SNCF Loco hauled

[Please Explain]

After getting stuck right into the GTR dispute thread and having a good old rant about the latest woes, it got me thinking about the situation with our brothers and sisters across the channel on le SNCF..

With all these carts being delivered -(which if they are anything like ours) will surely be DOO compatible with cameras on the cars, so what will be come of le chef de train?
Do SNCF -(and indeed other the other European administrations) have plans afoot to get rid of guards as is going on here, or do the French actually value their railwaymen and women and apply common sense?

There are also plenty of shunters about, at Gares all over France for splitting and attaching locos and coaches. I can't help but wonder what their fait will be each time a new line goes over to carts..
Certainly, those employed at Paris Est can't have an awful lot of work to do now with the end of loco hauled operations on ligne 4...

:cry:

 

[Jamesrob637]

No, not unusual. Quite popular with enthusiasts as it is not a huge class (65 built) and they are considered an attractive design. They won't be around for ever as they are now the oldest express electric locos in France, but they seem to be well liked, and are always well kept it seems.

The BB15000 were introduced in 1971 - 1978, as the ac only version of the SNCF B-B 'broken nose' family. For many years they worked only East of Paris, but the TGV Est freed them up to be used on the ac routes on the northern and western regions.

.

Good memories of seeing the 15000s at Épernay a good few years back before TGV Est, in between sips of very fine authentic champagne!

 

[Gordon]

Good memories of seeing the 15000s at Épernay a good few years back before TGV Est, in between sips of very fine authentic champagne!

Still possible.

I called in briefly at a favoured lunch spot south of Chalons on my drive back from Switzerland in August and saw two 15000 hauled corails in quick succession. Both locos and both coach sets were in very good external nick.


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[Groningen]

Class 15000 is in the Netherlands the 1600/1700. Also available in Portugal. But if they still run there i do not know. Some are painted as a freightlocomotive.

 

[SHD]

Class 15000 is in the Netherlands the 1600/1700. Also available in Portugal. But if they still run there i do not know. Some are painted as a freightlocomotive.

They have the same distinctive 'broken nose' body, bogies, and traction motors, but BB 15000 are AC-Only machines and obviously would not go very far under a Dutch 1.5 kV DC overhead wire.

BB15000 (1971) were the first French locomotives with thyristor-controlled traction motors (themselves of the standard type of these times, DC motors), only a few years after SJ introduced their Rc class.

A dual-voltage version (B22200) and a DC-only version (BB7200) were developed in 1976.
An NS Class 1600 loco is in essence a SNCF BB7200 with different headlights and a yellow paint.

 

[TRAX]

After getting stuck right into the GTR dispute thread and having a good old rant about the latest woes, it got me thinking about the situation with our brothers and sisters across the channel on le SNCF..



With all these carts being delivered -(which if they are anything like ours) will surely be DOO compatible with cameras on the cars, so what will be come of le chef de train?

Do SNCF -(and indeed other the other European administrations) have plans afoot to get rid of guards as is going on here, or do the French actually value their railwaymen and women and apply common sense?

It’s basically the same here. SNCF guards (dubbed ASCTs) are threatened by new DOO trains, which are still quite common, as the only region with ONLY DOO trains is Île-de-France.
So they are facing the same fate as in the UK, although it hasn’t stirred as much public debate nor strikes.

There are also plenty of shunters about, at Gares all over France for splitting and attaching locos and coaches. I can't help but wonder what their fait will be each time a new line goes over to carts..

Certainly, those employed at Paris Est can't have an awful lot of work to do now with the end of loco hauled operations on ligne 4...



:cry:

There is still shunting work at the depots.

 

[Please Explain]

@TRAX, interesting comparisons there. More less same s--t as here then?

I'm just back from a flying visit to Paris last week for the PSG vs Celtic match and came back to London on Thursday through Dieppe and Newhaven for a change from Dover-Calais all the time.
Showed up at Saint Lazare for IC 3115, the 14h49 Le Havre expecting a BB 15000 et Corails and was bitterly disappointed to get a trio of dosto TER units..!
Is this line no longer guaranteed loco haulage then?

Also, anyone happen to know if any of the BB 67400's are still running on the Bordeaux-La Rochelle-Nantes circuit, or is it all carts now??

 

[Polarbear]

Also, anyone happen to know if any of the BB 67400's are still running on the Bordeaux-La Rochelle-Nantes circuit, or is it all carts now??

As far as I'm aware, it's largely carts on that run now - with I think one hauled diagram?

Does anyone know if the Toulouse -Bayonne IC services are still loco hauled & whether any replacement is on the cards?

This website http://frenchrailwayssociety.org/ is good for French rail related gen, and has some rather good photography as well! Have a look at the October newsletter regarding the Bordeaux - Nantes service.

 

[SWT_USER]

As far as I'm aware, it's largely carts on that run now - with I think one hauled diagram?

