Running a train round at Scarborough.

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9K43

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Some years ago, the depot started work on renewing the road on the up and
down from Weaverthorpe Box upto the level crossing situated adjacent to a Golf Club.
Each weekend, the were unto 4/5 trains coming and going to this site of work.
Most of these trains ran round at Seamer Signal Box, but the auto ballasters train were too long to RR at Seamer SB and had to go down to Scarborough Station to RR via Number 1 Platform.
This entailed the long train to run into Number 1 Platform, and the propel out past the now closed Signal Box.
When propelling the trainman had to ride on the leading suitable vehicle or be in a suitable position to control the movement on the ground
Whilst propelling the speed should not exceed 3mph.
The train movement was controlled by back to back radios, hand signals , or with the bardic hand lamp.
The most important job was for the driver and TM to come to a clear understanding of of the method of working of this movement.
The loss of the radio transmission, hand signal or light the train had to stop right away.
Once the whole train was in clear in the Run Round road, the loco was detached for it to run down to the sub to go back into Number 1 platform, and back onto the train waiting in the sidings.
Each time the driver had to change ends into the leading cab, or be in the most suitable cab for what had to be done.
As the engine was hooked off the TM the train was secured by pining down enough brakes to hold the train. When the train was uncoupled all the air in the brakes were exhausted to atmosphere, to ensure the tucks did not move.
Once the loco had RR the train, the TM hooked on he would lift the pinned down brakes and go to the rear of the train to complete a brake test.
To do this, the driver would blow off the brakes from the loco.
The TM would then make sure the brakes were working by checking the last three vehicles brakes had applied.
The TM would then place a red tail lamp on the leading vehicle and wait for the sub to come off.
Once the signal came off the TM would radio the driver to set back at 3mph back into number one platform keeping a contentious transmission on the radio,
Number 1 at Scarborough is a single line road with platforms either side into the buffers at the end.
Once inside Number 1, if the had driver changed ends then another Brake Test was required, once completed, the train would await the signal to return upto Seamer or await instructions From the PIC.
The ballast train would have a trailing load of 2500 tons.
When carrying out these jobs, it might be pitch black with only your lamp to see with
Normally back to back radios were in use which made the job a lot safer for all concerned.
If the TM wanted he could ride down to the station from Seamer on the loco or take the company van down to the station and then back upto Seamer as he may have more RR to do later on.
To do this movement properly you take your time and do what you have to do by the Rule book and your knowledge of the site and methods of work.

Safety must be the first priority of all employees on the Railway.
 
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Ploughman

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Joined
15 Jan 2010
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2,524
Location
Near where the 3 ridings meet
Some years ago, the depot started work on renewing the road on the up and
down from Weaverthorpe Box upto the level crossing situated adjacent to a Golf Club.
Each weekend, the were unto 4/5 trains coming and going to this site of work.
Most of these trains ran round at Seamer Signal Box, but the auto ballasters train were too long to RR at Seamer SB and had to go down to Scarborough Station to RR via Number 1 Platform.
This entailed the long train to run into Number 1 Platform, and the propel out past the now closed Signal Box.
When propelling the trainman had to ride on the leading suitable vehicle or be in a suitable position to control the movement on the ground
Whilst propelling the speed should not exceed 3mph.
The train movement was controlled by back to back radios, hand signals , or with the bardic hand lamp.
The most important job was for the driver and TM to come to a clear understanding of of the method of working of this movement.
The loss of the radio transmission, hand signal or light the train had to stop right away.
Once the whole train was in clear in the Run Round road, the loco was detached for it to run down to the sub to go back into Number 1 platform, and back onto the train waiting in the sidings.
Each time the driver had to change ends into the leading cab, or be in the most suitable cab for what had to be done.
As the engine was hooked off the TM the train was secured by pining down enough brakes to hold the train. When the train was uncoupled all the air in the brakes were exhausted to atmosphere, to ensure the tucks did not move.
Once the loco had RR the train, the TM hooked on he would lift the pinned down brakes and go to the rear of the train to complete a brake test.
To do this, the driver would blow off the brakes from the loco.
The TM would then make sure the brakes were working by checking the last three vehicles brakes had applied.
The TM would then place a red tail lamp on the leading vehicle and wait for the sub to come off.
Once the signal came off the TM would radio the driver to set back at 3mph back into number one platform keeping a contentious transmission on the radio,
Number 1 at Scarborough is a single line road with platforms either side into the buffers at the end.
Once inside Number 1, if the had driver changed ends then another Brake Test was required, once completed, the train would await the signal to return upto Seamer or await instructions From the PIC.
The ballast train would have a trailing load of 2500 tons.
When carrying out these jobs, it might be pitch black with only your lamp to see with
Normally back to back radios were in use which made the job a lot safer for all concerned.
If the TM wanted he could ride down to the station from Seamer on the loco or take the company van down to the station and then back upto Seamer as he may have more RR to do later on.
To do this movement properly you take your time and do what you have to do by the Rule book and your knowledge of the site and methods of work.

