Revised EMR Regional Timetables - From 19th June

[Tomnick]

The service does seem to have run a lot better over the last two days. If stopping anual leave has done this then I can't help but feel that this should have been done months ago,staff could have had payments in lieu of taking time off and leaving customers stranded.

You can't just stop all leave indefinitely, especially not whilst relying heavily on rest day work. You'd be in a worse position due to the destruction of goodwill and morale alone, let alone the legal implications and consequences for stress and fatigue levels.

That just sums the railway up. Surely as much booked weeks of leave as possible should be shoved into unpopular weeks as more people are willing to do overtime on such weeks and the numbers opting to take their own choice of leave will be much lower in January than in the run up to Xmas.

Our block weeks are allocated over 48 weeks (crucially, a number that's divisible by four), and the quota for each week assumes that the leave's spread evenly over the year. It's inevitable that there'll end up being a bit of an imbalance, after swaps into vacant blocks and new starters with pre-existing leave.

This is the time of year when there's traditionally more of a focus on road learning, taking advantage of the generally lower levels of leave being taken, so even that imbalance isn't really a problem.

 

[m_m]

East Midlands Railway services cut due to 'Covid pressures' - BBC News

At this point, this is just ridiculous. What have they got against running trains from Nottingham to anywhere but London?

 

[LowLevel]

East Midlands Railway services cut due to 'Covid pressures' - BBC News

At this point, this is just ridiculous. What have they got against running trains from Nottingham to anywhere but London?

It's less severe than it sounds in the article, they've got some of the detail wrong. By all accounts DfT wanted cuts of up to 40% but EMR pushed back and they settled on knocking just a couple of diagrams out.

 

[Killingworth]

East Midlands Railway services cut due to 'Covid pressures' - BBC News

At this point, this is just ridiculous. What have they got against running trains from Nottingham to anywhere but London?

Some in Liverpool, Manchester and Sheffield might say the same; https://www.eastmidlandsrailway.co.uk/amended-timetable

However, the sad thing probably is that we're coping without and the fear is growing that we'll have to cope without for a lot longer. Having tried to promote locally the through service that starts in Liverpool at 6.47 for leisure trips towards Nottingham and Norwich last year I was a bit miffed to find it suspended 2 weeks later, and still not returning. To be fair it was chosen for promotion as a Covid safe all but empty train!

 

[Watershed]

It's less severe than it sounds in the article, they've got some of the detail wrong. By all accounts DfT wanted cuts of up to 40% but EMR pushed back and they settled on knocking just a couple of diagrams out.

Indeed, a hopelessly inaccurate article.

The routes cut include weekday services from Derby and Nottingham to London St Pancras, as well as some from Nottingham to Worksop, and Nottingham to Mansfield Woodhouse.

There's a critical word missing there - some weekday services! Might be obvious to us but an uninformed MOP might think there will no longer be any trains between Derby/Nottingham and London on weekdays. Stranger things have happened (e.g. London Victoria losing all Southern services recently!).

Several lines due to be reinstated last week, including Nottingham to Norwich and Nottingham to Liverpool, have been cancelled.

Ah yes, no services at all between Liverpool and Norwich.

Honestly, do these "journalists" even bother reading what they write?

Arguably the most notable cut, Newark to Crewe being started at Derby yet again (conveniently meaning they can count that as running in their "4%" claim), barely gets a mention.

 

[Failed Unit]

I have found in the past 2 weeks the regional routes have ran more reliably then we have seen for a long time. I hope we don't see the return of 4 hours gaps in the service (which is the impact of taking out a single diagram in places link Lincolnshire)

 

[43055]

East Midlands Railway services cut due to 'Covid pressures' - BBC News

At this point, this is just ridiculous. What have they got against running trains from Nottingham to anywhere but London?

It does feel at times EMR is a bit London centric.

As for the timetables I'm just glad it's not going back to last year where most routes where 2 hourly. I would question the continuation of the strike Sunday timetables on the regional side especially running buses between Derby and Crewe!

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

EMR has published the revisions here

No change to the Corby services stays half hourly despite they run lightly loaded yet other operators are being forced to hack back services. No doubt wouldn't look good on a newly electrified route

 

[STINT47]

On this occasion there are actually some cuts to the London service with a few Nottingham services removed. Apparently they have gone for the lightly used services such as the 09:50 from Nottingham.

