Ramps & On Board Supervisors

[Ivor]

Cheers Ivor.

Don't forget that different trains need different ramps. Also that different classes of trains behave in different ways. If you haven't been shown the differences, ask about and see if you can learn more and see what is, and isn't possible.

I am trained in the 3 different ramps for the relevant trains.

 

[Ivor]

I thought there were some circumstances where a train could run without an OBS? If so do we know if one was on board?

Yes as per my original post.

 

[LowLevel]

To be honest I can't see that the procedure is any different whether its a conductor or OBS that isn't present.
Im also surprised that platform staff don't know how to stop the doors closing on the ramp. Ive never seen agency staff giving assistance on the platform on Southern either.

To be fair I don't think on a 377 you can stop the door closing on the ramp, if they're the same as 170s. As I mentioned earlier we used to chuck a newspaper over the obstacle detector.

 

[Horizon22]

In my ignorance can I ask does the train driver have any over riding control of doors from his cab? Or is it solely the OBS?

Anyway hopefully this scenario will rarely happen in the future & I will view it as a one off glitch.

To my knowledge, if the OBS has a "key on", the driver cannot close the doors. This used to happen a fair bit when the role was created / transformed with some new OBS's forgetting about the key with lots of "could the OBS please contact the driver" via the intercom!

 

[pompeyfan]

To my knowledge, if the OBS has a "key on", the driver cannot close the doors. This used to happen a fair bit when the role was created / transformed with some new OBS's forgetting about the key with lots of "could the OBS please contact the driver" via the intercom!

but as I said previously, how does the OBS move down to provide assistance and put a key on in the relevant coach without being left behind? Imagine there’s an 8 coach train, and the OBS is in coach 2, how does the OBS assist a passenger to join coach 6/7 without unduly delaying the train by keeping their key on in coach 2 and having to walk the platform in each direction.

 

[Horizon22]

but as I said previously, how does the OBS move down to provide assistance and put a key on in the relevant coach without being left behind? Imagine there’s an 8 coach train, and the OBS is in coach 2, how does the OBS assist a passenger to join coach 6/7 without unduly delaying the train by keeping their key on in coach 2 and having to walk the platform in each direction.

Well you can ask this question of any on-board member of staff anywhere at any unstaffed station; there's no guarantee the assistance will be where you might like them to be. The OBS is meant to work mainly from the wheelchair accessible coach at station but of course that isn't always possible when carrying out customer service or revenue duties.

They should be working from somewhere near the middle of the train, and they need to be proactive about it. It may cause a minor delay but it's either that, or leaving behind passengers requiring assistance. Besides, the driver is opening and closing doors and, whilst doing proper dispatch, should see the OBS assisting with a ramp.

 

[pompeyfan]

You’re correct in saying that there is a risk station staff get taken for a ride, but where the guard does dispatch it is very rare for them to be left behind on the platform. OBS don’t have that protection.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Quite apart from the question of the OBS, the driver had I guess either pressed close without properly checking that the train was ready to depart, or did so with monitors which were not giving an adequate view for him to do so, surely? If he'd looked and the monitors were displaying clearly he would have seen the ramp, staff and wheelchair users. If he couldn't see properly, he's meant to get off and look back, isn't he?

 

[Bletchleyite]

sorry, I interpreted that the doors were attempting to close so the train could leave, not the auto close function.

If it was the auto-close, why wouldn't the OP just have kept pressing the open button until the wheelchair user had boarded?

 

[OxtedSignaller]

but as I said previously, how does the OBS move down to provide assistance and put a key on in the relevant coach without being left behind? Imagine there’s an 8 coach train, and the OBS is in coach 2, how does the OBS assist a passenger to join coach 6/7 without unduly delaying the train by keeping their key on in coach 2 and having to walk the platform in each direction.

By calling the Driver on the cab to cab I would imagine letting them know they are moving down the train to provide ramp assistance.

 

[LowLevel]

If it was the auto-close, why wouldn't the OP just have kept pressing the open button until the wheelchair user had boarded?

Because it is a complete pain to try and do that while also helping a wheelchair user align their wheels etc and it won't stop the door closure cycle until the hustle alarm sounds.

On a 22x for example staff can operate the door open button in a certain way that disables the auto close until the train door closure sequence is initiated by the driver or guard. If the door attempts to close and is obstructed 3 times it will deactivate and has to be slid shut manually. On a class 80x the crew can disable the door.

It's always seemed odd to me that you'd install an auto close feature with no means of overriding it.

 

[Ivor]

Because it is a complete pain to try and do that while also helping a wheelchair user align their wheels etc and it won't stop the door closure cycle until the hustle alarm sounds.

Yes thanks for this, it was exactly that, I mentioned earlier in the thread that the passenger I could see was concerned with the doors trying to close whilst he was negotiating the ramp & I was trying to reassure him at this stage & that was my main concern.

What should have been a straightforward transaction became far from it!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Ah, fair enough.

 

[Horizon22]

Ultimately the doors shouldn't have been closing (if it wasn't the 377 auto-close due to the aircon) unless the driver was undertaking an unsafe dispatch. If it's the former and it's taking a while to board someone, there's not much to be done I'm afraid. It won't fully close, but would annoyingly bump up against the ramp.