But where do TS find the rail experts to staff a "publicly owned" company to prepare a bid when the franchise goes back to tender? Most, if not all TOC senior figures are currently employed by a TOC/FOC or have, as in the case of Mary Grant (ex First ScotRail MD) moved to take positions within the ROSCOs. The current transport Secretary has even stated within Holyrood that TS do not currently have a team in place to take over the franchise if needed. The current government may state they are prepared to take the franchise off Abellio, but in reality that's the last thing they want - having to admit they got it wrong. Something they rarely, if ever, do!
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Scotrail collects 2nd improvement notice
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But where do TS find the rail experts to staff a "publicly owned" company to prepare a bid when the franchise goes back to tender? Most, if not all TOC senior figures are currently employed by a TOC/FOC or have, as in the case of Mary Grant (ex First ScotRail MD) moved to take positions within the ROSCOs. The current transport Secretary has even stated within Holyrood that TS do not currently have a team in place to take over the franchise if needed. The current government may state they are prepared to take the franchise off Abellio, but in reality that's the last thing they want - having to admit they got it wrong. Something they rarely, if ever, do!
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GrimShady
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Exactly! It's definitely on the cards. Much like Northlink Ferries going back to Cal Mac this year.
Shame Chris Green is too old to take up the reigns!
GrimShady
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That is the case with Merchant Navy cadets. Many are tied in with the sponsoring company for a year or two after qualifying as 3rd Officer. Even when you move up the chain each COC usually has a minimum service period of two years attached otherwise the company will seek to recover it's costs.
Deltic1961
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Tweet of the week. 
Which downgraded station? Scotrail staff don't need to count passengers. Their trains do it themselves.
I was hearing from a friends wife in Oban on a theatre trip to Edinburgh on Saturday that 2 Glasgow services cancelled late circa 11 and last train rammed with drunks. Never easy to deal with. But the low point was 3 guys in the loo with door open to carriage one guy using the sink as a urinal ! What can you say.?
I wonder at what point do Scotrail use cctv for prosecution beyond a major incident? I sympathise with train crew but some behaviour needs challenge and zero tolerance.
I wonder at what point do Scotrail use cctv for prosecution beyond a major incident? I sympathise with train crew but some behaviour needs challenge and zero tolerance.
No they don’t. What about when a train terminates at a non-barriered platform? Trains do not accurately count passengers, and the post above from another poster clearly states ScotRail had set someone to count the passenger numbers.
I think the post you quoted was referring to the use of the free trips on season tickets rather than conductors physically doing headcount.
The rest of their post is about the season ticket offer and was in response to another persons post about the offer.
kilonewton
Member
Last trains are rammed with drunks regardless of cancellations, and it’s not a TOC specific issue.
On the contrary. The issue is specific to each TOC if it happens on their trains. I feel there is a token effort to tackle littering and anti social behavior. What’s the point of cc tv if it is not used to tackle behavior that affects the passenger.
My new 385 is now getting to resemble the old 170 s in terms of dirty seats after a few moths in service as predicted. Poor cleaning and insufficient bins . Hate to think what they will look like after a year or two in service.
Pakenhamtrain
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He's obviously not traveled on V/Line.
kilonewton
Member
Well at least your old mate Alex Hynes is trying to do something about that. I saw him clear away rubbish from a table into the bins on a 385 the other morning.
Fair enough, he’d generated the rubbish, but he did dispose of it properly, in pleb class too!
Perhaps employing more BTP officers may help (at a financial cost of course). Particularly on Fri/Sat afternoons into the evening. For louts found guilty by the courts post their name and photo on a “hall of shame “ on the trains to help dissuade others.
But maybe also time for SR and all TOC to ban alcohol on trains. Currently some people view it as the green light to get drunk to the inconvenience of the majority of passengers.
If I was a SR/TOC employee I would feel intimidated by the number of people consuming alcohol. Not to mention the risk of inebriated people staggering about on platforms. 2019 and we think this is acceptable!
In the same way airline and airport operators remain in denial about the risks of having drunk passengers (profit is more important than safety), TOC are also guilty.
