Road closed in Market Harborough as lorry hits bridge minutes after it is repaired.

Discussion in 'Infrastructure & Stations' started by DanDaDriver, 15 Jan 2019.

  1. AndyW33

    AndyW33 Member

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    Actually we are talking about something complex. Sure, if the vehicle has a permanently mounted body, then the height can be painted in the cab. But lots of these accidents involve artics, and it isn't the tractor unit that fails to clear the bridge, it's the trailer. By their very nature, any artic tractor unit can pull any trailer, and these can be anything between flatbed and maximum height boxes. And the load on the flatbeds could be any height. Now some operators only use one type of trailer, and these should have no issue with marking the height in the cab, but others haul a variety of trailers in the course of a days work and there is no system for reminding the driver of the height of the trailer/load once he/she has set off.
    Of course there's no difficulty in providing a small whiteboard or digital display for the driver to enter the height on, but the haulier has to actually provide it, and the driver has to remember to use it before setting off.
     
  2. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    Good point although the height should be on the trailer and if it isn't the driver should query it, obviously on car transporters the height will vary according to the load.
     
  3. Lucan

    Lucan Member

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    One problem is with lorries carrying digger type equipment with hydraulic arms. The shaking during the journey can make the hydaulics pump up through non-return valves, progressively raising the arm - these need to be lashed down during transport but of course lorry drivers cannot spare the time. That is what happened in the M20 incident in 2016 :-
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-37204050
     
    Last edited: 18 Jan 2019
  4. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    It is a legal requirement that such arms are CHAINED down, but, again, we are talking the road haulage industry where corner cutting to save cost is rife, and getting caught is an occupational hazard factored into the cost.
     
  5. edwin_m

    edwin_m Veteran Member

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    I thought they concluded on that one that the truck had pulled onto the hard shoulder, where the headroom under the sloping bridge was substandard.

    There was one in Keyworth (Nottinghamshire) some years back where a digger on a lorry struck the bridge, swung round and took the side out of a passing bus. That bridge now has over-height warnings and turning circles on both approaches. Ironic as the railway is the non-electrified northern end of the Old Dalby test track, rarely if ever used.
     
  6. DanDaDriver

    DanDaDriver Member

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    The standards to be a doctor are so high that the NHS is struggling to fill vacancies. Therefore we’re letting this bloke we met down the dog track have a go at taking your appendix out.
     
  7. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    The standards to be a lorry driver are so high and that's the problem. Not only the expense of passing the test there is now a requirement to a CPC course every five years. Hardly surprising many people decide it's not worth it and we have such a shortage of drivers, as I said it's a vicious circle.

    On a lighter note, Prince Philip driving a lorry.
    wp_ss_20190118_0008.png
     
    Last edited: 19 Jan 2019
  8. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    Wikipedia says it's 35 hours to be done within 5 years of the previous qualification... 1 day a year doesn't seem unreasonable to keep a "professional" driver up to date with things like changes in legislation. I did a defensive/safe driving course and was surprised how much stuff had changed since I went through the Highway Code again when my kids were learning to drive.
     
  9. unlevel42

    unlevel42 Member

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    Can I sue the driver who bashed the bridge in Romiley yesterday?
    Having waited at New Mills Central for two and a half hours at New Mills Central for a train to Sheffield in the snow, I was not best pleased.
    More so because I had left the excellent Rock Tavern were I would have been very happy waiting and instead waited in the vastly overrated Pride of... .
    I want 90p which would have been the difference in the price of the beer.
     
  10. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    Have you seen the cost? Employers normally pay for drivers in full time employment but what about agency staff? A lot of part time/casual drivers have been lost to the industry.
     
  11. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    Once again COST is the main consideration in the road haulage industry. As I inferred in #64, safety comes a poor second.
     
  12. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    ...which may be no bad thing. I wonder whether this segment are disproportionately likely to bash bridges?
     
