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TheGrandWazoo

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He was replying to alexbus12 who’s sole contribution to this thread seems to be post a sarcastic ‘#amazing’ every few days.

Looking at the revised services and comparing to both the current service and the previous ones before the 7/8 was introduced, the main downside to the revised services is that some people will need to change buses in Bacup onto the 464, particularly Pennine Road passengers and those from Todmorden.
Quite so.

I don't know Alex Hornby though I know some who have worked with/for him. He's not shy in (self) promotion evidently, and can understand that may not be to everyone's taste. However, it seems that some people's views of Alex Hornby, a person they've probably never met, permeate their view of Transdev rather than looking at things objectively.

As for why B&P are operating the Rochdale rather than Rosso, they will have their reasons. Why it should concern anyone else, I just don't know so long as said service arrives where it should, when it should.
 
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RustySpoons

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Back on topic...

The 13 - New Hall Hey route. I believe this is running with developer funding, rather than LCC funding (I'd hope that's still the case anyway, considering how it's pretty much never used and is only a 2 minute walk from the whatever-number-the-IrwellLine-is)
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Were we off topic.....?

Here's a quick question. The Lancashire day ticket extends to Bury and Rochdale but where is the boundary on the Witch Way and Red Express? After a bit of Yorkshire action recently, might have a day out in a lesser county where I can perform missionary work!
 

gnolife

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Were we off topic.....?

Here's a quick question. The Lancashire day ticket extends to Bury and Rochdale but where is the boundary on the Witch Way and Red Express? After a bit of Yorkshire action recently, might have a day out in a lesser county where I can perform missionary work!
You can't travel beyond the entry to the M66 in either case (Prestwich is outside the border)
 

RustySpoons

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Were we off topic.....?

Here's a quick question. The Lancashire day ticket extends to Bury and Rochdale but where is the boundary on the Witch Way and Red Express? After a bit of Yorkshire action recently, might have a day out in a lesser county where I can perform missionary work!

Best keeping it about Rosso, not Alex Horby, no?

Lancs boundary for Witch Way is Rawtenstall and I think the RedEx is Ramsbottom. Could do with an actual map showing the boundaries on the website though.
 

SCH117X

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Back on topic...

The 13 - New Hall Hey route. I believe this is running with developer funding, rather than LCC funding (I'd hope that's still the case anyway, considering how it's pretty much never used and is only a 2 minute walk from the whatever-number-the-IrwellLine-is)
Its usually the case that the developer through a legal agreement on the planning permission agrees a contribution to the bus service that is paid to the County Council to provide the service as the Local Public Transport Authority. The one positive thing that comes from these changes is that their will no longer be two different 7s on the Transdev Lancashire maps. Wonder how quickly they will correct the one on the wall of the new Rawtenstall bus station.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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You can't travel beyond the entry to the M66 in either case (Prestwich is outside the border)

Lancs boundary for Witch Way is Rawtenstall and I think the RedEx is Ramsbottom. Could do with an actual map showing the boundaries on the website though.

Thank you for your assistance, gents.
 

gnolife

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Confirmed that the Red4 & Red Express will be withdrawn from Sunday 26th January

Irwell line will be extended to Altrincham. Passengers for Manchester to either travel to Bury and change for Metrolink or change at Rawtensall Bus Station for the Witchway for Manchester

https://www.transdevbus.co.uk/rosso/were-improving-irwell-line-26-january
I can very much assure you that the Irwell line is not being extended to Altrincham! It is having a branch put in to Accrington, presumably once per hour.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Confirmed that the Red4 & Red Express will be withdrawn from Sunday 26th January

Irwell line will be extended to Altrincham. Passengers for Manchester to either travel to Bury and change for Metrolink or change at Rawtensall Bus Station for the Witchway for Manchester

https://www.transdevbus.co.uk/rosso/were-improving-irwell-line-26-january

It would be interesting if they could get it to Altrincham.

In all honesty, the Red4 was always going to struggle as the kit is simply overspecced for that route and the corridor overbussed.

However, the Red Express is certainly more of a surprise given the recent changes they made. To be honest, they've handled that particularly badly and really you have to question whether they shouldn't have done this before if it's losing such a chunk of cash. Instead, they've made detrimental changes and now are axing it contrary to what they said just a few months earlier.

I have great sympathy for all operators in the current climate but in this instance, Transdev have made a pigs ear of things.
 

RustySpoons

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It would be interesting if they could get it to Altrincham.

In all honesty, the Red4 was always going to struggle as the kit is simply overspecced for that route and the corridor overbussed.

However, the Red Express is certainly more of a surprise given the recent changes they made. To be honest, they've handled that particularly badly and really you have to question whether they shouldn't have done this before if it's losing such a chunk of cash. Instead, they've made detrimental changes and now are axing it contrary to what they said just a few months earlier.

I have great sympathy for all operators in the current climate but in this instance, Transdev have made a pigs ear of things.

It doesn't seem like passengers are liking the changes either. I can understand they're always angry when services get changed, but I don't think there are any real benefits for them here and their anger is justified.

The X43 is definitely going to struggle at rush hour. They're usually already fully loaded by the time they reach Rawtenstall, so not sure how X41-loads of Manchester bound passengers arriving in Rawtenstall will get on.