Altnabreac
Established Member
SR already do ban Alcohol on trains after 21.00 so given we're talking about the 23.30 train there is no effect on this particular case. People are already inebriated before they board the train however so there is little Scotrail can do about that.
Yes I appreciate there is a ban from 9pm but many people ignore it with no enforcement I have ever witnessed. Plus there are clearly problems with travellers well before 11.30pm. I’ve been on trains on a Saturday afternoon where the behaviour of drinking passengers has been completely unacceptable and unpleasant, bordering on intimidation.
It’s not SR responsibility to fix society problems but allowing alcohol to be consumed on the train fans the flames for what seems like an increasing minority.
God bless him. I did the same this morning. Now if he can only grab himself a dyson Hoover and do the seats. But good example to set. So credit there
No Scotrail can’t fix a cultural problem and the booze ban is sensible. But some action on behavior on trains is a good place to make a statement. Change behavior. If you don’t want confrontation. Use cc tv as evidence and arrest them afterwards. If you target a problem with a serious intent and refuse rowdy passengers service. It sends out a message.
Fife Circle decimated again in the peak tonight. 4 consecutive trains from South Gyle between 15:42 and 17:12 were cancelled. Scotrail's plan was to bus passengers to Edinburgh Gateway upon where 2 consecutive trains between 16:11 and 16:57 were also binned. The next service at 17:01 turned up as a 3 car with the following train at 17:12 cancelled. There's also no train from Dunfermline to Edinburgh between 18:45 and 21:45. All blamed on training.
Has there ever been a commitment in the various improvement plans as to when the training will complete?
Has there ever been a commitment in the various improvement plans as to when the training will complete?
47271
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I'm not sure of the answer to your question, but I'm interested to read your report alongside this in the Scotrail HST thread
https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...dates-discussion.137911/page-239#post-3964957
which tells us of a near complete line up of HSTs running today.
The poster does ask us not to quote him, so my apologies to him for doing exactly as he tells me not to!
Maybe training is a euphemism that covers genuine training activities, lack of staff (holiday season) and lack of trains? I'm not a railway planner and I realise the job is more difficult than what we think it is. However I am assuming that the trains cancelled today are in complete diagrams so I wonder why the trains that have turned up haven't been 4 or 6 carriages, given that so little is running? Is Haymarket full of unused units today?
Holidays won't be a reason for "lack of staff" as there is dedicated holiday relief weeks built into the traincrew rosters so the work of people on holiday is covered. The lack of staff is because there is still a large amount of trainees - drivers and conductors - going through the system at the moment which will eventually fill the vacancies/compliment increases at traincrew depots. 385 and HST driver training is also still ongoing. ScotRail also didn't factor in Virgin West and East Coast, Trans Pennine and X-Country recruiting for qualified drivers and guards (TPE mostly) which has resulted in a significant number of drivers leaving ScotRail in a short space of time whilst trying to introduce the most intensive timetable they've ever had!
47271
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And no connection between the number of HSTs running and a the spate of cancellations in the east? I'm not saying there should be, I'm just interested in whether it's just a coincidence or not.
No idea on that front as I drive over in the west side far, far away from Edinburgh thankfully!
Significant = more than 30!! And with the rates thats a one way street
I think most people can recognise the systematic failures of Scotrail management in the introduction of the rolling stock, the staff required to operate them and how they were to meet their service commitments. One wonders if bad planning is endemic within their organisation given that all basic elements seem to be impacted by issues.
Going back to my original point, what I would expect to see for long suffering passengers are commitments as to when we will see noticeable improvements in the current service levels. All I see are pronouncements that Scotrail are trying their best. Clarity would be appreciated by passengers so they can see whether or not it is worthwhile permanently switching to other modes of transport.
I just hope that your colleagues on the ground in East Scotland are being looked after by management as it can’t be a pleasant experience for them at the moment.
Try closer to 150 over the last 18 months! (over 10% of the total qualified drivers). There's a current recruitment ad for qualified drivers but I doubt many will want to come to ScotRail if they are with any of the big intercity TOCs - less money for more work???, a few freight drivers may be tempted by long term job security but ScotRail are not known for being keen on freight drivers but at the moment they'll take pretty much any qualified train driver I reckon!
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