Scotrail to be run as a direct award to Abellio until March 2022 then Operator of Last Resort to take over

[domcoop7]

Fixed that for you

Seriously though I agree having decent management will be the key to making it work.

Although even for the major roads maintenance, they don't do it in-house but use contractors!

 

[47271]

Fixed that for you

Seriously though I agree having decent management will be the key to making it work.

He he, but they can't even get the roads right...

 

[PG]

In case anyone is at a really loose end then here's an article full of quotes from a so-called expert.
I don't see the point in second hand quotes, so below is pretty much the only part actually written by the author...

Mr Matheson said ScotRail would be run from then on by an arm’s length company owned and controlled by the Scottish Government, through an “operator of last resort”.
However, he was unable to say how long that would continue.

 

[Geeves]

Its highly unlikely that the Scottish transport department (equivalent) are going to come in guns blazing and fire the current management. If the other OLRs are anything to go by the changes are likely to be virtually zero, on Scotrail's part not even the livery or logo would be changed.

 

[swt_passenger]

Its highly unlikely that the Scottish transport department (equivalent) are going to come in guns blazing and fire the current management. If the other OLRs are anything to go by the changes are likely to be virtually zero, on Scotrail's part not even the livery or logo would be changed.

TUPE rules presumably still apply in Scotland - so every salaried employee will move over, including almost all the permanent management bar the odd few who stay with Abellio.

Makes a great headline, but as with ECML, hardly anybody changes operational roles.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

And the new OLR operator (owned by SG) will still be a commercial TOC and will need to conform to all the usual ORR rules (as LNER, Northern and the new TfW do).
This protects the other operators in Scotland (cross-border, open access, freight).

One tell-tale appointment will be the MD.
If Alex Hynes stays, as David Horne did at LNER, there will be some continuity.
But he has had a rough time dealing with SG for Abellio, and he is also MD of the NR Scotland/Scotrail alliance.
The DfT also appointed management consultants (from SNC-Lavelin) to run LNER and then also Northern.

 

[172007]

It amazes me that the RMT turn everything negative. Are they really that angry that Abelio get an extension from Sept 21 to March 22. It gives the Scottish Government breaking room to make arrangements and see which way the wind starts to blow for the commuter market.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

It amazes me that the RMT turn everything negative. Are they really that angry that Abelio get an extension from Sept 21 to March 22. It gives the Scottish Government breaking room to make arrangements and see which way the wind starts to blow for the commuter market.

As far as I can see the original franchise was timed to end on 31 March 2022 (after SG decided not to offer Abellio the optional 3-year extension).
It would be the E(R)MA agreement that was timed to run to September 2021, not the underlying franchise.
It gives SG (and DfT) time to work out the future structure and ownership of the rail industry.

 

[steamybrian]

Brilliant idea.....

....Not only nationalise the railways in Scotland but in England and Wales and name it British Railways........

 

[lordbusiness]

Brilliant idea.....

....Not only nationalise the railways in Scotland but in England and Wales and name it British Railways........

Ooh, not sure the Welsh and Scottiish Governments would like that? How about English, Welsh and Scottish Railways?

Hang on a minute.

 

[HarryL]

It makes sense to nationalise it, aren't the Scottish government keen to make their railways carbon neutral by 2035? It makes sense for them to want to do that themselves rather than trusting profit driven companies (or another countries national operator) to do it for them.

Would quite possibly see them want to get their own Network Rail that they fully control too away from national government. We all know NR aren't being funded enough and aren't doing nearly enough electrification due to it, if Scotland wants to achieve the carbon target they won't want to be held down by that.

 

[pdeaves]

Would quite possibly see them want to get their own Network Rail that they fully control too away from national government. We all know NR aren't being funded enough and aren't doing nearly enough electrification due to it, if Scotland wants to achieve the carbon target they won't want to be held down by that.

There is a workable halfway house in providing ring-fenced funds to NR to achieve specific aims. There may be a million and one political reasons why you might not want to do that, though.

 

[mcmad]

It makes sense to nationalise it, aren't the Scottish government keen to make their railways carbon neutral by 2035? It makes sense for them to want to do that themselves rather than trusting profit driven companies (or another countries national operator) to do it for them.

Would quite possibly see them want to get their own Network Rail that they fully control too away from national government. We all know NR aren't being funded enough and aren't doing nearly enough electrification due to it, if Scotland wants to achieve the carbon target they won't want to be held down by that.

you do know that Network Rail in Scotland is funded directly from the Scottish Government and not through the DFT? Not sure what more control SG need given they control the infrastructure North of the Border just now.

 

[tbtc]

This might work, this might go horribly wrong, who knows.

But, given that two of the other stories this week are about potentially spending hundreds of millions of pounds on reconnecting Ballater and Newcastleton to the network, that doesn't encourage me with thinking that a politically controlled railway would be focussed on the busiest areas (instead, it may be that a politically controlled railway would be a football for MSPs eager to be seen to attract funding to their area)

If that's the kind of railway (focussed on re-openings and rural areas) that you want then, fair enough, but I'd rather we had a ScotRail more focussed on improving capacity on services into/through Edinburgh and Glasgow which need more seats. The former is what you get when you have politicians in charge, the latter is what happens when you have a railway more focussed on passenger demands than box ticking.

 

[Steve childs]

Given these comments I wonder if the RMT is representing the views of its members or its own agenda?