I did think as soon as the rumours started to circulate that both the Red4 and RedEx would be going. Like you say the Red4 corridor is already overbussed. I was expecting something along the lines of Rammy - Bury then fast into Manchester along the motorway every 30 mins, every hour extending to Accy, and then possibly a new link between Accy - Rammy and into Rawtenstall via Edenfield.
 

Baxenden Bank

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So, as I understand it:
Halving the direct service between Rawtenstall and Bury, operating via Ramsbottom instead - haven't we seen that before somewhere (Red Express). In doing so diverting an established route to serve a never previously served market (Ramsbottom - Manchester) but seriously extending the journey time for existing users. How well did that turn out?
Also replacing the bus which Red Express itself sought to replace (484 Accrington - Bury) with a much less direct service via Rawtenstall, again offering a tedious detour with excessive journey times. I predict it to have a short life, why operate an indirect hourly bus Accrington to Rawtenstall via Gregory Fold then on to Bury when you have four per hour direct to Rawtentstall (464) connecting into the four per hour 'Irwell Line' Rawtenstall to Bury?
 

TheGrandWazoo

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It doesn't seem like passengers are liking the changes either. I can understand they're always angry when services get changed, but I don't think there are any real benefits for them here and their anger is justified.

I'd not disagree. There's no upsides in this and they would rightly point to the statements made behind the 1st September changes. It's fair to question how long they've given this esp. as those changes happened just a couple of months ago or to question the voracity of those statements.

These are difficult days for operators but a change in Sep followed by a decision to axe in November can't be spun positively, whatever you think of the individuals involved.

At least I know some of the routes to experience when I travel to Lancashire on Saturday....
 

Baxenden Bank

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I'd not disagree. There's no upsides in this and they would rightly point to the statements made behind the 1st September changes. It's fair to question how long they've given this esp. as those changes happened just a couple of months ago or to question the voracity of those statements.

These are difficult days for operators but a change in Sep followed by a decision to axe in November can't be spun positively, whatever you think of the individuals involved.

At least I know some of the routes to experience when I travel to Lancashire on Saturday....

A decision to axe in November, given the conservative ways bus operators move, means the decision was already made in September.
 

RustySpoons

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A decision to axe in November, given the conservative ways bus operators move, means the decision was already made in September.

Which makes a comment of along the lines of 'there are no plans to withdraw the X41 as we've only just changed it' they made to reassure a worried passenger regarding the rumours of the X41 being cancelled a couple of weeks back on Twitter quite unscrupulous.
 

njlawley

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In doing so diverting an established route to serve a never previously served market (Ramsbottom - Manchester)

Only never previously served by Transdev. GM Buses / GM North / First Manchester have previously provided that link, just via a slower route via the centre of Bury (service 90, then service X35). There was a gap from September 2016 until the point Transdev diverted the X41 to serve Ramsbottom.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Which makes a comment of along the lines of 'there are no plans to withdraw the X41 as we've only just changed it' they made to reassure a worried passenger regarding the rumours of the X41 being cancelled a couple of weeks back on Twitter quite unscrupulous.

Being fair, if the tweet you refer to is
“we have not been informed this is happening in Customer services. So at this moment in time the answer to your question is no. However it is no secret that the performance of the X41 route is being monitored since the changes made in September.” then it’s possible that they’ve been kept in the dark. It’s an overly comprehensive reply if you’re being disingenuous.

However, it IS fair to question how long Transdev have given these changes and whether this was always the plan.
 

Alexbus12

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I gather them clapped out red Express buses are off to scrap? Wouldn't surprise me if they're a reason for the axing.. Breaking down all the time etc, making the service unreliable at times..
 

peterblue

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I suspect most of the ire is drawn from how Transdev spin this as being a really positive change for Ramsbottom. When it's not! If Transdev were most honest I would expect there to be less criticism.

On the Ramsbottom to Bury market... If it is really so bad on numbers, then why bother diverting buses there? It'll only serve to infuriate existing Irwell Line passengers. I would expect most local Ramsbottom travellers would use Diamond with greater flexibility (and the ability to connect for buses to Manchester).

I wonder if Diamond will introduce rush hour buses to Ramsbottom after hearing of this news. It'll probably work well.
 

RustySpoons

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Being fair, if the tweet you refer to is
“we have not been informed this is happening in Customer services. So at this moment in time the answer to your question is no. However it is no secret that the performance of the X41 route is being monitored since the changes made in September.” then it’s possible that they’ve been kept in the dark. It’s an overly comprehensive reply if you’re being disingenuous.

However, it IS fair to question how long Transdev have given these changes and whether this was always the plan.

It's not that one. It came from BlackburnBusCo's Twitter though. There's every chance it's been deleted now, but it definitely said there were no plans to withdraw the service [in January] as it had 'only been changed in September'.
 

158756

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I gather them clapped out red Express buses are off to scrap? Wouldn't surprise me if they're a reason for the axing.. Breaking down all the time etc, making the service unreliable at times..

Wouldn't surprise me either. Reliability has been poor going back to before the Ramsbottom diversion. I see Blackburn's 'Hotline' service regularly, and that often seems to have as many random buses on as the branded fleet, so what sort of nick those similar aged deckers are in...
 
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