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Scotland's Railway - Potential Enhancement Options

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mcmad

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Being hugely cynical are 1, 3 & 4 not just the long promised longer trains as a result of the rolling stock cascades from the HST (stop sniggering at the back) and 385's. It specifically says train lengthening after all.

Central Scotland Gauging is gauge clearing routes for freight, starting in the South West to Glasgow and working North and East in stages taking the easiest hits to get incremental increases e.g. get W10 first then come back to do the more difficult bits to get W12.

Very pleased to see the improvements to the Far North Line listed. It's a shame that re-building Evanton station with loop is not included, but the Lentran Loop is brilliant to see.

I think that is just Altnabreac's assessment of what each project covers not an official list of whats in
 
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Altnabreac

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Being hugely cynical are 1, 3 & 4 not just the long promised longer trains as a result of the rolling stock cascades from the HST (stop sniggering at the back) and 385's. It specifically says train lengthening after all.

Central Scotland Gauging is gauge clearing routes for freight, starting in the South West to Glasgow and working North and East in stages taking the easiest hits to get incremental increases e.g. get W10 first then come back to do the more difficult bits to get W12.



I think that is just Altnabreac's assessment of what each project covers not an official list of whats in

Indeed, it’s my guesswork, partially informed by some limited insider knowledge but ultimately still guesswork.
 

Craig2601

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In 2021 the Argyle Line will be shut for 2 months, Central Low Level and Anderston will receive refurbishment however argyle Street isnt planned to.
What is planned to be done during the two month closure?
 

mcmad

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Indeed, it’s my guesswork, partially informed by some limited insider knowledge but ultimately still guesswork.
Not disagreeing with your assessments although I think that it the upper end of the likely outcomes but some posters seemed to be taking the individual projects as given and before long it would become forum fact.
 

Altnabreac

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Not disagreeing with your assessments although I think that it the upper end of the likely outcomes but some posters seemed to be taking the individual projects as given and before long it would become forum fact.

Also worth bearing in mind that all the schemes are competing for money and timescales in the pipeline so even if they resemble my guesswork then there is no guarantee that all of the schemes will be delivered, especially in the short term.
 

clc

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ScotRail boss Alex Hynes was quoted as saying recently “We are very fortunate that as well as the operations, maintenance and renewal budget going up by 20% over the next five years, the Scottish government also has a £200 million a year budget for rail enhancements”

So that’s a billion to spend on enhancements over the next 5 years.

Transport Scotland has recently announced development work is to progress on the following:-

11 Edinburgh Waverley Western Approach Enhancements
13 East Kilbride/Barrhead Corridor Enhancement
17 Central Belt to Aberdeen Enhancements
20 Far North Line Enhancement
23 Levenmouth Railway Reopening

That’s probably about £800m - £1 billion for those projects though it’ll be a few years until they’re shovel ready so I’m not sure what the annual budget will be spent on in the meantime.
 

Southsider

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ScotRail boss Alex Hynes was quoted as saying recently “We are very fortunate that as well as the operations, maintenance and renewal budget going up by 20% over the next five years, the Scottish government also has a £200 million a year budget for rail enhancements”

So that’s a billion to spend on enhancements over the next 5 years.

Transport Scotland has recently announced development work is to progress on the following:-

11 Edinburgh Waverley Western Approach Enhancements
13 East Kilbride/Barrhead Corridor Enhancement
17 Central Belt to Aberdeen Enhancements
20 Far North Line Enhancement
23 Levenmouth Railway Reopening

That’s probably about £800m - £1 billion for those projects though it’ll be a few years until they’re shovel ready so I’m not sure what the annual budget will be spent on in the meantime.
Design, planning and other pre-build phases will consume the cash I expect.
 

Class83

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Is this currently limited by train length or stock availability?
All platforms on the Fife Circle can accommodate 6*23m, shorter platforms were extended about 15 years ago to allow this.

Stock availability is the limiting factor, double 170s would be a luxury, the Mk 2 sets are currently the best option as although they're only 6*20m (plus loco), it's unlikely that half the train will disappear to cover a non-existent HST.
 

Glenn1969

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Wiki says it is being integrated into a larger programme of ECML works and is a CP6 project so some time between now and 2024
 

CEN60

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No mention of the touted new station at East Linton...

East Linton & Reston have been award to a Contractor to Design & Construct (not the same one that recently built Dunbar!)
 

Stopper

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I don't think we'll see 8x23m becoming standard across the Scottish rail network. On the North Clyde electrics services I think 6x23m is as good as you're going to get - there are too many major stations which would need fairly major platform extensions and where SDO wouldn't be appropriate. If there's a need for more capacity beyond that on the North Clyde electrics services then the answer will probably be trains designed with a more metro-style interior.

I’d agree with this. Currently only really the E-G needs 8x23m standard (probably needs more, and certainly will need an increase in coaches or frequency soon). Ayr can justify it at peak times, and East Kilbride & North Berwick may do in the future too (depending on frequency). In the next 10 years, I can’t see anything else justifying 8x23. North Clyde & Argyle don’t really need it, but it’d be incredibly complicated even if they did.
 

