Redoubling Cambridge to Chippenham Junction (Newmarket)

[Meerkat]

Oh defo the crayons!
It just seems a bit silly to have an airfield in an urban area,but build houses way out of the City on a bigger airfield that will create far more car movements

 

[Aureol Colin]

Oh defo the crayons!
It just seems a bit silly to have an airfield in an urban area,but build houses way out of the City on a bigger airfield that will create far more car movements

I suspect that there is a perception in the Ministry of Defence that it will be more lucrative building houses on Mildenhall, than doing a deal with Marshalls

 

[Steve Harris]

Oh defo the crayons!
It just seems a bit silly to have an airfield in an urban area,but build houses way out of the City on a bigger airfield that will create far more car movements

Silly ???

Thats Councils/Goverment for you !!

If you had researched what your talking about, you would have known that Cambridge Airport has already moved once. And its been on its current site for ni on a Century.

All the housing which surrounds the airport has been built after the airport was moved to its current location.

I suggest you read "The Marshall Story: A Century of Wings and Wheels". It explains the company and its history in great detail. Along with how they trained the pilots for the War.


You also forget one thing, the Goverment loves the car (all that fuel duty etc).

Plus, do you know of a Goverement / Council to build affordable houses where the jobs are ?
Cambridge housing is pretty much unaffordable for the people working in Cambridge!

It recently had the CB1 development (right next to the railway station), I wonder what percent of the occupants of that development work in Cambridge, (I bet most commute to London).

 

[Class 170101]

You also forget one thing, the Goverment loves the car (all that fuel duty etc).

Not sure about that. If they did it wouldn't be frozen as it has been for several years. I think the government in power loves power more.

 

[Steve Harris]

Not sure about that. If they did it wouldn't be frozen as it has been for several years. I think the government in power loves power more.

True! I think if they hadn't of frozen it though there would be civil unrest.

I will stop there though, as we now are getting truely of topic.

 

[Steve Harris]

I suspect that there is a perception in the Ministry of Defence that it will be more lucrative building houses on Mildenhall, than doing a deal with Marshalls

You have probably hit the nail on the head, considering how much the MOD budget has been cut.

 

[bspahh]

The Cambridge News reports that Marshalls is planning to move away from Cambridge airport. It is "considering three potential new locations: Cranfield, Duxford and Wyton" and plans to build 12,000 houses and 5,000,000 square feet of business and commercial space on the airport.
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/ne...dge-airport-close-relocate-marshalls-16273168

 

[Steve Harris]

The Cambridge News reports that Marshalls is planning to move away from Cambridge airport. It is "considering three potential new locations: Cranfield, Duxford and Wyton" and plans to build 12,000 houses and 5,000,000 square feet of business and commercial space on the airport.
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/ne...dge-airport-close-relocate-marshalls-16273168

Yep. Planning (as you put it).

Btw, not all of "Marshalls" will be moving. The Marshall Family own a lot of businesses,
The one which might move is Marshall Aerospace & Defence Group. (I personally can't see the car dealerships on Newmarket Road moving.)

And i won't be holding my breath that they indeed do move, as in the early to mid noughties they looked at moving to Waterbeach, Mildenhall or Wyton ! (Wyton was discounted due to poor road links, but now the A14 is being upgraded, its probably why its being looked at again.) And that came to nout.

For what its worth, I can see the Wisbech rail service being reinstated first

 

[camflyer]

Fairly inevitable that Marshalls would move out one day as the land must be worth a fortune. I'm not against the redevelopment of the airport but it has to be done properly with good road and rail/metro connections.

 

[Steve Harris]

I'm not against the redevelopment of the airport but it has to be done properly with good road and rail/metro connections.

I doubt if it will (going on past local council performance). Cambridge has a very poor excuse as a Ring Road (normal road with housing on it), Other cities seem to have dual carriageway Ring Roads (with no housing on them or side streets).

Hopefully I will be proved wrong. However, I can only see a possible rail connection to the development already taking place north of the Airport (using the trackbed of the Cambridge - Mildenhall line).
I'd have a guess at the Airport being either guided bus or part of the new metro which will be tunneled under Cambridge.

 

[whittlesfordok]

A railway station off Coldhams Road? Cambridge East, the lines there (Cambridge-Ipswich)

 

[camflyer]

A railway station off Coldhams Road? Cambridge East, the lines there (Cambridge-Ipswich)

A new station around Cherry Hinton would seem to be a no-brainer. Lots of hosing, major employers (e.g. ARM) and Fulbourn Hospital to serve.

