RDG trial/Budget announcement: 26-30 Railcard from Spring 2018

[LNW-GW Joint]

But presumably these are available to everyone.

Many of the foreign schemes are based around the local social security/education system, and some are limited to residents or (sometimes) to EU citizens.
If, unlike here, they are subsidised by the state, they do all they can to restrict usage to locals who pay taxes.
Also many of them have (by our standards) expensive annual/quarterly/monthly cards but give good discounts.
Some countries have on-demand discounted fares for seniors (eg Norway 50%, Finland 50%, Belgium flat fare of €6), or are completely free (Hungary, Slovakia).
You just have to prove your age (passport etc).
In Spain the cards are numbered and you have to quote/key in the number to get the discount.
They can therefore track usage down to the individual, something I'm surprised we don't do here.
German cards are on subscription (you have to sign a direct debit).

 

[DarloRich]

I strongly suspect this is the prelude to a more general scheme open to all, just testing waters atm.

But don't shoot me if wrong.

I would be very happy with that and would even pay a decent sum (way above current railcard levels) to obtain the kind of discount the student/young adults who really should have a job railcard offers.

I will refrain from pointing out how the majority of people working out in the rain and wind at 2am keeping the trains running don't get a travel discount..............

 

[cuccir]

The problem here is they're missing a whole group of people who are 28-35 who have also been shat on by the Government. Granted, not as much as perhaps the post-2000's but anyone who was born 1984/5 up to 1999 has been completely missed out.

Agreed, as someone who is in this group I'm not entirely sure how we have been 'completely missed out' in this instance. I enjoyed my Railcard from 16-25 as had people for many years before me.

There are other ways my generation has perhaps been hard-done by; equally I'd have rather had my university education at £1,500/3,000 a year without a Railcard from 25-30 than £9,000 a year with a chance of one!!!!

 

[Mag_seven]

Is this a government initiative then - are the so called "private" TOC's getting even more taxpayers money to subsidise this?

 

[yorkie]

Is this a government initiative then - are the so called "private" TOC's getting even more taxpayers money to subsidise this?

They'll be underwriting the risk, but it is expected to be "revenue neutral" (I think it will actually be revenue positive)

 

[Bletchleyite]

I would be very happy with that and would even pay a decent sum (way above current railcard levels) to obtain the kind of discount the student/young adults who really should have a job railcard offers.

I agree.

I would certainly pay £100-£120 or thereabouts per year for a national Railcard. And it would seriously increase my rail travel, and often it wouldn't even reduce the fares paid, it would make me more likely to use walk-ups at a higher fare (these are my preference but are getting expensive these days).

Tenner a month on direct debit with it as a fiver a month for the first three months as a sweetener, and loads of people will "buy and forget" too even if it isn't actually saving them money.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There are other ways my generation has perhaps been hard-done by; equally I'd have rather had my university education at £1,500/3,000 a year without a Railcard from 25-30 than £9,000 a year with a chance of one!!!!

£0pa was good.

Actually, it was technically around -£1500pa, with -£3000 for my year in Germany, and a £1600pa ish optional mortgage-style loan on top intended to contribute towards hall fees, food and other general subsistence. I was the last year who got this deal (started Sep 1997).

Yes, that's a much better deal than a Railcard, and I wish current students could have it too (and would be willing to take the tax hit for it provided apprenticeships were equally funded on a German style model as they are just as important).

But I would pay a fairly hefty price for a National Railcard if there was one, and with me it would certainly be revenue positive to the railway, possibly by a very significant sum. The Network Railcard certainly makes me more likely to travel by rail in the SE, but in the other direction the higher fares without the discount tend to mean the car gets a greater look-in.

 

[Bletchleyite]

By Yorkie from the other thread:

I don't think it makes sense to make all fares 30% cheaper, but it does make sense to have a National Railcard that anyone can use. It could even cost a three-figure sum; people would pay that.

Agreed as above. A First Class version at an even heftier three figure sum would I suspect also sell well.

 

[DarloRich]

I agree.

I would certainly pay £100-£120 or thereabouts per year for a national Railcard. And it would seriously increase my rail travel, and often it wouldn't even reduce the fares paid, it would make me more likely to use walk-ups at a higher fare (these are my preference but are getting expensive these days).

Tenner a month on direct debit with it as a fiver a month for the first three months as a sweetener, and loads of people will "buy and forget" too even if it isn't actually saving them money.

agreed - where do I sign? I have no car so rely on the train for travel. A third off any off peak travel would be fantastic.

