Scenic European loco hauled services

Discussion in 'International Transport' started by DRSavenger008, 30 Dec 2016.

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  1. DRSavenger008

    DRSavenger008 Member

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    Good evening all, currently planning a interailing trip across Europe for next summer and was wondering if anyone on here could recommend good routes to do that have garaunteed loco haulage, decent distance, lots of choice of locos and possibly even decent scenery? Will probably travel between different countries using OBB's sleeper trains. Any advice would be greatly appreciated, cheers. Also, does anyone know what diagrams the remaining hungarian class 56 operates?
     
    Last edited: 31 Dec 2016
  2. Gordon

    Gordon Member

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    Anywhere in Eastern Europe probably the best bet.

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  3. STEVIEBOY1

    STEVIEBOY1 Established Member

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    I went on a trip a couple of years ago from Perpignan to Toulouse and onto the Southwest Atlantic Coast and that was loco hauled, there were also a couple of changes of direction where the loco shunted from one end to the other of the train. The rolling stock I think was old IC or Corail I think. I also did a trip from Paris Aust to the Dordogne and that was loco hauled a couple of years ago. It was interesting as it went past the test tracks of a high speed monorail route they were looking into in the 1970s.
     
  4. Polarbear

    Polarbear Established Member

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    Switzerland & Austria also have quite a few loco hauled services. Whilst the distances may not be great (especially in Switzerland), the scenery is generally very good indeed!
     
  5. duesselmartin

    duesselmartin Member

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    The Arlberg route from Innsbruck to Switzerland ist great. Also, classic IC trains still run along the middle rhine. Munich to Zürich trains are still diesel hauled in and out of Munich
     
  6. DRSavenger008

    DRSavenger008 Member

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    Thanks for the help so far, I'm planning on starting in Budapest and finishing in Paris before getting the eurostar.
     
    Last edited: 31 Dec 2016
  7. 70014IronDuke

    70014IronDuke Established Member

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    Much of Hungary, southern Slovakia and northern Serbia (Voivodina) are fairly flat, along with much of the Zagreb - Belgrade.

    Budapest - Bratislava - Brno - Prague - Berlin trains are loco-hauled. The Brno-Prague section is wonderful rolling hills. Much of Czech is lovely travelling, little branch lines still open. Search for past posts on Czech Republic. A lot of information available.

    You might consider going Budapest - Veszprem (take a trip towards Gyor - this is the scenic line where the 56 clashed with a lorry a few weeks back - search thread in here) - and then going back to Veszprem and take the Citadella (one train, daily) to Slovenia. Loco hauled, but now electrified in Slovenia all the way, but still scenic, especially Zidani Most to Ljubljana (the Sava Valley). You could then go to Koper, on the Adriatic coast - tremendous bank down to the coast - and/or take the Soca Valley line (Isonzo in Italian) north, and change onto a Ljubljana - Munich train at Lece-Bled. These are also loco hauled. All have stunning scenery.
     
  8. Blillpers

    Blillpers Member

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    Norway would be an excellent choice. All trains on the Oslo - Bergen and Trondheim - Bodö lines are loco hauled (the latter diesel operated) as well as some on the Oslo - Trondheim and Oslo - Kristiansand - Stavanger lines. The scenery is outstanding, with the Bergen line propably the best. Oslo - Trondheim is my personal favourite. :)
     
  9. daikilo

    daikilo Established Member

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    Still a couple of loco-hauled on Toulouse-Paris Austerlitz and several on Toulouse-Bayonne in autumn 2016. Probably still a few Nantes-Bordeaux-Toulouse-Marseille but TGVs encroaching. In general look for "Intercite" in SNCF booking engine on these routes. I believe that name is sometimes used for the new AGV DMU/EMU in other parts of the country.
     
    Last edited: 31 Dec 2016
  10. 317666

    317666 Established Member

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    As far as 'lots of choice of locos' goes, I would personally recommend the Czech Republic. Scenery-wise, you can't go wrong with Switzerland - both the SBB and some of the narrow gauge lines feature many loco-hauled trains.
     
  11. eastwestdivide

    eastwestdivide Established Member

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    Italy? Plenty of IC services are loco-hauled. Try an IC service along the Ligurian coast (either side of Genova). Also many Regionale / Regionale Veloce trains are push-pull electric locos (E464 I think?).
    From Northern Germany through to Switzerland, there's EC7 Hamburg-Interlaken and EC9 Hamburg-Zurich, both via the Rhine gorge. Still booked for loco+comfortable Swiss IC coaches.
    There's a couple of long-distance private operators worth a look too, Thello running Marseille/Nice-Milan, and Locomore operating Stuttgart-Berlin with older loco-hauled stock.
     