 

[Bald Rick]

A new station around Cherry Hinton would seem to be a no-brainer. Lots of hosing, major employers (e.g. ARM) and Fulbourn Hospital to serve.

Unfortunately the timetable doesn’t allow it, at least not without dropping a call at Dullingham or Newmarket. But perhaps the new trains will help.

 

[ac6000cw]

A new station around Cherry Hinton would seem to be a no-brainer. Lots of hosing, major employers (e.g. ARM) and Fulbourn Hospital to serve.

I'd put it next to Tesco (between Cherry Hinton and Fulbourn). Decent bus connections available there (including to the important Addenbrookes Hospital site) in addition to the local walking and cycling access.

P.S. Most of the 'Fulbourn Hospital' site is now offices, including the old Victorian hospital building, so has reasonable inward commuting potential (like the business park just down the road which houses ARM and other companies).

 

[philjo]

I commute 3-4 days a week to the business park behind Tesco. I get the GN/Thameslink service to Cambridge then the number 3 bus & walk from Tesco. If the buses get caught in traffic & are late arriving at Tesco some afternoons it can take 45 minutes from leaving the office to get back to Cambridge station. It would be much easier to be able to catch a train - even if it is only an hourly service.

Ideally in the future there should be a facility to turn services back at Newmarket. Then the portion of the Kings Cross-Kings Lynn service that splits at Cambridge could extend to Newmarket, calling at Cherry Hinton. This would help particularly on race days. Most mornings there are usually a number of commuters running across the bridge at Cambridge on the tight connection between the arrival of the Ipswich train to the 0740 Kings Cross train. Though obviously this would need the line wiring to Newmarket!
But the Ipswich train calling hourly at Cherry Hinton would be a start.

 

[eastdyke]

@Bald Rick was kind enough to post a link on the 'East West Rail: Progress and Updates thread' at post #2953
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/east-west-rail-progress-and-updates.99892/page-99#post-3960321
There is a little discussion in the posts following.

Network Rail: Cambridgeshire Corridor Stud: Railway investment choice

https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Cambridgeshire-Corridor-Study-2019.pdf
Clearly both 'early days' and 'long term' options to allow for passenger growth but this does include possible doubling of Coldhams Lane Junc. to (nr) Teversham, and upping the service to Cambridge from Newmarket (with a turnback there) to 3tph by 2043. This could enable a new station at Cambridge 'East' (Cherry Hinton) to cater as both a parkway station and to serve the new developments in that vicinity.
It has been pointed out that 2043 is a long way off

 

[camflyer]

I commute 3-4 days a week to the business park behind Tesco. I get the GN/Thameslink service to Cambridge then the number 3 bus & walk from Tesco. If the buses get caught in traffic & are late arriving at Tesco some afternoons it can take 45 minutes from leaving the office to get back to Cambridge station. It would be much easier to be able to catch a train - even if it is only an hourly service.

Ideally in the future there should be a facility to turn services back at Newmarket. Then the portion of the Kings Cross-Kings Lynn service that splits at Cambridge could extend to Newmarket, calling at Cherry Hinton. This would help particularly on race days. Most mornings there are usually a number of commuters running across the bridge at Cambridge on the tight connection between the arrival of the Ipswich train to the 0740 Kings Cross train. Though obviously this would need the line wiring to Newmarket!
But the Ipswich train calling hourly at Cherry Hinton would be a start.

The connection between the arrival of the train from Ipswich/BSE/Newmarket and the departing fast London train is so tight that it isn't given in online timetables - it suggests waiting for the next one - and even if you do run across the bridge quick enough you will be the last onboard and without a seat. Until the last timetable change the connection was much more achievable.

 

[Steve Harris]

A railway station off Coldhams Road? Cambridge East, the lines there (Cambridge-Ipswich)

Good luck with that one.

It is Coldhams Lane btw, and I've lived in the Cambridge area long enough to know that there was a Blue Circle Cement works between Coldhams Lane and the Railway Line with a rather big pit which was filled in with household waste. Which hazard a guess would rather inflate the cost of a station there, and I can't see one being built on Coldhams Common.

As others have suggested, somewhere in Cherry Hinton makes more sense, unless of course you live on the Airport development when its built.

 

[bspahh]

As others have suggested, somewhere in Cherry Hinton makes more sense, unless of course you live on the Airport development when its built.

A station near the new development on the airport will make a lot more sense to the developers there. If building a station near there increases the value of the land, then there will be more section 106 money to go around for more infrastructure.

 

[trebor79]

[...] part of the new metro which will be tunneled under Cambridge.