Photohunter71

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Noting the forthcoming Edinburgh Suburban Loop improvements as listed earlier, I can say that with the recent Haymarket line restrictions over Christmas and New year, I noted the Bi-mode 800 series using the south suburban loop frequently. If anything, this successfully points out the bi-mode advantage when non electrified diversions are being utilised. However,I just wonder that it may raise concerns to some, as we now have Bi-modes, it would just be an excuse to delay, put off or negate any further electrification of some lines as well as citing costs? I am aware myself that projects are costed, but to some, this may be a cash saving excuse? (eg/ "Oh well, we have Bi-mode trains now, and it's a seldom used line, so no point in electrifying it,,that'll save project costs") Just a thought.
 

InOban

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The purpose of wiring the Sub is to allow electric haulage of freight from the ECML to Mossend. Its occasional use by diverted passenger trains is a bonus.
 

JohnR

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Noting the forthcoming Edinburgh Suburban Loop improvements as listed earlier, I can say that with the recent Haymarket line restrictions over Christmas and New year, I noted the Bi-mode 800 series using the south suburban loop frequently. If anything, this successfully points out the bi-mode advantage when non electrified diversions are being utilised. However,I just wonder that it may raise concerns to some, as we now have Bi-modes, it would just be an excuse to delay, put off or negate any further electrification of some lines as well as citing costs? I am aware myself that projects are costed, but to some, this may be a cash saving excuse? (eg/ "Oh well, we have Bi-mode trains now, and it's a seldom used line, so no point in electrifying it,,that'll save project costs") Just a thought.

I think the big driver for south sub electrification is for freight traffic to be electric hauled throughout and routed away from Waverley/Haymarket. There arnt that many freight bi-mode locos, so it should still be viable.
 

Tormod

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The purpose of wiring the Sub is to allow electric haulage of freight from the ECML to Mossend. Its occasional use by diverted passenger trains is a bonus.
Especially when Haymarket was closed at xmas for the track improvement works! Had I known, I might have taken one of the few trains to run, just for the craic. (170s I suppose.)
 

mcmad

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Especially when Haymarket was closed at xmas for the track improvement works! Had I known, I might have taken one of the few trains to run, just for the craic. (170s I suppose.)
Scotrail didn't run any trains round the sub at Christmas, everything terminated early. Only LNER and XC (and TPE?) ran round the sub.

Is there much (electric) freight up the ECML across to Mossend?
 

InOban

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I think that it is planned to run the containers from the East coast ports via the ECML rather than WCML.
 

59CosG95

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I think that it is planned to run the containers from the East coast ports via the ECML rather than WCML.
When you say the "east coast ports", would that include Felixstowe? Because all the containers that run towards Leeds from there currently use the *unelectrified* GN/GE Joint Line. I suspect that traction changeover would have to take place at Doncaster, and that the ECML PSU north of Doncaster (Phase 2) would have to cater for much more electrically hauled freight, especially between Newcastle & Berwick.

It would make sense to wire the South Sub for that, especially as freight paths to/from Crewe are going to be at a premium with HS2 on the horizon...
 

InOban

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That's my understanding. At one time the ECML was viewed as solely a passenger railway and was virtually shut at night. No longer.
 

alangla

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Talking of whihc I hope one of the improvements when the Argyle Line is temprarily closed is to fix the drains/sewers at Central Low Level, the smell can be dreadful at times!
Balfour Beatty’s drain cleaning track machine was working from Bridgeton yard during November & December, so I guess it should have been done then
 

Class 170101

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The purpose of wiring the Sub is to allow electric haulage of freight from the ECML to Mossend. Its occasional use by diverted passenger trains is a bonus.

I think the big driver for south sub electrification is for freight traffic to be electric hauled throughout and routed away from Waverley/Haymarket. There arnt that many freight bi-mode locos, so it should still be viable.

But is there any point running Electric Freight via ECML when certain ECML services are required to be pan down and run in diesel mode over certain sections between Edinburgh and Newcastle. I forget wheich section exactly but its in the middle somewhere due to the lack of OLE power.

Especially when Haymarket was closed at xmas for the track improvement works! Had I known, I might have taken one of the few trains to run, just for the craic. (170s I suppose.)

Scotrail didn't run any trains round the sub at Christmas, everything terminated early. Only LNER and XC (and TPE?) ran round the sub.

Is there much (electric) freight up the ECML across to Mossend?

Only LNER, Avanti West Coast and XC ran this way using diesel or Bi-mode trains. I'm still waiting for a response from Scotrail as to why they didn't route their Edinburgh to / from Inverness and Aberdeen services this way.
 

InOban

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Not only will there be an additional feeder between Newcastle and Edinburgh, there will also be one (in 2023, I think) at Curriehill on the climb out of Edinburgh
 

snookertam

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Only LNER, Avanti West Coast and XC ran this way using diesel or Bi-mode trains. I'm still waiting for a response from Scotrail as to why they didn't route their Edinburgh to / from Inverness and Aberdeen services this way.

I'll tell you why - most Aberdeen and Inverness services were terminating and starting at Haymarket, which is in Edinburgh City Centre. Far more convenient than a 20-odd minute diversion round the sub.
 

InOban

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I didn't realise that any of Haymarket was open. I thought that the Fife lines were being used for engineering access to the work on the East junction, which is of course on the Carstairs/Newbridge side.
 
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