Does anyone know if the Toulouse -Bayonne IC services are still loco hauled & whether any replacement is on the cards?

This website http://frenchrailwayssociety.org/ is good for French rail related gen, and has some rather good photography as well! Have a look at the October newsletter regarding the Bordeaux - Nantes service.

They were in August! Not sure if anything has changed since then.

 

[Please Explain]

Yeah, I just read the December news out today.. Looks like I have missed the boat on that one sadly...
Things seem to be moving very fast now with the unit deliveries all over the country.

I forgot to add in my post above that I seen a what looked like a line of stored BR class 58's on the outskirts of Rouen from IC 3115 last week. I've not seen one of those locos in years! I know that they were used along with 56's a few years ago during the construction of the LGV's, but I would have thought they would all have been returned to England by now or scraped.

 

[Gordon]

See 'Alizay 58s' on this web site:

http://www.trainbits.com/railway-graveyards-of-the-world/

and the Class 58 loco list here:

http://www.rail3d.info/other/locolist/locolist.aspx?show=UK\UK\58

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[Please Explain]

Thanks for that Gordon, very interesting links.
I had no idea so many 58's were still out there, albeit probably awaiting an appointment with the cutters torch now sadly..

I know some ran in the Netherlands too at one time, dunno of still?
I last seen one hauling a freight over there in October, 2007.

 

[Gordon]

The 17:05 and 18:05 Paris Est to La Ferté Milon will likely be attracting my attention over the next 18 months, as surely their time must also now be counting down with the agreement to electrify Gretz-Armainvilliers to Troyes and the Provins branch offering cascade opportunities should new rolling stock be obtained for the former.

Ironically, now stated that AGCs released by Strasbourg due to be deployed soon. One of the two 67400 turns will cease 28 Jan 2018



.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

It's the 17.05 that ceases in January; the 18.05 will be converted "by the summer".

 

[barrowjack]

I have a trip booked to the Lille area in March 2018, just wondered if anyone knows if there are still any locohauled services in this area, and if so where is the best place to find them? many thanks in advance

 

[theblackwatch]

I have a trip booked to the Lille area in March 2018, just wondered if anyone knows if there are still any locohauled services in this area, and if so where is the best place to find them? many thanks in advance

Yes there are - there are some 22000 diagrams out of Lille to places like Calais and Dunkirk. If you sign up to ERG (European Rail Gen) at https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/europeanrail/info then you can download the complete diagrams from the 'files' section.

 

[barrowjack]

Yes there are - there are some 22000 diagrams out of Lille to places like Calais and Dunkirk. If you sign up to ERG (European Rail Gen) at https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/europeanrail/info then you can download the complete diagrams from the 'files' section.

Many Thanks for your help, hopefully will be able to pick some up!

 

[Gordon]

Many Thanks for your help, hopefully will be able to pick some up!

It's quite easy to pick these up.
Essentially on Monday - Friday and Sunday, they work a proportion of the services on each of three main axes, the classic 'Nord-Est' route Dunkerque - Hazebrouck - Lille - Valenciennes - Aulnoye - Hirson / Jeumont (via Maubeuge), plus Lille - Lens, Lille - Douai - Valenciennes / Cambrai.

In the usual French pattern the best time to see them is early morning, lunchtime and late afternoon (for obvious reasons - the loco hauled sets give high capacity for rush hours) at these periods at Lille Flandres there will generally be one waiting to go somewhere.

Not surprisingly on Monday - Friday evening peak there is a swathe of 8 workings departing from Lille Flandres between 16.30 and 18.00

On Saturdays, for an unknown reason they suddenly have a fair amount of work on the Arras - Hazebrouck line which they don't touch on other days of the week!

Here's my shot of a Cambrai train at Leforest in April 2017

and a Valenciennes - Douai - Lille train at Montigny en Ostrevent arlier the same day

 

[barrowjack]

It's quite easy to pick these up.
Essentially on Monday - Friday and Sunday, they work a proportion of the services on each of three main axes, the classic 'Nord-Est' route Dunkerque - Hazebrouck - Lille - Valenciennes - Aulnoye - Hirson / Jeumont (via Maubeuge), plus Lille - Lens, Lille - Douai - Valenciennes / Cambrai.

In the usual French pattern the best time to see them is early morning, lunchtime and late afternoon (for obvious reasons - the loco hauled sets give high capacity for rush hours) at these periods at Lille Flandres there will generally be one waiting to go somewhere.

Not surprisingly on Monday - Friday evening peak there is a swathe of 8 workings departing from Lille Flandres between 16.30 and 18.00

On Saturdays, for an unknown reason they suddenly have a fair amount of work on the Arras - Hazebrouck line which they don't touch on other days of the week!

That's great, thank you for the information, and the photographs too! Have started to formulate a plan.... I think! Though sure this will change many times between now and March!