  12. 30907

    30907 Established Member

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    Depends if you class a Railjet as a loco hauled service.
    However EC Transalpin Zurich - Graz is a pure hauled service right through the Austrian alps - planning to use it myself this summer.

    The line through central Slovakia Banska Bystrica - Kosice is worth a flag-up.
     
  13. ChiefPlanner

    ChiefPlanner Established Member

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    Verona - Innsbruck - OBB stock - superb range of scenery.
     
  14. Iskra

    Iskra Established Member

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    I'd second Italy, there's an abundance of LHCS, although much of it is electric, most lines are pretty scenic too due to the nature of Italy being either coastal or hilly.
     
  15. rf_ioliver

    rf_ioliver Member

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    All long distance services in Finland are locomotive hauled, with the exception of the Pendolinos. Locomotives tend to be the ubiquitous electric Sr2 with some Soviet build Sr1's still around. Dv12 diesel locos work the Seinäjoki-Jyväskylä services along with the single car Dm12 DMUs. Newer Siemens locos are appearing but haven't seen much of them so can't really comment, either way, nearly all LHCS here.

    If you want distance I'd recommend the Helsinki-Rovaniemi Day or Helsinki-Rovaniemi-Kemijärvi Night trains.

    If you want scenery then the line north from Kouvola via Mikkeli and Pieksämäki to Kuopio and Iisalmi is pretty good, as in the line east from Kouvola to Joensuu. The real gem is the Parikkala-Savonlinna line but that's run with Dm12 DMUs.

    If you're obsessed with watching trains go backwards, LHCS to Helsinki is shunted back 4km via Pasila to the Pasila rail yards.

    Scenery is basically trees puncutated by lakes and an occasional town. You might get lucky and see a moose or two running alongside the train.

    t.

    Ian
     
  16. Gordon

    Gordon Member

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    The trains are powered by ÖBB class 1116 locos, so they are loco hauled in the accepted British enthusiast sense (albeit sometimes pushed).

    If pushing of push pull sets by locos across Europe were to be discounted, then thousands of other 'loco-operated' services would not count as 'loco-hauled'.

    IMHO the problem stems from the fact that the term loco-hauled was arguably at its most common in the UK in the 'BR Blue' era and largely pre-dated the widespread use in Britain of push pull loco-powered trains, which by that time were already much more common in Europe.

    This begs the question - is it time for the enthusiast community to replace the phrase 'loco hauled' with 'loco-powered'.



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  17. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    Does loco-hauled really matter as a term? Whether it's on the back or front of the train, it's still hauling you somewhere. After all, lorries are road haulage for goods, does that mean when the lorry reverses it's not longer hauled goods but pushed goods? Absolute nonsense!

    Scenic lines, best one I've done to date is Liege to Luxembourg, especially up to Kautenbach. Mountains, trees and valleys in places, especially in the approximate border area between Belgium and Luxembourg. It was a journey highly recommended to me for my 2013 Benelux InterRail and I highly recommend it to anyone. CFL Class 3000 locos were hauling the approximately 2 hourly service at the time, no idea about now I'm afraid. I'd imagine they're still going though. It's not a fast journey, but totally worth it!
     
  18. DaiGog

    DaiGog Member

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    I would certainly recommend Austria and Switzerland. In particular, in Austria, the Arlberg pass route west from Innsbruck, the Tauern line from Villach to Bischofshofen and from there either to Innsbruck via Zell am See, or to Graz via Selzthal. There are a couple of north-to-south lines which are well worth doing too, namely Attnang-Puchheim to Stainach-Irdning, and Linz to Selzthal.

    In Switzerland, you are just too late for the hourly loco-hauled service on the Gotthard line (Zurich/Luzern to Bellinzona) as it finished in December, replaced by new units, but there are a couple of hauled services featuring panorama cars in the high summer season this year. An absolute must if you can fit one in. Other than that, Bern to Spiez/Interlaken and down to Zweisimmen, from where you can connect with the MOB network to Montreux. However, the place is full of loco hauled trains - as others have said, many of the private operators use hauled sets, including MOB and SudOst Bahn (SOB), who operate Luzern - Arth Goldau - St Gallen, another one well recommended.
     
