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Railway 'to get 1000 carriages'

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westcoaster

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When are 5 coach 450s going to come into roll ? and 10 car trains ? I wonder if they will quadruple Staines - Datchet , because back in 2004 or 03 Heathrow express was meant to go through staines and underground to LHR that would of been amazing Staines , 3rd Rail and OLHE !!:book: :tongue5:

these coach's are not coming till 2014, a heck of a long time away, if they want 10car;s on the windsors i got an idea dessies, and then bring back the 442's till 2014, thats just swt, the carriage;s are for every one not just one toc.
 
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Tom B

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Third rail can't do 125mph - HSE. Also the fact that the safety case only exists up to 110mph... would be a waste of time for the saving of about 5 minutes.

Which is why, where possible, any remaining third rail systems should gradually be replaced with OHLE. Far better system.

Fantastic news i wonder what will be built hopefully Northern will get some new units maybe even some Northern 185s (god knows what livery they would end up in).

Don't be silly - the new carriages are for the South East, and the Government thinks that the South East = the whole country. They will therefore throw loads of money at it, buy brand new trains, whilst Pacers still rattle around the rest of the country - why not replace these first?
 
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Tom

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Third rail systems currently in place... to replace to OHLE would cost about £1bn I reckon. Many bridges would require rebuilding.

Besides, OHLE is an eyesore. ;)
 
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It's still false advertising if none of your trains can achieve 125mph officially.
 

devon_metro

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Why are Desiros governed by some stupid computer, dare i mention the war?

What happened to shave as many coaches in and hope for the best!
 

thefab444

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Hmm, I guess the order got caped by the SRA before they developed the 450/2 TMS then?

I thought there was talk of using some 508 cars? In 455s... thought I doubt there are enough.
 
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Some 508 cars are already used in 455s. Not enough 508s for it to happen and for Merseyrail to keep capacity now, though.
 

Tom B

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But given the extra costs involved in modifying train designs to fit SRDC, wouldn't it be sensible to gradually move over to OHLE where possible?
 
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Tom

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Not really - all new build third rails are all capable of OHLE operation as it is, the conversion to OHLE would just be too difficult as Waterloo would need to shut for about a month, and that's a no go.

508s and 455s are also technically the same, the 455/8s (I think) have 508 TSOs.
 

Kris

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Don't be silly - the new carriages are for the South East, and the Government thinks that the South East = the whole country. They will therefore throw loads of money at it, buy brand new trains, whilst Pacers still rattle around the rest of the country - why not replace these first?

Huh - if that's the case, then why have we got all the crap whilst you have Pendalinos, HST's Mk 4's etc etc

(Except for the 159's and the 158's - thanks for them :thumblef:)
 

thefab444

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Heh, a 444 is infitely preferable to a 150, 153, 155, 156 or 158. Mainly because some TOCs have let their 158s 'go sour', as it were.
 

Kris

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Heh, a 444 is infitely preferable to a 150, 153, 155, 156 or 158. Mainly because some TOCs have let their 158s 'go sour', as it were.

Rusty Railway's 158's were pretty sour - especially in the cabs (I think there'd been some sheep *hagging going on), when I had to pilot one via Basing'.

TP 158's though - very impressed with. Why bother with a refurb? Just get a few pots of paint for the outside. Or leave it - it's a nice scheme.
 

Dennis

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TP 158's though - very impressed with. Why bother with a refurb? Just get a few pots of paint for the outside. Or leave it - it's a nice scheme.


If you like MFI style decor. Nice comfy seats though.

The interiors of the ex TPE 158's transferred to FGW seem to deteriorating quite rapidly though.

Re the extra carriages, this represents a ~10% capacity increase. The vast majority of recent train builds have been as direct replacements for obsolete stock so these additional carriages might just cater for the increased passenger numbers seen over the last decade, still leaving little room for future growth.

Good to see a change of stance from DfT though; "passengers have no right to expect a seat" was hardly the way to encourage people out of their cars and onto rail.
 

Kris

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Easy peasy answer to overcrowding but the government won't do anything about it the same way they won't clamp down on cocaine use in 'The City'

If commuters worked in shifts around the clock - no problem - plenty of seats for all. Plus ..... better utilisation of rolling stock.

Would also benefit trading with countries in other time zones.

I get really annoyed with the 'Keep Sunday Special' campaign. Oh - you don't mind transport workers, power workers, TV stations etc etc working on Sundays then?

