SE 375s - a rather odd internal door arrangement

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No surprises that the 375 fleet gets busy in the peak hours, but it has revealed a rather odd quirk of the powered internal doors between carriages.

They are equipped with the usual press-buttons to activate them - nothing strange there. However they also have a movement sensor fitted at the top, presumably to ensure that they dont close on any unfortunate soul.

But the sensor also works to activate the door. So on what is primarily a commuter fleet, anyone standing near the door during busy times causes it to open and shut constantly. Even turning the page of a newspaper has this effect.

I'll admit it's hardly the end of the world but it did strike me as puzzling. Why fit buttons and sensors? Or why not just limit the sensor to activate during the closing sequence, ie to prevent accidents.

Unaware if 377s have a similar arrangement...............
 
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ChristopherJ

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It seems to be a universal problem with all Electrostar models. I was on a c2c 357 tonight and walked between two carriages, when I pressed the button the first pair of doors opened and I stepped in to the gangway corridor but the second pair of doors did not open - even after frantically waiving the the motion senor at the top, eventually I had to physically pry the doors open my own hands to get through.
 

jon0844

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365s are notorious for sensor problems and stickers show to force open the doors in an emergency. Fine except the doors only have the grooves to aid manual opening on one side, or neither to get to (or out of) first class.

Some 365s don't have door open buttons in first class so if the sensor fails, you're trapped.

Who thought it was just the plug doors that were potentially dangerous?!
 

fgwrich

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365s are notorious for sensor problems and stickers show to force open the doors in an emergency. Fine except the doors only have the grooves to aid manual opening on one side, or neither to get to (or out of) first class.

Some 365s don't have door open buttons in first class so if the sensor fails, you're trapped.

Who thought it was just the plug doors that were potentially dangerous?!

It must have been an inherited ex Networker problem then, as ive seen this happen on 168/170s too - Makes for a rather annoting journey when the door keeps opening and closing on it's own accord!

FGWs 165s also seem rather notirious for this same random problem - even when theres very little else around, you occasionally can find one set of doors opening and closing by itself, although the doors in the next coach will not open and insted prefer to stay stuck closed. :lol:
 

TomJ93

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Turbo stars/most bombardier stuff I've been on has this weird quirk. Push button opens first door sensor the second though the sensor takes its time to register and you spend some time trapped between!

Though the bombardier alternative, as demonstrated on the voyagers is to open both with the button and then close after a set delay, squashing a poor old lady!
 

jon0844

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If you have a small screwdriver, you might be able to adjust the sensor sensitivity yourself as there's a control (and LED) that must relate to the sensor detecting movement.

Usually someone just uses a key to lock a door open.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
 

JonathanH

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It must have been an inherited ex Networker problem then, as ive seen this happen on 168/170s too - Makes for a rather annoting journey when the door keeps opening and closing on it's own accord!

FGWs 165s also seem rather notirious for this same random problem - even when theres very little else around, you occasionally can find one set of doors opening and closing by itself, although the doors in the next coach will not open and insted prefer to stay stuck closed. :lol:

That issue on FGW 165/166s has always been a strange one - they seem to close part way then find some blockage and reopen repeatedly. The trick with that issue is to force the doors shut while they are closing - they don't then reopen until someone presses the button. If you try to move them while they are opening or are fully in the open position, no force will bring them shut.
 

150001

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What are the Siemens internal doors like? Do they have the same problems or not? I must say why not keep to the basics and use a old fashioned door, never failed on the 150s.:D
 

carriageline

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Quick question, why did they never set both doors to open when you push the button? It's not like anyone will decide to stand between two carriages!

Unless its something to do with air pressure or the like
 

jon0844

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Quick question, why did they never set both doors to open when you push the button? It's not like anyone will decide to stand between two carriages!

Many trains do have both internal doors open, so there's obviously a connection between the two sets of doors.

On a 365, it seems they're totally unconnected and each must be operated by a switch, with the movement sensor on the inside being the second switch.
 

317666

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The gangway doors on 379s are always going wrong, either stuck with no power so you have to slide them manually, or just opening and closing by themselves. One thing I've noticed on the Greater Anglia 3-car 170s is in the ex-first class section, the door from the saloon to the doorway has a sensor, but also has a dummy button. It doesn't even seem to be a real button, just a moulded bit of plastic on the door that doesn't do anything. I've got no idea what it's for. The 365s are quite odd in terms of gangway doors, some have buttons and some don't, although you can usually rely on the fact that the sensors are hopeless.
 

John55

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The gangway doors on 379s are always going wrong, either stuck with no power so you have to slide them manually, or just opening and closing by themselves. One thing I've noticed on the Greater Anglia 3-car 170s is in the ex-first class section, the door from the saloon to the doorway has a sensor, but also has a dummy button. It doesn't even seem to be a real button, just a moulded bit of plastic on the door that doesn't do anything. I've got no idea what it's for. The 365s are quite odd in terms of gangway doors, some have buttons and some don't, although you can usually rely on the fact that the sensors are hopeless.

The dummy button is quite common. The idea is someone will come close enough to ensure the sensor can detect them by moving to touch the button.
 

507 001

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You would think so but on the F&WHR we have sliding doors and they are an absolute pain in the proverbial. There's no force to keep them shut, even though they have a "catch" so constantly slide open and shut!


Hmm there was supposed to be a quote in here honest!
 

fgwrich

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You would think so but on the F&WHR we have sliding doors and they are an absolute pain in the proverbial. There's no force to keep them shut, even though they have a "catch" so constantly slide open and shut!


Hmm there was supposed to be a quote in here honest!

Reminds me abit of the internal doors on the voyagers & meridians - go around an cambered corner and you can see the power doors struggling with each other to keep closed! :lol:
 

NSE

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Some 365s don't have door open buttons in first class so if the sensor fails, you're trapped.

Who thought it was just the plug doors that were potentially dangerous?!

Yes!! This happened to me! Until some kind soul saw my slightly concerned face at St Neots and opened them from the outside
 

Goldfish62

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What are the Siemens internal doors like? Do they have the same problems or not? I must say why not keep to the basics and use a old fashioned door, never failed on the 150s.:D

New trains aren't allowed with manual doors. IMO that's a good thing, provided the power doors work!

I've never noticed any the described problems in Desiros or 458s - must be a Bombardier issue.
 

43167

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The mark 4's were built with a button to press to open the internal door. But dont think they were enabled for more than a few months, Ive only really known them to be sensor operated.
 

317666

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The mark 4's were built with a button to press to open the internal door. But dont think they were enabled for more than a few months, Ive only really known them to be sensor operated.

The sliding gangway doors on Mk3s and Mk4s are operated by a pressure pad under the carpet, so if you stand on that the door will open.
 
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