of them some direction.
 
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Metroland

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Tis rather amusing if you know your history. Perhaps the Daily mail may be moving to a pull our selection on trainspotters, rather like female, with mad mel doing a spot on liveries aint what they used to be!
 

Metroland

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Well that's the DM for you, but then, look who wrote it! Mind you there must be some people reading thinking, hmn, that sounds quite good.
 
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LilLoaf

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Well i've been watching trains since i was about 5 (19 now). Yeah the youngers generation. I know what people mean when the say the younger ones act like yobs, Personelly i don't, but i sometimes get dodgy looks of older spotters when i walk up end of platform, then the dodgy look turns into a amazed look when i say Good morning /Afternoon, i strike up a convosation.

This idea of train spotting being cool is never ever going to happen. It will never be seen as cool, unless we MAKE IT appeal to most younger people. Trouble is to do that we will have to put a pub/club on end of platform for booze, have a disco, couple of dancers on polls. That will never happen at least i hope not as it will spoil it for the rest of us. Thats why spotting will never be seen as cool.

I'm all for new, modern idea's (like the graffiti thread) but lets keep our hobby safe and enjoyable.

Never really took much of an interest in writing numbers, but i do like taking photo's, and writing books (see LilLoafs railway book thread).
 

Metroland

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Good that someone is writing books! There is a distinct lack of modern ones, although I enjoy the steam ones and am very grateful to the older generation for compiling all the information so at least those that were born after it was all swept away, can appreciate something of it.

PS isn't there a boozer at every station on most preserved railways and a few of the network rail ones?
 

yorkie

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Carspotters on rampage
by Chris-Tian Wan-Car of the Anti-Mail

Today we can reveal that carspotters have been spotted driving at twice the speed limit, listening to loud music, getting drunk and their engines make up to 10 times the noise of a normal car.

One car expert said that the craze for travelling at speed on modified cars was an extention of carspotting, "these people get bored of taking down numberplates and move on to modifying their engines"

He said that each type of car attracted a different set of fans, often depending on which part of the country the cars were most popular - but those drawn to 1990s cars seemed to be the rowdiest.

"They are allowed out to play by their mums and get so excited when they are being driven by their mate in their favourite type of engine they end up behaving like football hooligans," he said.

A terrified commuter, waiting at a bus stop at the time a group of boy racers passed, told his tale "it was disgusting. They frightened the life out of me. Their subwoofer was going full blast and they were waving out of windows. Any sort of a wave must be a Nazi salute so they must be Nazis, please can someone shoot them?"

A carspotter defended the boy racers, "we're harmless. Everyone likes the noise of an engine revving in their street, and loud music at 2am does no harm at all. Exceeding the speed limit is proven to be harmless. Newspapers should concentrate on the real criminals such as trainspotters, and leave us alone". A spokesperson for the Daily Mail agreed "we don't touch stories about boy racers as everyone loves cars, but if you get any stories about trains let us know and we'll send a reporter round within 5 minutes".

It has been revealed that boy racers lean out of windows, skating along the road however a leading boy racer denied it was dangerous "it's perfectly safe. You should be more concerned that a trainspotter is slightly out of a window. That's more serious" and the Daily Mail agreed, "cars are great".

An AA spokesperson said "the media should lay off motorists, just leave us alone, we're always unfairly victimised" however a reader submitted the following photo showing offensive gestures being made from a modified car. This photo is proof that all carspotters are guilty of rowdiness.
76334217a1896053050b311148690l.jpg

 

kyrano

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Hi All

From the Daily Mail
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html

Trainspotters on rampage: Vintage rail enthusiasts are facing a ban over
claims of yobbish behaviour
By CHRISTIAN WOLMAR
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ng-ban-claims-yobbish-behaviour.html?ITO=1490

