Should Network Rail run their own trains?

[daccer]

The recent divvying up of Network Rail's NDS contract got me thinking. This contract is worth somewhere in the region of £120m per year and is profitable enough for some of the TOC's to go and purchase new locomotives for it, suggesting financially there is some meat on the bone so to speak. As much of the work is regular scheduled services between quarries and NR's depots and also inter-yard transfers there is a known amount of traction required so requirements and manning are known somewhere in advance. On top of that modern traction seems to not required a plethora of MPD's t keep it going so can be outposted fairly easily.

So my question is this. Back in the day the engineers department had its own allocated locomotives as well as the rolling stock. Could NR not do this and make considerable savings? There is no cultural inhibition to them owning locomotives as they have small fleets in play already. Why not expand this and at least cover the scheduled services and much of the weekend engineering work so leaving the FOC's to provide cover when demand exceeds capacity.

 

[NSEFAN]

Since NR is a government body now, doing such a thing would give ammunition to advocates of nationalisation. I suspect as such that NR running revenue-earning trains will not be considered.

 

[Elecman]

Networkrail is banned by statute from running revenue trains

 

[edwin_m]

Networkrail is banned by statute from running revenue trains

True, but I think they could argue, if they wanted to, that trains running in conjunction with engineering work or even bringing materials to local bases are not revenue, just as NR's various track recording trains aren't.

I suppose it depends whether they consider it would be cheaper to bring them in house, as they have with many other things, or procure in a competitive market. NR probably get weekend loco hire at quite good rates, as with freight mostly running during the week the locos would probably be doing nothing otherwise.

There is also the political issue of supporting a competitive freight market. Long-term infrastructure contracts helped at least two FOCs to invest in locos and get into competition with EWS for trainload work, thereby ensuring competitive bidding for later infrastructure contracts. Having better utilisation of their locos helps these companies stay afloat in a cut-throat market.

 

[dstrat]

The government already run East Coast themselves through their firm 'Directly Operated Railways'. A very successful operation as all can agree.

It is the mindless, dead philosophy of the market always being the 'most efficient' method to deliver goods and services that is perpetuating the situation such as what we have now where we the taxpayer pays private operators to run services whilst also paying for their profits that are then to be redistributed amongst the few.

Those in power fully understand that a nationalised railway is better but it is not 'the done thing' and is the first step in changing the whole fabric of how many people think economically which obviously isn't wanted.

If you have a national asset, you privatise it so those with money can invest and reap their return (a return that outstrips what the worker and customer reap!). And obviously in the case of the railway, even if it makes a loss, you privatise it and then pay the train operators enough so they can walk away with profit! You couldn't make it up. Money talks

 

[CockneySparrow]

The recent divvying up of Network Rail's NDS contract got me thinking. This contract is worth somewhere in the region of £120m per year and is profitable enough for some of the TOC's to go and purchase new locomotives for it, suggesting financially there is some meat on the bone so to speak .

I might have missed something but who has purchased new locomotives, are you sure the new locos aren't leased

 

[matt]

I might have missed something but who has purchased new locomotives, are you sure the new locos aren't leased

Colas have bought the class 70s.

 

[edwin_m]

I might have missed something but who has purchased new locomotives, are you sure the new locos aren't leased

Unless they are leased from the manufacturer the leasing company must have purchased them. But the operator will have had to sign up to a fairly long term lease, probably involving a large payment per year whether the locos are used or not. So the operator would need to be reasonably confident of being able to use them over that period.

 

[daccer]

I can't see how NR are banned from running their own infrastructure trains. If so how can they own locomotives and they do have a small fleet. My question really centres around the fact that if they can justify this small fleet then surely they have enough work to own a much larger fleet and make considerable cost savings whilst also not being reliant on the FOC's, one or two of whom don't seem to view NDS work as a high priority.

 

[Elecman]

Networkrail is not allowed to run trains by law. It can own locomotives and stock (as indeed it already does), but must contract to a 3rd party to operate them

 

[dstrat]

The law is a triviality that could easily be amended in Parliament.

 

[NSEFAN]

With all the associated time and legal expenses.

Government may also like the way the law is, and may wish for NR to not run it's own trains for political reasons.

 

[The Planner]

You would have to divorce certain elements away from NR if that was to happen. I'm not sure how it would work with NR paying track access costs to itself and there would need to be even stricter governance on issues such as timetabling due to impartiality, things like test trains currently still tend to fit around everything else.

 

[dannypye9999]

Will be fun the day when im boarding a yellow coloured network rail pendolino service to Euston

 

[DarloRich]

Will be fun the day when im boarding a yellow coloured network rail pendolino service to Euston

well i had 57305 haul my sleeper between Paddington and Penzance so it might not be far off

 

[White shadow]

I thought network rail did run it's own trains. All those hideous yellow things I keep seeing around the place (the class 31 in particular looks rather ugly!) are they not actually run by network rail then??... Confused!!... Sorry, still a novice to this rail enthusiast thing