 

[Wombat]

We have many railcards and most stations have racks with all of the individual ones, but I rarely see anyone take any.

I've literally just signed my first Two Together card. I've been married for fifteen years and could have put the card to good use throughout that period (if it's existed that long?), but I only found out about the card a couple of weeks ago (on this forum). God knows how much I could have saved; I prefer not to do the calculation because it would depress me. Obviously you can reasonably argue that it's my own fault for not looking into it earlier, but I don't think I'm unusually unobservant or thoughtless so I suspect that quite a lot of potential users just don't know about it.

 

[ainsworth74]

That product is only two or three years old so it isn't fifteen years that you've missed out on.

 

[Ianno87]

Glad the 26-30 railcard is now confirmed. From a personal interest, if it could be launched on or before 18th April 2018...

 

[Be3G]

I just read that story and too was confused. Perhaps the BBC has got it completely wrong again?

I don't see how, seeing as it contains a quote from RDG – unless you're saying the BBC have attributed the quote incorrectly, which is a possibility I suppose.

 

[Wombat]

That product is only two or three years old so it isn't fifteen years that you've missed out on.

That makes me feel better, thank you!

 

[Mojo]

I don't see how, seeing as it contains a quote from RDG – unless you're saying the BBC have attributed the quote incorrectly, which is a possibility I suppose.

The story is now completely different compared to when I read it (and made my post) at 4.50am this morning.

I cannot see a quote from RDG in there (as of 3.36pm the story says "1 Hour ago") but it does contain the line "The national roll-out of the card comes after a successful test of the discounted card in East Anglia" which is broadly similar to one of the lines in the story I recall from this morning; the point remains that as far as I (and others) can see, no trial has commenced, and this morning's iteration of the story contained at least one more reference to this trial.

 

[bb21]

I would be very happy with that and would even pay a decent sum (way above current railcard levels) to obtain the kind of discount the student/young adults who really should have a job railcard offers.

I will refrain from pointing out how the majority of people working out in the rain and wind at 2am keeping the trains running don't get a travel discount..............

Railway staff should be entitled to discounted travel imo without having to resort to public-rate fares, and that includes all parts of the railway. The amount of waste in money going forwards and backwards for duty travel is quite eye-watering I would imagine from what I have seen.

It would also stop the ridiculous current situation with countless local and reciprocal agreements which no one bar a very select small minority of revenue staff can get on top of anyway.

 

[Merseysider]

Wait, so the media are saying that the trial was a success, when in fact there hasn't actually been a trial yet?

 

[IanXC]

Why am I drawn to a Yes Minister quote?

[How can we get away with such a large civil service pay settlement?]
- Easy. Reduce the size of the Civil Service.
- What?!
- If the service were smaller than last time, a comfortable rise for individuals looks smaller.
- Real reductions in the size of the service?!
- It would be the end of civilisation as we know it!
- No, my dear Humphrey. All you do is stop calling them civil servants.
- Take the museums, for instance. If you turn them into independent trusts, the staff stop being classified as civil servants. They're still the same people doing the same job and still paid by government grants, but as it's a grant it doesn't count in the pay statistics. Unless anyone inquires closely, it will look like a cutback.
- Can we set up so many trusts in time?
- You won't have to. It only has to be planned. If it doesn't happen, it won't be your fault. Meanwhile, you should be able
to get the rise to work out at 6% overall.

Government is all about presentation eh. Shame Governments without fail are so bad at it then!

 

[D365]

I just read that story and too was confused. Perhaps the BBC has got it completely wrong again?

Rail Technology Magazine have said exactly the same:

Chancellor Philip Hammond will announce an extension of the 16-25 railcard to cover people up to 30 years old.

The plan is set to be revealed at Wednesday’s Autumn Budget, after successful trials in East Anglia.

It is expected to cost £30 and work in the same way as the current edition, giving travellers up to one third off train tickets.

Railway staff should be entitled to discounted travel imo without having to resort to public-rate fares, and that includes all parts of the railway.

Ironically when it comes to travel expenses I seem to make frequent use of my own personal railcard

 

[James H]

From Mayor of London Sadiq Khan - written answer published tonight.

New railcard for 26-30 year olds
Question No: 2017/4461

Tom Copley
The Rail Delivery Group have announced a new railcard for 26-30 year olds which will launch next year. Will you commit TfL to ensure that it can be linked to Oyster when it launches in the same way that 16-25 railcards can be?