They trundle around Britain’s railway network, harmlessly recreating, it
seems, the innocence of a bygone age.
But now train enthusiasts who charter vintage rolling stock for day trips
are being warned their hobby could be banned because of drunken and
yobbish behaviour.
Enthusiasts have been spotted yelling at people as they pass through
stations – an activity dubbed as ‘bellowing’ – and hanging as far as
possible out of old-style train windows, known as ‘flailing’.
Off the rails: Nazi-style salutes at a Peak Army reuion in 2004
Last month, during one trip between Preston and London, two men had to be
ejected from a heritage train being pulled by a Class 40 diesel engine
manufactured in the Fifties.
One refused to stop leaning out of a window and shouting at people, and
the train was delayed at Leeds while police were called to deal with
another man who had provoked a fight.
The carriages were left in ‘a disgusting state’ by the drunken enthusiasts
and required special cleaning.
As a result, the operator, West Coast Railway, which owns the carriages,
said it would cancel future trips if tighter policing by stewards was not
enforced.
The chairman of the Class 40 Preservation Society, John Stephens, said he
was furious about the unruly behaviour on the Preston to London charter,
which he blamed on ‘a small group of outsiders’.
‘These yobs and troublemakers came from a group of lads who got on the
train with an 80-pint barrel of beer at 6.30 in the morning and drank all
the way to London,’ he said.
‘We carried the can for their behaviour but it was nothing to do with us.’
Offensive gestures at a Peak Army renuion in 2003
On a ‘Christmas special’ tour yesterday for dozens of enthusiasts of the
classic Class 40 locomotives between Shrewsbury and Lincoln, participants
were given a list of strict rules.

Flailing, leaning out of the windows, smoking and drinking alcohol before
10am were banned.
Mark Honey, boss of Rail Blue Charters, which organised yesterday’s tour,
said: 'We are taking a zero-tolerance line on this. Future charters will
be heavily policed by stewards.’

In June, an incident involving a man seen perilously leaning out of a
train on a trip organised by Spitfire Tours led to an official complaint
by Network Rail.
The company wrote to Spitfire threatening to withdraw its licence to
operate if there were further incidents.
A spokesman for Network Rail said: ‘We don’t want to tar everyone with the
same brush but we will clamp down on bad behaviour very strongly.’
One rail expert said that the craze for travelling behind particular types
of locomotive was an extension of trainspotting.
He said that each class of locomotive attracted a different set of fans,
often depending on which part of the country the trains were most common –
but those drawn to diesels from the Fifties seemed to be the rowdiest.
‘They are allowed out to play by their wives or mums and get so excited
when they are being hauled by their favourite type of engine they end up
behaving like football hooligans,’ he said.
The group with one of the worst reputations is the so-called Peak Army,
who followed ‘Peak’ Class 45 diesels produced in the Fifties, he added.
He said they were known in the Eighties for throwing toilet seats out of
the window and were described in one rail magazine as ‘the Millwall of
rail enthusiast groups’.
Pictures on the internet show a group of 45 enthusiasts at a 2004 Peak
Army reunion giving a Nazi-style salute.

Regards David Kirkwood
 

LilLoaf

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Today we can reveal that carspotters have been spotted driving at twice the speed limit, listening to loud music, getting drunk and their engines make up to 10 times the noise of a normal car. Yorkie -

Love how that said "today we can reveal" ... so they knew noting about it until that day then.
 

Mojo

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Well that's the DM for you, but then, look who wrote it! Mind you there must be some people reading thinking, hmn, that sounds quite good.

Haha, didn't notice who wrote that. He's at a meeting I'm going to in Bristol on Tuesday!
 

Metroland

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Quite amusing Yorkie. Someone I knew boasted about buying max power (which is the manual of the chav culture for the most part if we are to use the stereotype), but took the **** out of me for buying Rail - AND they worked for the railway.

Nowt as queer as folk.

People think I'm anti-car, which makes me laugh. (It's like some modern heresy) I actually like all forms of transport to a greater or lesser extent (Trains, cars, bikes, boats, planes, trucks, buses in that order) and can appreciate them all. I'm just educated myself in what is good and bad about them all, and believe in a good mix. It really does make me laugh these constructs that have developed around each one, and how gullible people are in going for steorotypes and spin, how some things are brushed under the carpet and others and embellished like some holy truth.

I think their should be a prize for who can identify who thought of all this crap, and a pussy of the month prize for people that can't admit they like certain things. Lets face it most rail enthusiasts are cool for liking something others have made so uncool. You're just manipulated by the gods of advertising and spin you fools! :)
 
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yorkie

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I witnessed someone smash into 3 cars and 2 bollards, drive on the wrong side of the road and on the pavement. The incident didn't make the papers. But a small group getting drunk on a railtour does? How odd. The worst that could happen to this guy is that he is banned from driving for a few years and has to re-qualify. But he won't be banned forever, let alone a ban for anyone else. Yet railtours "could be banned" for everyone because of a small group getting drunk and leaving a mess.:roll:
 

Beaker

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It seems a bit of an odd move by Rail Blue Charter to complain about their customers to the mail who inturn give their customers a bad reputation. Don't they want people to travel with them ?
 

Metroland

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Quick send anti-terrorism officers out! :)


I thought it was a good time for a public service announcement, the sort of thing you get after a 'disturbing' BBC programme.

