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Snow Service Changes 25/02/18 onwards.

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LAX54

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1v62 1100 Glasgow - Penzance seems to be stuck near Widdrington. Anyone got any ideas? That train is now well over 3 hours late

says there are a few incidents marked up 'SEV SNOW' (Code X9)
 
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rg177

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1E17 1330 Edinburgh-London seems to be having some trouble- been at a stand at Berwick since 15:42.
 

rg177

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Not sure- but 1Z99 rescue train is present at Berwick. Apparently having a struggle due to icy couplers.
 

furnessvale

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They do. NR sent out many teams yesterday before the snow started falling to inspect point heaters. They also have teams of snowmen who go out and try and sort any issues that come up.

However even point heaters can get overwhelmed with enough snow and given the very low temperatures, this can affect the lubrication and contribute to points failures....can also affect the wires to mechanically operated points.
I know what arrangements are made, I was involved with them for a number of years. I also know that a culture of "give up" when it snows, or many other types of disruption occurs, developed on the railways when it was seen as a rump industry only fit for closure. Those days are, hopefully, behind us, but it seems that the industry has still a way to go to regain that reliability that was once the norm.

I expect 3" of snow to give roads a problem. I do not expect that of a railway.

If point heaters are overwhelmed then they are not fit for purpose. What equipment do they use in other countries? I am not talking about purchasing fleets of rotary snow ploughs, which even in the Sierra Nevada in the US do not see service every year.

If we have a once in 10 year event so be it, but the UK seems to get once in 10 year events nearly every year.
 
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jamesontheroad

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A Network Rail spokesman has been quoted by BBC Radio Norfolk saying that early tomorrow morning they will run a 'test train' from Norwich to Lowestoft, Yarmouth, Norwich and Sheringham.

Given that Norwich has set with a class 37 on either end of it, I'm a bit disappointed they didn't try this today. We must be one of the only corners of the country with access to such a loco-hauled unit, which would be ideal for going out to check and clear rural lines.

Local media (Radio Norfolk and the Eastern Daily Press) have alluded to the fact that the suspension of rural rail services inevitably pushed more people onto the roads which were not adequately cleared by Norfolk County Council. An NCC spokesman was collared on air this morning admitting that they didn't attach snow ploughs to their gritting trucks soon enough on Tuesday night. :rolleyes:

FWIW, Sanders Coaches have been doing a pretty decent job running buses along the A140 corridor parallel to the Sheringham line.
 

scotraildriver

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I know what arrangements are made, I was involved with them for a number of years. I also know that a culture of "give up" when it snows, or many other types of disruption occurs, developed on the railways when it was seen as a rump industry only fit for closure. Those days are, hopefully, behind us, but it seems that the industry has still a way to go to regain that reliability that was once the norm.

I expect 3" of snow to give roads a problem. I do not expect that of a railway.

If point heaters are overwhelmed then they are not fit for purpose. What equipment do they use in other countries? I am not talking about purchasing fleets of rotary snow ploughs, which even in the Sierra Nevada in the US do not see service every year.

If we have a once in 10 year event so be it, but the UK seems to get once in 10 year events nearly every year.
The biggest problem at Scotrail tonight is the roads. Hundreds of backshift staff have been unable to get to work due appalling road conditions. Things were better earlier as most early shift staff arrived before it alll kicked off. All the advice is don't travel, risk to life etc yet rail staff need to get there somehow. Many roads impassable, buses off, taxis off what are we do do? Fly?
 

bb21

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SWR will be running an amended service tomorrow.

Current plan appears to be that no Hampton Court, Chessington South or Dorking service will run. Salisbury starters will terminate/start at Basingstoke.

Other draft SWR alterations for tomorrow morning, subject to final confirmation and further late-notice alteration, are:

Inbound

2L14 0554 Basingstoke - Waterloo will terminate at Woking.
1G18 0642 Pompey Harbour - Waterloo will terminate at Guildford.
2P22 0655 Pompey Harbour - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2D92 0722 Epsom - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2C90 0723 Reading - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2C18 0742 Reading - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2L22 0752 Basingstoke - Waterloo will terminate at Woking.
2D94 0752 Epsom - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2D96 0822 Epsom - Waterloo will be cancelled.
2J92 0922 Raynes Park - Waterloo will be cancelled.

Outbound

2C07 0550 Waterloo - Reading will be cancelled.
1C89 0653 Ascot - Reading will be cancelled.
2D09 0709 Waterloo - Epsom will be cancelled.
1T21 0909 Waterloo - Pompey Harbour will start at Woking.
2H17 0912 Waterloo - Shepperton will start at Raynes Park.
1P23 0930 Waterloo - Pompey Harbour will be cancelled.