  13. Meerkat

    Meerkat Member

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    From this and various other haulage issues (overweight, unsafe maintenance etc) it seems to me that the haulage industry needs a serious increase in regulation enforcement (yeah, even Tories believe in some regulation)
    If that prices smaller operators out the market that seems a gain to me - bigger operators have more reputational risk to consider.
    As training is alleged to be difficult/expensive and haulage is nationally critical maybe the state should be offering free training - we pay to train sociologists, media studies bods, and accountants why not have state funded driving courses (I would argue this should be the case for train drivers too.....)
     
  14. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    Rather unsurprisingly, I totally disgree and the road haulage industry should not receive even more subsidy than it already receives.

    As a measure of that subsidy, track access charges for HGVs (VED and excise duty on fuel) have barely moved in 20 years and have been frozen for the last 9, despite inflation. However track access charges for rail freight rise by inflation plus, EVERY year.
     
  15. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    I was referring to the COST to individual drivers which explains the lack of new recruits to the industry.
     
  16. philthetube

    philthetube Established Member

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    I don't think it is training, I think multi hit bridges need to be treated more like multi spadded signals with investigations into how to prevent future strikes

    I would be interested to know what the average number of strikes, per driver is my guess would be that it starts with 0.00?%
     
  17. Lucan

    Lucan Member

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    I don't see that's a problem and I don't see the high standards.
    Glad to hear it. I welcome anything that can reduce the existing tilt of the playing field in favour of road transport and against railways.
     
  18. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    Yes, haulage companies expect individual drivers to cover their own training costs rather than paying for it like the railways do.

    Cost trumps safety when it comes to road haulage companies.
     
  19. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    If companies pay training costs they expect some commitment in return, ie the driver doesn't up sticks and go and work elsewhere.

    Part time agency drivers, who pays for their training? Likewise new recruits to the industry?
     
  20. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    All problems for the industry to solve.

    Perhaps the industry should establish a training board, paid for by a levy on companies according to their size. If all have to pay it, all the way down to one man bands, then no-one can get an unfair advantage.

    What cannot be allowed to continue is that the industry washes its hands of the problem and employ sub standard drivers.
     
  21. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    We're just going round in circles here, you seem to have a vendetta against the industry.
     
  22. DanDaDriver

    DanDaDriver Member

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    I don’t think he’s being unreasonable in expecting people doing a potentially dangerous job to be appropriately trained and competent. Hauliers currently seem to be operating on a Victorian mill owner model and it’s the drivers themselves who are suffering.

    The government seems to prefer to indulge the haulage industry rather than bring it up to standard the same way it would any other industry.
     
  23. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    Fortunately for your side of the discussion, there is absolutely no chance of the government forcing the industry to improve safety.

    Successive governments of all colours are far too wedded to the cheap transport this brings to the UK than to worry about the several hundred deaths per annum the industry causes.
     
  24. Jack15001

    Jack15001 Member

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    Well, the industry should be safer than it's ever been. Whether it is or not is debatable but let's not lose sight of the fact there are a good many hauliers doing a very professional job.
     
  25. furnessvale

    furnessvale Established Member

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    Agreed. I am sometimes amazed that the "good guys" manage to survive when undermined by cowboys.

    Reputable hauliers have nothing to fear from better enforcement. If the cowboys, and unfair cheap continental competition are driven out, the unremitting downward pressure on rates would be eased, enabling all to charge a fair rate, recruit, train and pay proper drivers AND still make a profit.
     
  26. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    Whatever the reason for the shortage of drivers, it is mentioned as one of the reasons given in the "ROG to adapt 319 EMUs to parcels units" article here:
    https://www.railwaygazette.com/news/traction-rolling-stock/single-view/view/electro-diesel-multiple-units-ordered-for-postal-services.html
    (Thanks for the link in the "319s for parcels?" thread. https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/possible-non-passenger-use-of-class-769s.176973/)
    Now we just need more rail (infrastructure) capacity!
     

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