Scotrail Smartcards

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me123

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Scotrail's Smartcards have been around for a while now. Only on a limited number of routes at the moment, but it's been known that the ambition and intention was to expand the scheme network wide.

It appears to be happening this year.

Smartcard technology will be live across every ScotRail route by the end of this summer in the biggest-ever expansion of Smart electronic ticketing on Scotland’s railways, it was announced today.

http://www.transport.gov.scot/news/scotrail-alliance-launch-‘summer-smart’-campaign

It appears that the Smartcards will initially only cover Season tickets, but there are plans to introduce other tickets onto the cards once this roll out has been completed. In the meantime, Scotrail have launched a video explaining Smartcards.

[youtube]L8bf0nc5VmA[/youtube]
 
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trei2k

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As ever, the devil is in the detail:

2. Over the course of the Summer, season ticket holders on every one of the routes that is being Smart enabled will be contacted so as to try and convert them to the new Smartcard.

3. Once this rollout to season ticket holders is complete, ScotRail will begin the process of making other ticket types available on Smartcard.

4. The routes that will be Smart enabled for season ticket holders over the Summer are:
Glasgow-Aberdeen/Dyce, Edinburgh-Aberdeen, Aberdeen-Inverness, Glasgow/Edinburgh-Inverness, Inverness-Wick/Thurso, Inverness-Kyle of Lochalsh, West Highland Lines, Glasgow-Carlisle/Stranraer, Fife Circle, Haymarket-North Berwick, Glasgow suburban lines, cross-Glasgow routes via Argyle Street, Glasgow-Edinburgh via Shotts, the Paisley Canal line, Rutherglen-Coatbridge, Glasgow-East Kilbride, Glasgow-Barrhead/Kilmarnock and Glasgow-Wemyss Bay-Gourock.

5. Rail customers buying season tickets on Smartcard are eligible for benefits including:

• 1/3 off standard off-peak single and return tickets for up to three adults travelling with any Smart season ticket holder
• A £5 First Class upgrade on off-peak travel for three adults joining any Smart season ticket holders travelling on their usual route

For more information, go to scotrail.co.uk/smart

- See more at: http://www.transport.gov.scot/news/...-‘summer-smart’-campaign#sthash.ymCfUqce.dpuf

The section in bold (and demonstrated in that YouTube video) is what I want them to hurry up with. I want to be able to load advance tickets on to my card without too much of an issue.

This process of introducing smartcards has taken a ridiculously long time. Readers are installed everywhere, just no functioning smartcards themselves!
 

mbreckers

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This process of introducing smartcards has taken a ridiculously long time. Readers are installed everywhere, just no functioning smartcards themselves!

Would you rather they just let loose with an untested system and have it fail on day one?

And there are lots of functioning smartcards, I have one myself. Anyone signing up for the ScotRail smartcard up until now was advised that it was in a trial stage at the time.
 

Carntyne

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12 months since they got the franchise, and from the sounds of it, rolled out by the end of this year. Pretty good going IMO.
 

125MPH

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1/3 off standard off-peak single and return tickets for up to three adults travelling with any Smart season ticket holder

What exactly does this mean? Does the ticket holder need to be travelling with at least one other person to get the discount? Is the discount on Smart ticketing routes only? Does is apply to just travelling with Scotrail? Or all standard off-peak single and return tickets in Scotland?
 

JohnR

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Would you rather they just let loose with an untested system and have it fail on day one?

And there are lots of functioning smartcards, I have one myself. Anyone signing up for the ScotRail smartcard up until now was advised that it was in a trial stage at the time.

Well, its not an untested system - its been on a select number of routes in the central belt for a number of years now. I would also like to think that with Oyster coming up for its 13th birthday, its possible to install a system that has already been thoroughly tested - by London if not the other operators.
 

najaB

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I would also like to think that with Oyster coming up for its 13th birthday, its possible to install a system that has already been thoroughly tested - by London if not the other operators.
Oyster isn't ITSO though.
 

applepie2100

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I'm using one at the moment and it's definitely not the perfect system, in fact not even close to being.

Mine has a yearly season ticket loaded onto it which will only work the validators at the origin and destination stations. I've been told by the smart card team that at some point full break of journey functionality will be added but they've no idea when. I've been told not to bother trying to validate at any other stations with validators and to use manual gates at gated stations.

There is also a huge variation in how they're checked on the trains by the TE's. Some appear to have the right equipment and are willing to take the time to check then, some use their Thyron pads to check them with the ATOS machines, some just look at the card and one tried to charge me for a new ticket for not correctly validating despite the ongoing issues.

It will be a good system when it fully works but definitely not yet.
 

mbreckers

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I'm using one at the moment and it's definitely not the perfect system, in fact not even close to being.

Mine has a yearly season ticket loaded onto it which will only work the validators at the origin and destination stations. I've been told by the smart card team that at some point full break of journey functionality will be added but they've no idea when. I've been told not to bother trying to validate at any other stations with validators and to use manual gates at gated stations.