Eh? What metro? If be surprised if anyone is seriously suggesting tunnels under Cambridge.

 

[Ianno87]

A station near the new development on the airport will make a lot more sense to the developers there. If building a station near there increases the value of the land, then there will be more section 106 money to go around for more infrastructure.

...but an Airport site station is Transport Planning nonsense.

A 1tph train service the short distance to Cambridge station (from where you need to change to onward travel anyway to reach the City Centre or Addenbrooke's) will not attract commuters living on the airport site compared to a frequent bus service direct to Addenbrooke's or Central Cambridge.

 

[edwin_m]

...but an Airport site station is Transport Planning nonsense.

A 1tph train service the short distance to Cambridge station (from where you need to change to onward travel anyway to reach the City Centre or Addenbrooke's) will not attract commuters living on the airport site compared to a frequent bus service direct to Addenbrooke's or Central Cambridge.

Cambridge North is a similar distance away, and like there I assume market would be commuting from nearby housing to, and to nearby businesses from, beyond Cambridge itself. The train service frequency and the size of the market, along with most passengers having to change trains at Cambridge main station, means the passenger numbers would be much lower than Cambridge North.

 

[camflyer]

Eh? What metro? If be surprised if anyone is seriously suggesting tunnels under Cambridge.

There has been plenty of talk about it
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-47670606
https://www.newcivilengineer.com/la...boosted-by-feasibility-study/10041133.article
http://www.cambridge-connect.uk/resources/cambridge-proposals/

With a small crowded city centre with narrow streets, tunnelling under Cambridge would be expensive but it might be the only feasible option

 

[Steve Harris]

Eh? What metro? If be surprised if anyone is seriously suggesting tunnels under Cambridge.

Yes !
Please keep up at the back there !!

It has been well documented, and is one of Mayor Palmer's pet projects.

 

[trebor79]

Well that's never going to happen.

I think the airfield redevelopment will happen this time. Last time it would have been classed as Greenfield, whereas under current rules the whole site is classes as brownfield, which is ludicrous.
It's a shame to lose such a good local airport, I've flown in there a number of times.

 

[ashkeba]

Cambridge North is a similar distance away, and like there I assume market would be commuting from nearby housing to, and to nearby businesses from, beyond Cambridge itself. The train service frequency and the size of the market, along with most passengers having to change trains at Cambridge main station, means the passenger numbers would be much lower than Cambridge North.

1.5 miles from the edge of the Airport site to Cambridge North once the new footbridge alongside the railway is completed. 2 miles to Cambridge City. I doubt a third station so close in such a small city is viable. Looking at neighbouring similar-or-bigger conurbations, the main stations in Oxford and MK are about 4 miles apart and people still grumble about those. Poor old Norwich only has one station.

It would be good to have a link to Mildenhall if much building there is planned but heaven knows how!

 

[Steve Harris]

A station near the new development on the airport will make a lot more sense to the developers there. If building a station near there increases the value of the land, then there will be more section 106 money to go around for more infrastructure.

As per post #100

However, I can only see a possible rail connection to the development already taking place north of the Airport (using the trackbed of the Cambridge - Mildenhall line).

Which I was shot down in flames for suggesting (the reasons for my decision are in post #108 which you have quoted part of).

I can't see that a station will worry the developers (One of which is a Marshall Group company and having a family member who worked for them, i know their methods and thinking reasonably well).

 

[Ianno87]

Cambridge North is a similar distance away, and like there I assume market would be commuting from nearby housing to, and to nearby businesses from, beyond Cambridge itself. The train service frequency and the size of the market, along with most passengers having to change trains at Cambridge main station, means the passenger numbers would be much lower than Cambridge North.

Nobody would choose to move to Cambridge, with the cost of living that entails, then choose a reverse commute to Bury St Edmunds....

 

[MarkyT]

I'd put it next to Tesco (between Cherry Hinton and Fulbourn). Decent bus connections available there (including to the important Addenbrookes Hospital site) in addition to the local walking and cycling access.

Agreed that's an excellent site. Any closer and it'd be too close to the centre, where local demand is better served by existing bus services. Perhaps developers could come to an agreement to deck the Tesco car park to accommodate rail users, while using the same road junction access. Close to the East side of any airfield redevelopment.

 

[Steve Harris]

Nobody would choose to move to Cambridge, with the cost of living that entails, then choose a reverse commute to Bury St Edmunds....

It's funny you say that. About 12 years ago I knew someone who's son lived in London and commuted to Cambridge 5 days a week (bearing in mind at that time it was always the other way round).

The chances are rare I admit, but I still get surprised by some peoples decision making.