I'm not sure why we still have to endure no services between Nottingham and Derby on Sundays. Even one train shuttling back and forwards every 90 minuets or so would be much better than nothing. I guess foe me it will continue to be Trent Bartin buses for some time to cone.

I do wonder if Covid is being used as an excuse for no Sunday trains. First it was due to a strike, then when it was suspended it was due to the possibility of the strikes being restarted and now that strikes have ended all of a sudden Covid prevents the service from running.

Sadly I fear some of the reductions made over the last year will become permanent. The goverment demands cost savings coupled with EMR management incompetence will create a perfect storm to poor service for years to come.

 

[LowLevel]

Indeed, a hopelessly inaccurate article.


There's a critical word missing there - some weekday services! Might be obvious to us but an uninformed MOP might think there will no longer be any trains between Derby/Nottingham and London on weekdays. Stranger things have happened (e.g. London Victoria losing all Southern services recently!).


Ah yes, no services at all between Liverpool and Norwich.

Honestly, do these "journalists" even bother reading what they write?

Arguably the most notable cut, Newark to Crewe being started at Derby yet again (conveniently meaning they can count that as running in their "4%" claim), barely gets a mention.

I believe there is one Derby to Newark round trip cut too, not all of them (and it's Nottingham - Newark cut on Saturdays).

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Sadly I fear some of the reductions made over the last year will become permanent. The goverment demands cost savings coupled with EMR management incompetence will create a perfect storm to poor service for years to come.

Indeed and lack of train crew is a ruse to cut back services yet EMR managed to run 100% of IC and Connect services yesterday out of STP.

 

[Bald Rick]

Indeed and lack of train crew is a ruse to cut back services yet EMR managed to run 100% of IC and Connect services yesterday out of STP.

that’s where the money is.

 

[LowLevel]

I wouldn't say the current crewing situation is great but it's certainly manageable. Rumour has it the DfT wanted far more to be cut (no Liverpool services beyond Sheffield) but they were persuaded otherwise.

 

[ChrisC]

Cutting the 1527 departure from Nottingham to Worksop leaves a 2 hour gap in a service which was already cut in June to hourly from half hourly between Nottingham and Mansfield. This also results in the 1639 departure from Worksop being cut leaving a 90 minute gap without a train from Mansfield to Nottingham at the evening peak time.

 

[Killingworth]

The 4% figure intrigues me. Does a train that runs only a half or third of its scheduled route get counted as cancelled?

It has been if I want to travel the full route. It hasn't if I was only going on it for the section that's still running.There appear to be quite a lot of these. Perhaps all the fractions are collected to reach the overall figure.

To be fair to EMR it seems most of the route miles are indeed being covered, which makes it all the harder for those wanting to use the small number of services that aren't running.

Looking at ORR figures in their latest Rail Industry Finance (UK) report is salutory, see; https://dataportal.orr.gov.uk/statistics/finance/rail-industry-finance/ Two graphs from that below. We all know rail is heavily subsidised, but in the last year it was horrendous. No wonder the DfT and Treasury are getting twitchy. Against that backdrop we're lucky to be getting as many services as we are. Fare income on many services is clearly negligible if the average fare was £4.74 per journey in 2020-21, just 20.2% down on 2019-20.

​

 

[SilentGrade]

that’s where the money is.

Is there money in the connect services? All I ever hear is they're carting around fresh air!

 

[gordonthemoron]

EMR has published the revisions here

No change to the Corby services stays half hourly despite they run lightly loaded yet other operators are being forced to hack back services. No doubt wouldn't look good on a newly electrified route

Hopefuly I'll be using EMR Connect from Bedford to Kettering next week, to connect with a train to Nottingham. Keeping connecting trains runnng is good

 

[I like Class 153]

I wish that the direct.Matlock to Nottingham was back on

 

[Bald Rick]

Is there money in the connect services? All I ever hear is they're carting around fresh air!

Yes, although obviously less than intended.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Yes, although obviously less than intended.

With EMR providing a better offering than TLk to Bedford they will be running around with more fresh air between Bedford and Luton and service provision is way too much. Might not be able to fix it in the short term but the 9Rxx should terminate at Luton and only return to Bedford for stabling. That will save a couple of diagrams.

 

[Bald Rick]

Might not be able to fix it in the short term but the 9Rxx should terminate at Luton and only return to Bedford for stabling. That will save a couple of diagrams.