Everything the RMT does has it's own interests at heart. Even the reps have their own agendas. They are not " doing it for the people" if your in their circle they may help you but don't hold your breath. I cant understand why any workers or unions would want this. After the financial crisis nurses went 8 years without a pay rise. Welcome to the public sector. Im still trying to figure out the RMT agenda. Possibly loads of old BR hangers on thinking life was better in the past.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

you do know that Network Rail in Scotland is funded directly from the Scottish Government and not through the DFT? Not sure what more control SG need given they control the infrastructure North of the Border just now.

The money originates in the UK government and is allocated to Scotland using various devolution formulae (similar, but not to the same degree, for Wales).
It isn't Scottish taxpayers funding their own railway, although they do make a contribution.
Scotland does have control of enhancements with its own HLOS/SoFA, but the size of that funding pot is determined at Westminster.

The railway is also structured and regulated by UK bodies (ORR, RSSB etc) and subject to the Railways Act(s) passed at Westminster.

 

[Halifaxlad]

Given these comments I wonder if the RMT is representing the views of its members or its own agenda?

Somebody's brave, ever thought of becoming the PM ?

 

[PG]

Somebody's brave, ever thought of becoming the PM ?

No chance though it sounds like I need to see if any protection officers are seeking relocation...

 

[ian1944]

In case anyone is at a really loose end then here's an article full of quotes from a so-called expert.
I don't see the point in second hand quotes, so below is pretty much the only part actually written by the author...

I like this typical piece of Hootsmon (un)editing:

" ... nearly doubled pubic support for ScotRail ... "

I'm sure that quite a few of us could do with some of that.

 

[lordbusiness]

TBH I think Scotrail was always going to be a poisoned challice for Abellio..

 

[waverley47]

TBH I think Scotrail was always going to be a poisoned challice for Abellio..

This seems likely. While superficially it may be considered quite similar to Abelio's domestic operations, years of top down management and ageing fleets make for a poor combination to inherit. The new fleets had problems outside of their remits, and they took a lot of flack for that's but they really should have forsee these issues in advance.

The franchise has got better as fleets have settled into squadron service, and route upgrades have been completed. However, the visual of being a company in charge while the public sector waits in the wings, and carrying the can for the farago of **** that was the first half of the franchise, have taken their toll. I can't imagine Abelio will be sad to see this liability go.

Regarding the future of the franchise, I think we're likely to see a semi permanent OLR style franchise, with day to day management left in the hands of a semi public company, while fleet decisions and route upgrades are separated out and controlled much more centrally by ministers. Time will tell if this works, but I feel it is probably the right direction to be heading in given the current arrangement.

Moderator note: discussion continues at https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/how-scotrail-could-be-run-in-future.215683/

 

[Bald Rick]

If Alex Hynes stays ... there will be some continuity.

One hopes he will, not least as he’s not an Abellio employee!

 

[Elshad]

Next step, take the track and infrastructure under Holyrood's remit and have a fully integrated system of public transport within Scotland.

And disintegrate the rail network in GB even more? Handing over track and infrastructure to the Scottish Government will just result in more duplicate agencies being set up to take over existing responsibilities, with mandatory Scottish branding and/or flags (e.g. ScotTrack or something instead of Network Rail) with the added disadvantage of less effective coordination with the rest of GB.

 

[Bald Rick]

And disintegrate the rail network in GB even more? Handing over track and infrastructure to the Scottish Government will just result in more duplicate agencies being set up to take over existing responsibilities, with mandatory Scottish branding and/or flags (e.g. ScotTrack or something instead of Network Rail) with the added disadvantage of less effective coordination with the rest of GB.

The track and infrastructure in Scotland is already under Holyrood’s remit. It is funded, and specified separately from England and Wales.

 

[6Z09]

The track and infrastructure in Scotland is already under Holyrood’s remit. It is funded, and specified separately from England and Wales.

And there has been a reasonable investment in Electrification schemes, new stations and some track improvements.

 

[Wynd]

The track and infrastructure in Scotland is already under Holyrood’s remit. It is funded, and specified separately from England and Wales.

But for clarity NR is not directly responsible to Holyrood is it? Also, the Track Access charges are paid to NR right? Genuine curiosity here, im not 100% on how this NR/Holyrood situation currently works in practice. Scottish ministers issue funding for works, but that work is carried out through NR management, but at what level within NR?

 

[Bald Rick]

But for clarity NR is not directly responsible to Holyrood is it?

NR (Scotland) - to Transport Scotland, yes.

 

[Goldfish62]

Everything the RMT does has it's own interests at heart. Even the reps have their own agendas. They are not " doing it for the people" if your in their circle they may help you but don't hold your breath. I cant understand why any workers or unions would want this. After the financial crisis nurses went 8 years without a pay rise. Welcome to the public sector. Im still trying to figure out the RMT agenda. Possibly loads of old BR hangers on thinking life was better in the past.

In a nutshell the RMT (as with all rail unions) want the whole network, passenger and freight nationalised and vertically integrated. This satisfies their agenda in two way:
1. Political - they believe in state-run everything
2. One large national organisation increases union bargaining due to the ability to bring the whole network to a halt.

RMT will never actually be happy even if full nationalisation occurs - their predecessor, NUR, certainly never was under BR. I think, though, the NUR was more rational than today's RMT.