The Mayor
TfL understands that the Rail Delivery Group aims to trial a new railcard for 26-30 year olds during 2018, though no public announcement has as yet been made. TfL has indicated that it will be happy to participate in the trial, including linking the new discount to Oyster cards in the same way as the 16-25 railcard. TfL understands that the trial is likely to be limited to 10 000 people spread across the UK, so the impact on London will be limited.

 

[Starmill]

They'll be underwriting the risk, but it is expected to be "revenue neutral" (I think it will actually be revenue positive)

Have you seen the specifics? Public risk, private profit?

It amuses me hugely that the Chancellor thinks that a commercial tool used to generate revenue for private companies which he is spending £0 on is a good way to secure political points and presumably future votes for the Conservative party. In fact, I find it hilarious.

Sadly, I am concerned too that some people might actually believe he did this for our benefit.

 

[Starmill]

student/young adults who really should have a job railcard offers.

When will you learn that nobody wants to hear this in every thread? It's rubbish for so many reasons (which we have debated before many times) and it makes you look like a complete twit.

 

[yorksrob]

Well, if it does go ahead it's a step in the right direction.

Only a step mind.

 

[bb21]

Have you seen the specifics? Public risk, private profit?

It amuses me hugely that the Chancellor thinks that a commercial tool used to generate revenue for private companies which he is spending £0 on is a good way to secure political points and presumably future votes for the Conservative party. In fact, I find it hilarious.

Sadly, I am concerned too that some people might actually believe he did this for our benefit.

If that is all he has to show for his so-called "support" then the desperat-o-meter must be rather high.

 

[DarloRich]

When will you learn that nobody wants to hear this in every thread? It's rubbish for so many reasons (which we have debated before many times) and it makes you look like a complete twit.

When will you learn that I really don't care what you or anyone else (other than moderators here) thinks and I will continue to post whatever I like. Sorry if that hits a little close to home and challenges your sense of entitlement.

Why should students and former students who cant be bothered to get a job get a discount on train travel when the people out shoveling crap in the dark and the wet keeping the trains running don't?

 

[MikeWh]

Why should students and former students who cant be bothered to get a job get a discount on train travel when the people out shoveling crap in the dark and the wet keeping the trains running don't?

I think the personal insults should cease.

Are you saying that everyone should leave education at 16 and get a job? What about jobs which you can't do without many years of training, eg doctors?

 

[BigCj34]

I think the personal insults should cease.

Are you saying that everyone should leave education at 16 and get a job? What about jobs which you can't do without many years of training, eg doctors?

Thought there was a Jobcentre card offering half-price travel for the supposedly 'lazy' anyway.

 

[bb21]

When will you learn that I really don't care what you or anyone else (other than moderators here) thinks and I will continue to post whatever I like. Sorry if that hits a little close to home and challenges your sense of entitlement.

Why should students and former students who cant be bothered to get a job get a discount on train travel when the people out shoveling crap in the dark and the wet keeping the trains running don't?

While I agree with your sentiment re: the latter group, I don't think the generalisation re: the "cant be bothered" part is helpful. Obviously there are lots of lazy layabouts around, but that only constitutes a small proportion in most cases.

 

[yorkie]

When will you learn that I really don't care what you or anyone else (other than moderators here) thinks and I will continue to post whatever I like. Sorry if that hits a little close to home and challenges your sense of entitlement.

Why should students and former students who cant be bothered to get a job get a discount on train travel when the people out shoveling crap in the dark and the wet keeping the trains running don't?

It's not a question of giving people who 'cant be bothered to get a job' a discount while not giving hard working people a discount.

The extension of this Railcard means people in that age bracket who don't otherwise qualify for a discount will benefit in future, so the comment "students and former students who cant be bothered to get a job get a discount" makes no sense when you consider the fact that people in the first category (students) already got the discount before these changes anyway!

Anyone aged 26-30 will benefit in future, ie. this includes people of that age "shovelling crap in the dark and the wet keeping the trains running".

I would agree with you if your argument is simply that there should be a Railcard available to all.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That's certainly my argument, and as I said I am certain that for my usage pattern (and journeys I presently don't make due to cost) such a Railcard (at a premium price of around £100-120) would be revenue positive to the railway, possibly very significantly so.

I think he does agree with that?