Enthusiasts anonymous

/sarcasm on

Have you come out yet to your friends and family? What did people say when you told them you liked trains, were your hurt or abused? How do you feel about the ongoing negativity and abuse from the media or have you tried to form any sort of support network?

Do you creep in and out of newsagents trying to hide copies of your favourite magazine, or have you opted for the safety of a full subscription? Or are you still unable to enter WHsmith at all?

Then we want to hear from you.

We are especially interested in hearing from car and plane enthusiasts who have great difficulty in coming out, as we can lend a support network and therapy in admitting what you have hidden for all these years. Yes that trains are vastly superior and far more social.

If you wish to join a support group or help with therapy sessions. Please write to:

A.D.Gooder

58 Railway Cuttings.
Sodemall,
Guardianshire.
1TO 2PO

/sarcasm off
 
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TheSlash

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Actually for quite sometime now i have been of the opinion that people like Julian Whitby and alike do the rest of you no favours.
Another sector doing you no favours are those who believe they know better than railway staff when it comes to ticketing.
Yes, you may well know better, but the way you present your case leaves alot to be desired. It comes as no surprise that you immediatly percieve yourselves to be on the recieving end of a persecution everytime somebody asks to see your ticket.
 
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yorkie

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Amusing about the reference in that article stating enthusiasts are behaving like football hooligans. As someone who is a travelling supporter of his club and who uses the railways as preferred method of travel, I would say its the other way around:lol:
Also interesting the quote about the "Millwall" of hooligans. I dread to think what the Leeds equivalent would be like!!! (Leeds had twice as many banning orders and had twice as many arrests as Millwall last season and Leeds had more arrests last season than the following clubs in their division combined: Millwall, Yeovil, Walsall, Southend, Northampton, Leyton Orient, Gillingham, Hartlepool, Cheltenham, Brighton) Of course the Daily Mail aren't interested in the reality though.:roll:
 

Phoenix

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Personally I did laugh at how they have jumped on our very own band wagon and turned it against us as us rail enthusiasts were trying to stamp out the yob behaviour and once again they have misread all the facts but I am not that surprised but to be honest It makes for so nice light reading when I need a chuckle or two.

As for the appeal of the railways to the children I suppose the only way is to start having preserved railways do more for children.
But then again enough is done but I suppose we just need to encourage that the railway scene is a family friendly one because you can't force a teenager to like trains but you can at least get them on the things by making it a family day out.
 

Craig

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Spot a pattern forming here?

We complained about people standing close to the platform edges filming, a paper picked up on it.

We compain about people flailing, bellowing and going a bit over the top on railtours and it ends up in papers... again!

If the small minority doing this (aka ****s) actually listened it wouldn't get to the national press.

Could see this coming a mile off. Although it is the daily mail and have probably gone a bit over the top with the story as well, especially with their little phrase guide! Try the Daily Mail random headline generator, it's quite accurate http://*******.com/5wat7k
 
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Metroland

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And now for some 'quality' journalism in the star, who can't even get the loco right. The A1 trust will be pleased. My god I'm glad I don't read the star for my view of the world.

GEEKY trainspotters are being kicked off the railways after turning into drunken yobs.

Boozed-up bookworms have been yelling abuse at people on trains and platforms as they note down numbers of vintage steam and diesel engines.

And a new breed of beer-swigging louts are making life a misery for real enthusiasts who travel on chartered trips.

One group, the Peak Army, have been dubbed “the Millwall of rail enthusiast groups”.

Two hooligans were hurled off a Preston to London train last month after one started a brawl and another shouted at passengers.

The carriages needed special cleaning after their gang left the train.

John Stephens of the Class 40 Preservation Society said: “These yobs came from a group of lads that got on the train with an 80-pint barrel of beer at 6.30am. We carried the can for their behaviour but it was nothing to do with us.”

And Mark Honey from train journey organisers Rail Blue Charters, said: “We are taking a zero-tolerance line on this. Future charters will be heavily policed by stewards.”

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/61497/Trainspotters-go-off-the-rails/
 

me123

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Quality journalism as ever from The Daily Star :roll:

Can someone sue them? Their stereotypical depiction of trainspotters is really no different to racism.
 

Metroland

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I suspect if they were allowed, they'd like to put all sorts of things based on stereotypes of minorities.

Oh well we'll just have to start thinking like them and assume that their readership are boozed up tattoo wearing builders, with regional accents, who can barely read and write and certainly can't form an opinion therefore don't count.
 
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