And what about vicars - lazy gits. Only work one day :lol:
 

ChrisCooper

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That's the problem, most of the capacity is needed at peak times, and between those times these extra trains will either be running around almost empty or sitting in sidings. These issues don't just effect trains, but all transport, and many other services aswell. Flexable working would really help, by speading the loads over much more of the day. Another problem is the concentration of work in the South East, and particularly London. Surely in a global, digital world, a small office somewhere "up north" could be just as connected as if it were part of a big headquaters in London. I'm sure in most businesses there is little transfer of physical things between departments, most of it will be digital, so there is no need for them to be in the same building, or even the same country.
On another point. I'm sure this investment in extra stock to deal with overcrowding will as usual fail to realise that peak time overcrowding isn't a problem confined to London and the South East, but effects many cities. Also, many lines suffer from seasonal overcrowding, due to additional tourist traffic at holiday times. Travelling on summer saturdays in some areas can make peak time trains around London look quite pleasent, particularly since this can be over considerable distances (i've stood for over an hour before on many none London services). I can't help but feel that this issue is largely down to snobbery, since many of those packed on peak time trains around London are business men and women, wheras those packed onto trains on summer saturdays are more likely working class types, since afterall, the London commuters are going to be on a plane to Barbados, not a train to Skegness.
 

5872

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In the Route Utilisation Strategy before the franchise was awarded - it said that the South Western Franchise had to make plans for connecting to Heathrow Terminal 5. Apparently there is an old freight line that goes quite close.

Your very right the old staines west branch to west drayton close in the 1960s but it remained dereilict until the construction of The M25 and after an oil line , last year I went for a visit and alot of the track work is still there and your able to roam about on it! On Monday 19th when I went to visit winsdor I captured some of the old line on my camera (video)!:sunny:
 

Hentis

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Faults manifest didn't know that! BTW why dose a 73 haul it at 5mph?:)

And
What dose winsdor lines got to do with 450s and Platforms?

Take a look here:-

444042couplinga.jpg


and here

444042couplingb.jpg


Thats the coupler adapter I beleive. I also have pics of it being loaded on Tuesday which are going on the site a t some point.

I wouldnt say a day goes by without one or two 450's/444's failing. From the logs I see, there are a few.

Cheers

Hentis
 

Darandio

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Good to see a change of stance from DfT though; "passengers have no right to expect a seat" was hardly the way to encourage people out of their cars and onto rail.

This brings me to something that happened to my dad around 6 weeks ago. He and my mother were travelling from Darlington to Redcar to come and see me and the train was unusually overcrowded for the time of day. After boarding at Darlington there was a clamour for seats and my mam and dad got some. After the train had left and the conductor came around for tickets, a man noticed that my dad had used the 'free passes' and proceeded to say that he should be more entitled to the seat because he had 'paid' for his ticket.

My dad worked as a trackwalker on the railway for 42 years (many of those in the more dangerous days) so in my opinion is fully entitled to sit where the hell he wants. This, coupled with the fact that he is 74 means that this bloke had no right to question his free travel.

Just a shame i wasn't there.
 

Demps

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Fantastic news i wonder what will be built hopefully Northern will get some new units maybe even some Northern 185s (god knows what livery they would end up in) . More locally for my line the Thameslink route anything that will free up the remaining 319s from Southern even if it is years ahead (lol).

I just hope it is not the usual government spin

Chriso

Yak, but hopefully keeping the Battle hardned 156's
 

Nym

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Yak, but hopefully keeping the Battle hardned 156's

I much prefer the 156s to the 158s on the HBS line, not much choice realy they both have good and bad points, the 156s and generaly more comfortable and more ventelated as you can open your own windows, that can be a bad thing when they blow themselves open in high winds or the diesel fumes come into the cab. The 158s we have though are slightly faster at accelarating (if they have the 400bhp cummins engines) but if they only have the 350 cummins or perkins, then they are actualy slower than 156s, that and the doors open faster. Also theres always more legroom in a 156 and I've never had one break down on me :)

I would like to see somthing like the 170 turbostars or 185s coming up this line, but if we did then I would also like some 222s from hull ;) and the line upgrading to RA8 and 100mph running :)
 

Nym

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well, we used to get HST's up ere, blue pullman, class 47 with Mk2F rakes, everything diesel :) now we're stuck with 156 158 and the odd 143
 
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