Safety must be the first priority of all employees on the Railway.
That was quite common practice on any of the renewals in the area that I have been involved with.
However since the layout has been altered I think that a RR is now available without having to propel. Subject to length though as before.

Other locations for RR were Seamer sidings. Seamer - Scarborough and Seamer - Weaverthorpe. Have also seen a RR Seamer Junction to the Double to Single towards Filey.
 

9K43

Member
Joined
1 May 2010
Messages
558
That was quite common practice on any of the renewals in the area that I have been involved with.
However since the layout has been altered I think that a RR is now available without having to propel. Subject to length though as before.

Other locations for RR were Seamer sidings. Seamer - Scarborough and Seamer - Weaverthorpe. Have also seen a RR Seamer Junction to the Double to Single towards Filey.
They used to book a ballst in front of the last Scaboro, and one behind it.
This always caused problems at Seamer with long delays.
If my memory serves me well, 47 Slu's for the RR Road at Seamer.
The sub for Seamer was up near the bridge.
I did not sign Filey to Hull.
We also did dropped stone from Malton to Seamer one week day.
Left me van accross the track from the PW Cabin.
Where the tampers were stored.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I forgot to make mention of the signalman in shunting and running round at diverse locations.
The signal man is the one who tells you what you are going to do, and when you are going to do it.
When speaking to the signalman you are aware that all conversations are recorded, and must be in safety critical speech.
I have been to enquries where accidents have happened, and the transcripts are yards long, and also tapes of telephone calls are there to make you uncomfortable in your chair.( As arepresentative of the RMT.)
 

Ploughman

Established Member
Joined
15 Jan 2010
Messages
2,524
Location
Near where the 3 ridings meet
Ballasts that I was involved in the planning for were:-
Ballast Hoppers both Seacow and newer Railtrack / NWR sets.
Jarvis Slinger trains.
Salmons for track panel loading.
Single line Gantry sets.
Spoil wagons Coalfish etc and bogie boxes.
Twin Jib Cranes, Ballast Cleaner, Tampers and Regulators.
Long Welded rail trains.

These were mostly for the various track renewal sites between Hull and Bridlington since 2000
Plus a number of sites around Bridlington, Filey and Seamer.
 

9K43

Member
Joined
1 May 2010
Messages
558
Any train which could not run round at Seamer Signal Box, then these trains would have to go down to Scarborough Station.
What you have to be aware of to me a train is a collection of vehicle complete with a tail lamp. I did not take any notice of the type they were, either Vac or air braked empty or loaded.
Vacuum trains were phased out in the mid 1990's, along with brake vans at the same time, and this was the time the secondman came off the ballast trains and the guard went up front with the driver.
This was arround 1993 when we were on the Electrification Trains out of Donny to any place between Neville Hill to Skipton/Ilkley/Shipley/Braford Foster Square each night.
 