    Last edited: 3 Jan 2017
  19. ChiefPlanner

    ChiefPlanner Established Member

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    Munich - Lindau - diesel hauled as well....
     
  20. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    Still 218s?
     
  21. ChiefPlanner

    ChiefPlanner Established Member

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    Was in August ...the scenery is a bit of a German Herefordshire to make you feel good - orchards and vines.
     
  22. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    Nice, very nice!
     
  23. DRSavenger008

    DRSavenger008 Member

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    Cheers for the helpful advice everyone, the Gotthard route is definitely on the to-do list, may as well do it with the loco hauled panoramic cars.

    Seen an article in the most recent issue of "Todays railways - Europe" on the Beograd to Bar line and it appears to be very highly rated so will try to include that on my trip.
     
  24. Gordon

    Gordon Member

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    And here it is in August 2016.

    [​IMG]


    ...and here is the orchard, near where you stand to get the picture above!

    [​IMG]


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    Last edited: 4 Jan 2017
  25. Gordon

    Gordon Member

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    For the record, the latter day Gotthard hauled service was Basel/Zurich - Locarno, and has not technically speaking been 'replaced by new units' as a whole. It was previously a 'Y-shaped' service: Basel - Luzern (reverse, with loco change) - Locarno and Zurich - Locarno each two hourly, the two routes meet at Arth Goldau, which gave the hourly loco hauled service between Arth Goldau and Locarno.

    The loco hauled IRs still run north of the Gotthard, terminating at Erstfeld. Although they will now be aircon push pull sets, north of the mountain route proper, on both Basel and Zurich routes you still get the scenic rides along the lakes (Zugersee and Vierwaldstädtersee) as far as Fluelen. Plus, many of the base tunnel (GBT) trains will be loco hauled.

    The service semi-fast over the mountain is now an EMU service Erstfeld - Bellinzona/Lugano. All Locarno branch trains are now local S-Bahn

    Worth noting that the Gotthard Panorama express will feature an amusing rake of stock, Panorama cars (1st class only) sealed windows, plus 1970s RIC coaches (opening windows) plus an ex-SNCF Dd2 'full brake' baggage car.




    This is the Voralpen Express. New plastic stock is on order so this is a 'do it now'. Be aware that at present some trains are top and tail Re4/4 loco (see my picture below) , but some sets are topped and tailed by electric power cars.

    Incidentally Arth Goldau is the meeting point of the Erstfeld IRs, the GBT hauled ICs and the Voralpen Express, so Arth Goldau remains a good place to see loco hauled passenger.

    ...note the 'ridiculous' gradient...

    [​IMG]



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    Last edited: 4 Jan 2017
  26. Techniquest

    Techniquest Veteran Member

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    Can you believe it, all of a sudden I want to go asap now. I think a week off just to explore Europe is going to be needed...
     
  27. pne

    pne Member

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    Three different ways in fact.

    Berlin-Dresden uses a German AC locomotive, the quick jaunt over the border to Děčín uses a two-system (AC+DC) one (Czech I believe), and in Děčín you get a Czech DC locomotive to pull you through the country.

    (Well, until Prague, at which point another locomotive comes to pull you back out of the terminus.)
     
  28. 30907

    30907 Established Member

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    I don't think there's a loco change at Decin these days (and nor does www.vagonweb.cz), as the stop is only 3 minutes.

    And to be really pedantic, Prague hl.n. Isn't a terminus, just a reversal.
     
  29. pne

    pne Member

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    Thanks; I was going by what a conductor told me when I took that route last year. I may have misunderstood or things might have changed.

    I suppose the bi-modal locomotive goes all the way from Dresden to Prague, then?

    I didn't know the English word for German "Kopfbahnhof" (literally, "head station" -- one with buffers at one end) and went with what I found at dict.leo.org.

    Is there a general word for such a station? Would one call, say, Frankfurt Hbf a "reversal station"?
     
  30. LNW-GW Joint

    LNW-GW Joint Established Member

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    You can run through Prague hl.n. without reversal now the upgrades are finished.
    From P-Běchovice on the Kolin line you can go either way into hl.n.
    When I did it the train from Vienna arrived from the south behind an ÖBB loco, and changed to a ČD loco which took the train to Dresden where DB took over.
    You can't do Vienna-Prague-Berlin any more, as Graz-Vienna-Prague is now RailJets, but there's still a Budapest-Prague-Berlin-Hamburg train.
     
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