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Sexism on the railway? Scholars and angels

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AnkleBoots

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I observed a guard on LNR/WMR doing a ticket check by going round congratulating people who showed him a correct ticket by calling them Gentleman or Scholar (for a man) or Angel (for a woman).

This had the rather nice effect of entertaining people and slightly embarrassing those who didn't have a ticket ready to show (because they hadn't downloaded it or hadn't bought one), as it kind of broke his rhythm.

However, I noticed that only the men were called Scholars. Also some would say that Angel is not at the same level of respect as the other two terms.

Can anyone suggest equivalent terms for Gentleman and Scholar that the guard might wish to use for Women and Non Binary people, as we move into the 2020s?
 
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Cowley

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He should just say “That’s it my beauty” in a west country accent.
That covers everything including livestock.
 

JohnB57

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Are we really descending into an analysis of every linguistic nuance that front line staff (or anyone else for that matter) use in their attempts to be pleasant? This gentleman seems like a nice person who just wants to make other folks' days a bit better and the words he used are just turns of phrase, nothing more.

No, it's not sexist. Just friendly.
 

Bald Rick

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He could have gone for the Suffolk / Norfolk Borders approach, and gone with a gender neutral
“Thank ewe moy Loverrrrr”
 

Cowley

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So does my nan
Reminds me of when I met a dear old blind friend of mine (sadly passed away now) called Doris for the first time, when I was described as ‘having a beard’ she said “Ooh. So have I!” :lol:
 

AlterEgo

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I observed a guard on LNR/WMR doing a ticket check by going round congratulating people who showed him a correct ticket by calling them Gentleman or Scholar (for a man) or Angel (for a woman).

This had the rather nice effect of entertaining people and slightly embarrassing those who didn't have a ticket ready to show (because they hadn't downloaded it or hadn't bought one), as it kind of broke his rhythm.

However, I noticed that only the men were called Scholars. Also some would say that Angel is not at the same level of respect as the other two terms.

Can anyone suggest equivalent terms for Gentleman and Scholar that the guard might wish to use for Women and Non Binary people, as we move into the 2020s?

It would be better for him just not to bother, I think.
 

Senex

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Are we really descending into an analysis of every linguistic nuance that front line staff (or anyone else for that matter) use in their attempts to be pleasant? This gentleman seems like a nice person who just wants to make other folks' days a bit better and the words he used are just turns of phrase, nothing more.

No, it's not sexist. Just friendly.
Absolutely he will have been being friendly, in a small way brightening up the day for many people. Not sexist at all. And yet the way things are going he'd better look out — unfortunately such nice and well-meaning people are more than likely to become a target for the politically-correct thought-police of the twenty-first century drawing their linguistic inspiration from the absurdities from across the Atlantic.
 

433N

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And yet the way things are going he'd better look out — unfortunately such nice and well-meaning people are more than likely to become a target for the politically-correct thought-police of the twenty-first century drawing their linguistic inspiration from the absurdities from across the Atlantic.

Nonsense there from the "politically-correct thought-police" police. Honestly, the "politically-correct thought-police" must be more overworked than the actual police in their quest to stamp down on everything that everyone (but usually white males of a right-wing bias) enjoys.

Newsflash : There are ways of being humorous without having to invoke gender ; as many have pointed out. I'd add "Thank ye kindly" or something of that ilk. Don't want to stifle good-natured humour but it doesn't take much effort, does it ? ... and you will increase your audience.
 

richa2002

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Nonsense there from the "politically-correct thought-police" police. Honestly, the "politically-correct thought-police" must be more overworked than the actual police in their quest to stamp down on everything that everyone (but usually white males of a right-wing bias) enjoys.

Newsflash : There are ways of being humorous without having to invoke gender ; as many have pointed out. I'd add "Thank ye kindly" or something of that ilk. Don't want to stifle good-natured humour but it doesn't take much effort, does it ? ... and you will increase your audience.
Oo, there we go. Not long for the racism/sexism to come out. The golden rule of 2019 discourse is that "white males" are fair game but don't you dare make equivalent generalisations about anyone else. Of course this all comes apart if said white male is gay or disabled or any other supposed protected characteristic which makes you immune from criticism. How about we just ignore all of these things people can't help and primarily judge people on character? Otherwise, a life/society of misery awaits.
 
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433N

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Oo, there we go. Not long for the racism/sexism to come out. The golden rule of 2019 discourse is that "white males" are fair game but don't you dare make equivalent generalisations about anyone else. Of course this all comes apart if said white male is gay or disabled or any other supposed protected characteristic which makes you immune from criticism. How about we just ignore all of these things people can't help and primarily judge people on character? Otherwise, a life/society of misery awaits.

I am a white male. I don't feel oppressed or discriminated against for being a white male in our society. I am not a victim ... but you, apparently, think you are. Interesting.
 

alxndr

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He could have gone for the Suffolk / Norfolk Borders approach, and gone with a gender neutral
“Thank ewe moy Loverrrrr”

I find that more offensive than the original post!

Being from those parts I'd say that's more West Country than East Anglian!

I'd expect a true Suffolk guard to say something more like:

"Hev yew gort a tickut ba?"
...
"Roight, Oi'll hev t'sell yew wun t' Harlsw'th, uts six pund."
 

Calthrop

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Hmm - I always thought Angels were kind of vaguely non-gender-specific. I am sure they don't have s*x.

That's my impression -- per which: when Christian-type angels have names bestowed on them, those names tend to be male; but that's just a convention -- they are essentially reckoned beings "above and beyond" such things as gender.
 

DerekC

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That's my impression -- per which: when Christian-type angels have names bestowed on them, those names tend to be male; but that's just a convention -- they are essentially reckoned beings "above and beyond" such things as gender.

So really an angel is way above a gentleman or a scholar, so in the OP scenario it's the men who should be miffed. Call everyone "Angel"? Doesn't sound quite right.

PS - I have been called "luv" in Yorkshire and "pet" in Co Durham more times that I can count, but mostly by women of a certain age. It doesn't sound quite right from a male, but I guess I am displaying some sort of gender bias. The main thing is to treat it as a source of innocent amusement, as the OP seems to be doing!
 

scotrail158713

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PS - I have been called "luv" in Yorkshire and "pet" in Co Durham more times that I can count, but mostly by women of a certain age.
I’ve had that when I was about 16/17 - although it was what I would think of as the Scottish equivalent of “honey”.
 

Calthrop

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So really an angel is way above a gentleman or a scholar, so in the OP scenario it's the men who should be miffed. Call everyone "Angel"? Doesn't sound quite right.

PS - I have been called "luv" in Yorkshire and "pet" in Co Durham more times that I can count, but mostly by women of a certain age. It doesn't sound quite right from a male, but I guess I am displaying some sort of gender bias. The main thing is to treat it as a source of innocent amusement, as the OP seems to be doing!

My bolding: "O Member of the Elect" would at least be unisex...
 

GusB

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The first time I heard the expression "gentleman and a scholar" was from one of the older "gentlemen" (long since departed - RIP, Bob) who was a member of my local model railway group - usually after I had to lug the huge plastic water container down to the outside tap to fetch water for the teas and coffees. I've also been accused of being an angel after performing a task for someone who required a favour. Neither expression has caused offence.

Although I realise that in our more gender-fluid times people should be mindful of the language they use, I don't think we should be overly critical of people who use what is really an archaic form of saying "thank you".
 
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