There is also a huge variation in how they're checked on the trains by the TE's. Some appear to have the right equipment and are willing to take the time to check then, some use their Thyron pads to check them with the ATOS machines, some just look at the card and one tried to charge me for a new ticket for not correctly validating despite the ongoing issues.

It will be a good system when it fully works but definitely not yet.

I know when I used the ScotRail smartcard it took a good five or six seconds for the TE's machine to validate it. Dont know what the problem was, but I hope that gets fixed, imagine it taking that long for everyone on the train
 

GaryMcEwan

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I've got my Annual Season on my Smartcard as well and got told that it wasn't a valid route by one the conductors. I actually had to show him the email I got confirming that it was valid and that the season was now on it.

In relation to break of journeys, I seem to be able to tap in and out with no problems at all. My end-to-end is BDG to EXG and I'm able to get through and out the gates at Central and Argyle Street without any hiccups.

Apparently the Samsung Note's that they have (I think they're Note's) need a data connection to make sure there's a valid ticket on the card. A conductor tried validating it on the ATOS and it wouldn't recognise it at all.
 
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applepie2100

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From what some of the TE's have told me they've had little or no training or information about the cards or what to do with them.

To be totally honest the impression I've had from speaking to the smart card team (several times) is that they seem to know little or nothing about them either!

The only reason I have one is to replace the paper ticket on which the magnetic strip died after exactly four trips through the ticket gates.
 

mattdickinson

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The map on the website now suggests that it has been rolled out to all of Scotrail. Is this in fact the case?

 

mbreckers

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The map on the website now suggests that it has been rolled out to all of Scotrail. Is this in fact the case?


Yes, season tickets available throughout the network, with other ticket products "coming soon"

Although from watching Twitter, it hasn't been a seamless experience for some
 

Timster83

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I have a Smartcard that I use between Croftfoot and Central. Sometimes if I'm visiting my parents who live on the Neilston branch I buy a paper return from Mount Florida and combine the tickets.

I suspect they will one day bring in a mandatory touch out rule and at that stage I will have to go back to a paper season ticket.
 

jamcc

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I'm using one at the moment and it's definitely not the perfect system, in fact not even close to being.

Mine has a yearly season ticket loaded onto it which will only work the validators at the origin and destination stations. I've been told by the smart card team that at some point full break of journey functionality will be added but they've no idea when. I've been told not to bother trying to validate at any other stations with validators and to use manual gates at gated stations.

There is also a huge variation in how they're checked on the trains by the TE's. Some appear to have the right equipment and are willing to take the time to check then, some use their Thyron pads to check them with the ATOS machines, some just look at the card and one tried to charge me for a new ticket for not correctly validating despite the ongoing issues.

It will be a good system when it fully works but definitely not yet.

Agree - Smartcards not fully working yet - and to be honest, I don't think it's been tested enough to unleash it system-wide.

I'm a regular commuter from WES to AND, and like most pay for a Glasgow(All) Season - It's the same price.
Made the mistake of moving over to SmartCard - only to find that my Glasgow(CEN/QST) isn't recognised in any of the intermediate station barriers - only the exact start/end stations. Quite a pain for ticket staff who have to let me in/out "manually" twice every day - not to mention the grumbles of other commuters held up at the barriers.

Phoned the usual help-line again, only to be told they're aware that 'breaks of journey' not supported by smartcards - with no estimate of fix date.

Meantime - for me - it's back to good-old reliable PAPER season ticket - until someone can tell me the smartcards have been tested and work as reliably and as flexibly as the existing Paper tickets.
 

talldave

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It's depressing that such poor planning and specification gives the technology a bad name. Is there some hidden agenda here to make it look like a failure and thus jeopardise a wider rollout?
 

Timster83

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I have a Croftfoot to Glasgow season ticket on my smartcard and it normally works fine (except for BOJ when it just says declined).

Yesterday I had to travel to Edinburgh and bought a return Glasgow to Edinburgh ticket online and loaded it to the same smartcard.

At CFF in the morning it kept saying "Please Try Again". So I hopped on the train anyway and of course at GLC it said 09 Seek Assistance. So I tapped it again and the barriers let me through.

Later at GLQ I tapped my smartcard on a ticket machine to see if the return ticket had been loaded and it said the ticket had already been used. No doubt that second tap at Central station did it.

It's really useful to have and when it works (between the two stations listed in the season ticket) it's great. But it is not without its issues and the challenges that seem to be present seem more than just teething problems.
 

tsr

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Does Altnabreac have validators?