steamybrian

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Joined
26 Nov 2010
Messages
1,174
Location
Kent
Some years ago, the depot started work on renewing the road on the up and
down from Weaverthorpe Box upto the level crossing situated adjacent to a Golf Club.
Each weekend, the were unto 4/5 trains coming and going to this site of work.
Most of these trains ran round at Seamer Signal Box, but the auto ballasters train were too long to RR at Seamer SB and had to go down to Scarborough Station to RR via Number 1 Platform.
This entailed the long train to run into Number 1 Platform, and the propel out past the now closed Signal Box.
When propelling the trainman had to ride on the leading suitable vehicle or be in a suitable position to control the movement on the ground
Whilst propelling the speed should not exceed 3mph.
The train movement was controlled by back to back radios, hand signals , or with the bardic hand lamp.
The most important job was for the driver and TM to come to a clear understanding of of the method of working of this movement.
The loss of the radio transmission, hand signal or light the train had to stop right away.
Once the whole train was in clear in the Run Round road, the loco was detached for it to run down to the sub to go back into Number 1 platform, and back onto the train waiting in the sidings.
Each time the driver had to change ends into the leading cab, or be in the most suitable cab for what had to be done.
As the engine was hooked off the TM the train was secured by pining down enough brakes to hold the train. When the train was uncoupled all the air in the brakes were exhausted to atmosphere, to ensure the tucks did not move.
Once the loco had RR the train, the TM hooked on he would lift the pinned down brakes and go to the rear of the train to complete a brake test.
To do this, the driver would blow off the brakes from the loco.
The TM would then make sure the brakes were working by checking the last three vehicles brakes had applied.
The TM would then place a red tail lamp on the leading vehicle and wait for the sub to come off.
Once the signal came off the TM would radio the driver to set back at 3mph back into number one platform keeping a contentious transmission on the radio,
Number 1 at Scarborough is a single line road with platforms either side into the buffers at the end.
Once inside Number 1, if the had driver changed ends then another Brake Test was required, once completed, the train would await the signal to return upto Seamer or await instructions From the PIC.
The ballast train would have a trailing load of 2500 tons.
When carrying out these jobs, it might be pitch black with only your lamp to see with
Normally back to back radios were in use which made the job a lot safer for all concerned.
If the TM wanted he could ride down to the station from Seamer on the loco or take the company van down to the station and then back upto Seamer as he may have more RR to do later on.
To do this movement properly you take your time and do what you have to do by the Rule book and your knowledge of the site and methods of work.

Safety must be the first priority of all employees on the Railway.
Could a more simple operating system have been investigated for reversing these trains could have been found. For example which happened many times on the old Southern Region-
In my timetable planning days of the past when we had say 4 engineering trains in the section we use to "step up" the locos in the engineering work block. Loco off train 1 detached in block run forward to end of block. Loco off train 2 attach to rear of train 1, Loco off train 3 attach to rear of train 2, Loco off train 4 attach to rear of train 3, Loco off train 1 runs round all trains on the other line and attaches to rear of train 4. All trains then run back wrong road (under block) until regaining the correct line.

Retired timetable clerk
 

9K43

Member
Joined
1 May 2010
Messages
558
Could a more simple operating system have been investigated for reversing these trains could have been found. For example which happened many times on the old Southern Region-
In my timetable planning days of the past when we had say 4 engineering trains in the section we use to "step up" the locos in the engineering work block. Loco off train 1 detached in block run forward to end of block. Loco off train 2 attach to rear of train 1, Loco off train 3 attach to rear of train 2, Loco off train 4 attach to rear of train 3, Loco off train 1 runs round all trains on the other line and attaches to rear of train 4. All trains then run back wrong road (under block) until regaining the correct line.

Retired timetable clerk[/QUOTE

I have done this method of work at Mirfield on the LNW.
We had the same as at Seamer, 4 trains and locos in a lump , and we part exchanged locos then reversed the movements upto Thornhill LNW JCt, leaving a light engine to follow the other trains upto the site of work at Fanrnley Jct at Leeds.
All the trains then arrived on site more or less together.
As the person required to RR the Trains, I work to the instructions of the ballast proforma.
As you will know these workings are planned well in advance of the actual planned work.
 
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