I suspect 1W55 0735 Waterloo - Weymouth may also start at Woking.
 

Ianigsy

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On a positive note, it appears that for at least part of the day, the only public transport in the Worth Valley was the KWVR's diesel railbus.
 

Ediswan

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A thought... I'm sure the rail companies regularly review their bad weather plans. Thing is, they don't need to implement them very often. Hence, they tend to be different each time they are used. Which means commuters, and their employers, don't know in advance what to expect.
 

furnessvale

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The biggest problem at Scotrail tonight is the roads. Hundreds of backshift staff have been unable to get to work due appalling road conditions. Things were better earlier as most early shift staff arrived before it alll kicked off. All the advice is don't travel, risk to life etc yet rail staff need to get there somehow. Many roads impassable, buses off, taxis off what are we do do? Fly?
I suppose the old rule that you report to the nearest station, to be allocated whatever duties they had available, has now gone.

I know it wouldn't find missing Pendolino drivers etc but it used to be a start.
 

bb21

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I suppose the old rule that you report to the nearest station, to be allocated whatever duties they had available, has now gone.
It still exists, in various guises.

As I mentioned before, yesterday my company sent out a sternly worded email about the obligation to turn up for duty (and the various alternatives) during adverse weather conditions.

There may be minor differences in local arrangements but the general principle still applies.
 

muz379

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A thought... I'm sure the rail companies regularly review their bad weather plans. Thing is, they don't need to implement them very often. Hence, they tend to be different each time they are used. Which means commuters, and their employers, don't know in advance what to expect.
I also think that part of the problem is that as others have said often the bad weather plans are not implemented just like other contingency plans until after the effects of bad weather . By this time enough units and crews are already displaced for it to be difficult to then manage ongoing incidents whilst trying to implement an amended train plan .

A lot of people hark back to BR days . But for starters train crew diagrams never used to be as intensive as now , you had a greater ratio of spare train crew and units , in the earlier days people could work 15 hour days . And in earlier days the actual service frequency was not what it is today . If companies did not put out early warnings of their inability to run a full service with the overcrowding already dangerous at times there would just be incidents of stations having to close because of passenger numbers .



Whilst I find most passengers understanding during extreme weather like this I was at Preston earlier and saw the virgin staff telling passengers about nothing being able to run north of Carlisle . Plenty of passengers did not understand why replacement buses could not be run even questioning it after being told that the BTP had closed the road outside the station as it was too dangerous .
 

Cletus

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Southeastern making big changes tomorrow. Not sure of the reasoning of stopping most trains in and out of Dover. Hardly any snow here and hardly any forecasted.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43233114

About 50 railway stations in Kent and East Sussex will be shut on Thursday because of the cold and snowy weather, the Southeastern rail firm has said.

Some lines, including those between Dover and Ramsgate - serving Deal and Sandwich - and Sittingbourne and Sheerness will be closed.

Other services will be operating to a revised timetable on Thursday, the rail company said

Southeastern is advising passengers to avoid travelling if possible.

The line between Paddock Wood and Strood will be closed, as well as the lines from Dover Priory to Faversham and to Ramsgate.

Some stations between Ramsgate and Sittingbourne, between Paddock Wood and Folkestone West, and between Tunbridge Wells and St Leonards will also be closed.

Knockolt, Sole Street, Farningham Road. Higham and Strood stations will also be closed, together with those on the line between Ashford International and Canterbury West.

There will be no trains between Sittingbourne and Sheerness


DXJMqCrXcAA51rv.jpg
 

JW16

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I have to commend TfL Rail for operating a largely decent service today. A shame they disgraced themselves yesterday, but today has gone some way to redeeming that.
 

RichJF

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Been informed by Southern that Coastal routes tomorrow will be affected as the Class 313's don't like cold/ice/snow as much as the 377's! From what I saw this morning the simiar 455's were the ones performing admirably!

It's interesting to note Cletus' post on SE compared with Southern. They intend to run as near to normal as possible through equally rural stretches as SouthEastern!
 

Class83

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I also think that part of the problem is that as others have said often the bad weather plans are not implemented just like other contingency plans until after the effects of bad weather . By this time enough units and crews are already displaced for it to be difficult to then manage ongoing incidents whilst trying to implement an amended train plan .