You’ve said that before, but it would need a recast of the TL timetable and a wholesale change to diagrams. And you wouldn’t save any Bedford drivers, indeed you’d probably need more!

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

You’ve said that before, but it would need a recast of the TL timetable and a wholesale change to diagrams. And you wouldn’t save any Bedford drivers, indeed you’d probably need more!

Like i say not short term but the industry needs to develop its own solutions to match service provision to likely demand not just let DofT impose half baked solutions. However, until GBR is setup as an arms length autonomous organisation from DofT nothing much will change.

 

[Bald Rick]

Like i say not short term but the industry needs to develop its own solutions to match service provision to likely demand not just let DofT impose half baked solutions

DfT are not imposing half baked solutions. They are agreeing to proposals made by TOCs.

 

[Killingworth]

Like i say not short term but the industry needs to develop its own solutions to match service provision to likely demand not just let DofT impose half baked solutions. However, until GBR is setup as an arms length autonomous organisation from DofT nothing much will change.

Assuming GBR is set up at arms length (define an arms length) what would change for the better? There's still a massive shortfall of ticket revenue over total costs for running the railway and subsidy, support, whatever, would still have to be signed off by somebody. The danger is that each reorganisation tends to give us more complicated structures with new sets of problems. It seems GBR is treading cautiously, as it should in these extraordinary times

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Assuming GBR is set up at arms length (define an arms length) what would change for the better? There's still a massive shortfall of ticket revenue over total costs for running the railway and subsidy, support, whatever, would still have to be signed off by somebody. The danger is that each reorganisation tends to give us more complicated structures with new sets of problems. It seems GBR is treading cautiously, as it should in these extraordinary times

Well they [GBR] would be charged, i hope although accept this is an assumption still, to develop an overall service provision that delivers both social need, where necessary, as well as a unified integrated timetable which removes overlapping service provision from different operators. So my example related to this thread is currently Bedford has 4x12 car 700 (2664 seats) and 2x8car 360 (560 seats) per hour. I appreciate they serve many stations and you have to start them somewhere but now you have the Corby service there is no need to run 4x12 cars to Bedford by Thameslink so you would respecify service provision to Bedford to be two semi fast Corby services and two stopping services. GBR could take this holistic overview is my expectation but i might be disappointed I know.

 

[Killingworth]

Well they [GBR] would be charged, i hope although accept this is an assumption still, to develop an overall service provision that delivers both social need, where necessary, as well as a unified integrated timetable which removes overlapping service provision from different operators. So my example related to this thread is currently Bedford has 4x12 car 700 (2664 seats) and 2x8car 360 (560 seats) per hour. I appreciate they serve many stations and you have to start them somewhere but now you have the Corby service there is no need to run 4x12 cars to Bedford by Thameslink so you would respecify service provision to Bedford to be two semi fast Corby services and two stopping services. GBR could take this holistic overview is my expectation but i might be disappointed I know.

My own example would be more complex tp resolve Anything involving cenral Manchester must be because services there have rippling impacts across the country through cities like Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool and beyond.

The services on my line serve commuters to Sheffield and Manchester, leisure users from end to end, leisure users to intermediate stations and with a mixture of the same going beyond both city centres. All with 3 operators all using different rolling stock with 2, 3, 4 or 6 coaches. Get the centre bit right and it will be wrong In Liverpool or Nottingham.

I'll see how the final December 22 changes work out before suggesting changing anything else, but suspect further tweaking will be needed, GBR or not.

 

[bunnahabhain]

There appears to be a proposal to transfer most calls at Longport to the WMR franchise from May, to speed up the EMR service and make it more reliable. Very tight consultation deadline however.

 

[Deafdoggie]

There appears to be a proposal to transfer most calls at Longport to the WMR franchise from May, to speed up the EMR service and make it more reliable. Very tight consultation deadline however.

A long overdue alteration! All that's needed now is a return train from Manchester!

 

[Llandudno]

There appears to be a proposal to transfer most calls at Longport to the WMR franchise from May, to speed up the EMR service and make it more reliable. Very tight consultation deadline however.

Anything that speeds up this useful East Midlands to north West service is a good thing!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

A small number of trains are re-instated from 14th February.
Details are on the EMR website.
Don't get too excited though, they can be counted without taking your socks off.