I knew someone would ask that within the first page or two! I want to load a Priv ticket on my ITSO card and use it between Corrour and Altnabreac, though sadly I think technology, motivation and potential allegations of time wasting are all against me ;)
 

causton

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I knew someone would ask that within the first page or two! I want to load a Priv ticket on my ITSO card and use it between Corrour and Altnabreac, though sadly I think technology, motivation and potential allegations of time wasting are all against me ;)

Let me know when you do! As a test I used my London Midland Key card (which is only used for the sole purpose of opening the gates at New Street) and put the cheapest ticket from Ascot I could find when I was waiting there for a connection...
...I went to touch on the reader right next to the ticket machine and it said it was unsuccessful. Worst £3 spent ever :lol:
But for some reason I have a "Transient Ticket" from Dalmuir as it let me touch in on a reader there!
 

jon0844

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It's depressing that such poor planning and specification gives the technology a bad name. Is there some hidden agenda here to make it look like a failure and thus jeopardise a wider rollout?
I know. But I think it's less conspiracy and more incompetence. Having TOCs all working on their own versions of what is supposed to be a standard doesn't help.

What was needed was ATOC working with Government on it, then rolling it out to individual TOCs until all done. Each TOC could then brand their own cards, while also ensuring some sort of recognisable identification that it is usable anywhere.

I know there may be an ITSO logo, but that's not quite the same thing. Probably the traditional BR logo would have sufficed.
 

talldave

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I know. But I think it's less conspiracy and more incompetence. Having TOCs all working on their own versions of what is supposed to be a standard doesn't help.

What was needed was ATOC working with Government on it, then rolling it out to individual TOCs until all done. Each TOC could then brand their own cards, while also ensuring some sort of recognisable identification that it is usable anywhere.

I know there may be an ITSO logo, but that's not quite the same thing. Probably the traditional BR logo would have sufficed.

I think you're correct on the incompetence, but so many on here jump down your throat if you dare speak such truths.

Since the rail industry is making as much of a shambles of smart ticketing as the energy industry is making of smart metering, I do wonder if there's a mentality that lurks in post-privatised industries that feeds the incompetence?

The banks and mobile phone industry have rolled out new technologies like chip&PIN and NFC and made it work.
 

Verygoodyear

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I got mine yesterday evening and loaded up a weekly ticket at 6am today from Mount florida to central. Went to use it this morning and it was declined at both ends. They let me through when I showed them the receipt on my phone.

Turns out there's a 24 hour delay in the ticket being loaded to your card - even though when you go to buy it you're given the option of buying it today. Doesn't seem to be any info about this in their FAQs. Basically means I have to pre-plan more than I would have if I was just buying a season at the machine!
 

GaryMcEwan

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Sorry for dragging up an old thread but I can't seem to get an coherent answer from Scotrail on this.

Can the smartcards hold multiple tickets, ie a monthly season ticket and a couple of off peak returns?

Noticed as well that if you have a personalised SPT Subway smartcard, you can now but Scotrail tickets and upload them to the Subway smartcard.
 

najaB

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Sorry for dragging up an old thread but I can't seem to get an coherent answer from Scotrail on this.

Can the smartcards hold multiple tickets, ie a monthly season ticket and a couple of off peak returns?
They are certainly supposed to be able to do so.
 

PaxVobiscum

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I can't get any sensible answers about ScotRail Smartcards either. This is the second year I've had a Club 50 card which no-one seems able to get to work. I have been told that

(a) I need to get another Smartcard for peak time tickets
(b) I don't need to get another Smartcard for peak time tickets, my present card will work but tickets won't be discounted.

Booking office staff say they don't understand how they work and I need to speak to Customer Services. Customer Services say I need to speak to Booking office staff who are fully briefed on how they work.

My card isn't recognised by the readers, so I'm told told to hold it up the the reader to validate it to get it to work.

Dearie me. :roll:

Fortunately I have a Senior Railcard so I'm not missing any discounts.
 

GaryMcEwan

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I can't get any sensible answers about ScotRail Smartcards either. This is the second year I've had a Club 50 card which no-one seems able to get to work. I have been told that

(a) I need to get another Smartcard for peak time tickets
(b) I don't need to get another Smartcard for peak time tickets, my present card will work but tickets won't be discounted.

Booking office staff say they don't understand how they work and I need to speak to Customer Services. Customer Services say I need to speak to Booking office staff who are fully briefed on how they work.

My card isn't recognised by the readers, so I'm told told to hold it up the the reader to validate it to get it to work.

Dearie me. :roll:

Fortunately I have a Senior Railcard so I'm not missing any discounts.

Calling Customer Sevices on 0344 811 0141 and selecting option 4, is the smartcard team apparently. They told me that it might work but it might not as its not something they really have much information on.

Another thing I can't fathom out either, when I'm purchasing an Off Peak Return along with my Disabled Railcard, when the guard scan it on the back of the Samsung, will it show up on the device that I also have a railcard as well?
 

Atlantic loco

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I see this as being a way to add yet more complexity to ticketing. The ScotRail website states that they are only valid on their trains. So if you were travelling from say Motherwell to Glasgow you would not be able to use Cross Country or Virgin services with the Smartcard but you would if you had the same ticket type in paper format.
 

Joe Paxton

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If the industry doesn't get its act together re smartcard ticketing, then they will do irrevocable harm to passenger confidence in these new systems.

RDG - sort it out.
 
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