• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Services with the most "train reverses here"

Status
Not open for further replies.

Tomp94

Member
Joined
9 May 2019
Messages
179
Anyone know which passenger services have the most change of ends for a driver?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

lxfe_mxtterz

Member
Joined
3 Mar 2018
Messages
817
Location
Sarahdale (West of Emmerdale)
Anyone know which passenger services have the most change of ends for a driver?
I think we've done this one before.

The most I can think of is the South Western Railway service from London Waterloo to Corfe Castle - four changes of ends: at Yeovil Junction, Yeovil Pen Mill, Weymouth and Wareham.

Not sure if it's the same driver throughout, though.
 

Taunton

Established Member
Joined
1 Aug 2013
Messages
10,019
The 1960s dmu service from Scarborough to Middlesbrough also had four reversals, in a relatively short run, just outside Scarborough station, twice at Whitby, and at Battersby.

Personal record was three, Edinburgh to Taunton, at Carstairs, Birmingham New Street and Gloucester. But again, long ago.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
31,267
March thread about reversals en route, on a quick scan through that SWR service mentioned by @lxfe_mxtterz wasn’t ever beaten:
 

godfreycomplex

Established Member
Joined
23 Jun 2016
Messages
1,296
I think we've done this one before.

The most I can think of is the South Western Railway service from London Waterloo to Corfe Castle - four changes of ends: at Yeovil Junction, Yeovil Pen Mill, Weymouth and Wareham.

Not sure if it's the same driver throughout, though.
It wasn’t, no. Changed at Salisbury and Weymouth I believe.

In terms of a driver diagram it’s probably Stourbridge. With mainline TOCs I’m not sure but Windsor & Eton Central drivers are allowed to do I think 10 round trips so that’s 20 (well, 19) end changes.
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
Stourbridge Town - Stourbridge Junction ?
Have I misundestood the aim of this thread? I read it as being reversals on one service (ie reversals for an end to end journey with one headcode). Each service has a different headcode. I’m sure the crew diagrams have many diagrams but on one headcode per journey.

In my railway career the most I’ve had was Selby to Wakefield with reversals at Bradford Interchange, Huddersfield & Wakefield Kirkgate.
 

QueensCurve

Established Member
Joined
22 Dec 2014
Messages
1,904
I think we've done this one before.

The most I can think of is the South Western Railway service from London Waterloo to Corfe Castle - four changes of ends: at Yeovil Junction, Yeovil Pen Mill, Weymouth and Wareham.

Not sure if it's the same driver throughout, though.
Not a British example, but the service I took 3 between 1966 and 1981 from Calais as far as Innsbruck reversed several times. Ones or twice in Northern France during the night (I don't recall which or where), plus Zürich, Sargans and Buchs.

There is now a new route at Sargans which obviates reversal there.
 

miklcct

On Moderation
Joined
2 May 2021
Messages
4,327
Location
Cricklewood
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
But how do you serve stations like Bradford Interchange or Castleford or any other number of stations where a reversal is necessary to provide a service to that station?
 

miklcct

On Moderation
Joined
2 May 2021
Messages
4,327
Location
Cricklewood
But how do you serve stations like Bradford Interchange or Castleford or any other number of stations where a reversal is necessary to provide a service to that station?
Bradford Interchange is clearly not suitable for multi-line operation as there is a section with 2 tracks only, which limits the capacity.
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
Bradford Interchange is clearly not suitable for multi-line operation as there is a section with 2 tracks only, which limits the capacity.
Services at BDI can arrive simultaneously and since the last remodelling depart simultaneously.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
31,267
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
Not every junction faces the right way. DMU and EMU operation makes it easy to reverse direction en route in just a slightly longer than normal station stop. I suspect this allows for through services that would never have been attempted in the days of hauled stock.
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
2,598
Location
Somerset
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
Because you have major city stations which are dead- end termini, but people want through trains. When these were built, steam locomotives had limited range and putting the replacement engine on the other end and going back out the way you had come was often at worst no slower than replacing a loco at the same end ( still applies where a change from electric to diesel is required). Many of the “record holders” in terms of numbers of reversals are “ once a day type services” (like the Scotland - Southwest train that would reverse at Edinburgh, Carstairs, Birmingham and Gloucester) or overnight trains, where the rationale for providing through services despite multiple reversals should be obvious. The Germans are slowly trying to eliminate their dead- end stations, but it’s a very long and expensive job.
 

Mcr Warrior

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Jan 2009
Messages
11,648
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
Be tricky for a XC service from Birmingham New Street (to say somewhere on the South Coast such as Bournemouth) to call at a principal intermediate station like Reading without any reversal being necessary. :rolleyes:
 

Watershed

Veteran Member
Associate Staff
Senior Fares Advisor
Joined
26 Sep 2020
Messages
11,945
Location
UK
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
The default reversing allowance for most units is 3 minutes (it's obviously more for longer trains). That's not much more than the 1-2 minute minimum dwell you might expect for a reasonably large station.

Obviously it's always better to avoid reversals where possible but there's no choice if you want stations like Bradford Interchange to have through services.
 

Kite159

Veteran Member
Joined
27 Jan 2014
Messages
19,157
Location
West of Andover
Be tricky for a XC service from Birmingham New Street (to say somewhere on the South Coast such as Bournemouth) to call at a principal intermediate station like Reading without any reversal being necessary. :rolleyes:

Ah but in other countries those stations won't exist with XC serving Reading West etc ;)
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
2,598
Location
Somerset
Be tricky for a XC service from Birmingham New Street (to say somewhere on the South Coast such as Bournemouth) to call at a principal intermediate station like Reading without any reversal being necessary. :rolleyes:
Oh, I don't know! Banbury - Bicester - High Wycombe - Greenford - Hayes & Harlington - Slough - Reading! Would take ages, deprive Oxford of connections to a lot of the country, but it would save blocking one of Reading's platforms for 5 or 6 minutes, and thus be so much more efficient (on paper). (Irony button "off")

In most cases, stations where many services reverse have track layouts specifically designed to optimise reversal and the reversal takes very little longer than a rather leisurely stop. In fact, I'm often left thinking that punctuality would benefit if reversal stops were actually given longer!

Ah but in other countries those stations won't exist with XC serving Reading West etc ;)
As indeed used to be done with Saturday extras that were basically there to soak up the demand to stations other than the one where reversal took place. Still a (rare) feature at Reading and Bristol into the 1990s.
 

507020

Established Member
Joined
23 May 2021
Messages
1,835
Location
Southport
The Lancaster - Morecambe - Heysham Port has to reverse at Morecambe, but in the previous timetable until 16 May there was a return Heysham Port - Morecambe - Carnforth - Lancaster service with 3 reversals. With the 2 services operating back to back, this necessitated 5 reversals in the space of an hour!
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
2,598
Location
Somerset
What's the point of having services which reverse mid-way? Aren't such services inefficient because a reversing train blocks the line for a long time?
The answer will often lie in that word “service”. Any service provision will involve balancing “efficiency” with providing a service that actually satisfies customer demand. The two will often conflict.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top