A lot of people hark back to BR days . But for starters train crew diagrams never used to be as intensive as now , you had a greater ratio of spare train crew and units , in the earlier days people could work 15 hour days.
In general a sensible point, but Scotrail had already reduced the number of services operating today, so pressure on stock and staff should have been reduced. Surely most of the backshift could have walked to their nearest station and got the train to work. Have the sleeper carriages linked up to power near Haymarket as accommodation for those who couldn't get home, run down the service so trains finish deliberately near where staff live or do Network rail have some Land Rovers they could use to drop off the staff on the last service. Even in the worst parts of the Scottish rail network there isn't more than a foot of snow, if they keep the trains running, the lines will stay clear. There is always a way of keeping it going, I'm not convinced there is always a will.

Any good ploughing videos from Scotrail?
 

Gnasher11

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Well GWR got me from Penzance to Paddington with only a slight delay for additional stops, snowing heavily in Cornwall when I left at 12:04, might be a different story tomorrow as more heavy snow is forecast in the South West, which is why I travelled today.
 

muz379

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In general a sensible point, but Scotrail had already reduced the number of services operating today, so pressure on stock and staff should have been reduced. Surely most of the backshift could have walked to their nearest station and got the train to work. Have the sleeper carriages linked up to power near Haymarket as accommodation for those who couldn't get home, run down the service so trains finish deliberately near where staff live or do Network rail have some Land Rovers they could use to drop off the staff on the last service. Even in the worst parts of the Scottish rail network there isn't more than a foot of snow, if they keep the trains running, the lines will stay clear. There is always a way of keeping it going, I'm not convinced there is always a will.

Any good ploughing videos from Scotrail?

playing devils advocate here because I dont live in Scotland , and I live about 3 miles away from my depot in a fairly big city so its highly unforeseeable the roads I use tomorrow are going to be unpassable and even if not by car I could probably walk it in a little over an hour .

But what about staff that cannot stay in sleeper accommodation at work because they have commitments at home ?

Not forgetting for many people this is just a job

Are network rail insured to be dropping traincrew off in their landrovers ?

There is now a red weather warning for the central belt of Scotland meaning that people are advised not to travel unless their journey is essential . As much as plenty of people have their employer tell them that attending work is essential the world wont end tomorrow if the majority of staff did not turn up . Is guarding or driving a train so essential that its worth ignoring a red weather warning ? when the majority of people shouldn't be travelling anyway .

Yes of course emergency service workers , Dr's , nurses are absolutely essential staff who must still turn up for work . But the contingencies you have just suggested for getting rail staff home like land rovers could equally be applied to these essential workers .

Even if trains are kept running points and level crossings are still going to freeze up . because of the road conditions it is going to be difficult for staff to promptly attend this . Signallers are also going to have difficulty reporting for duty given the remote location of some boxes .

As I was explaining to a passenger today the issue is not that the DMU's we operate cannot handle the snow its that when any incident happens like a train fault or infrastructure fault it takes longer for staff to attend by road .
 

Bromley boy

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They also have teams of snowmen who go out and try and sort any issues that come up.

I’ll have to look out for them. Although, I hope they’re wearing regulation orange.

They won't exactly stand out otherwise. ;)
 

SJ21

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GWR have just announced that there will be no Cornish branch line services tomorrow. It is on their twitter feed
 

6Gman

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Have the sleeper carriages linked up to power near Haymarket as accommodation for those who couldn't get home, run down the service so trains finish deliberately near where staff live

On your first suggestion - not sure that dossing down overnight in a SLEP represents the necessary period of rest. On the latter are you really suggesting (e.g.) terminating an Edinburgh - Aberdeen at Montrose because the driver lives there? :idea:
 

al78

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There is now a red weather warning for the central belt of Scotland meaning that people are advised not to travel unless their journey is essential . As much as plenty of people have their employer tell them that attending work is essential the world wont end tomorrow if the majority of staff did not turn up . Is guarding or driving a train so essential that its worth ignoring a red weather warning ? when the majority of people shouldn't be travelling anyway .

If an employer demanded I turn up to work when weather conditions are bad enough that threat to my life is a real possiblility by treavelling on the roads, I would tell them that unless they can demonstrate human life is at stake by me not attending work, they can shove it. I won't work for a sociopath.
 

AndrewE

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On your first suggestion - not sure that dossing down overnight in a SLEP represents the necessary period of rest. :idea:
Come on, it's (almost) an emergency! Far better than a shop doorway or trying to find a seat that will allow you to stretch out inside a station. I would give a commendation to any operator/manager who had the wit to offer such accommodation to essential staff.
I (and family) were allowed to kip in a stationary couchette train at Hendaye once during a French rail strike and was very grateful for it.
 

Andrewh32

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A few greater than 4 hours on east coast.

0540 Edinburgh- Kings Cross only made it to Stevenage. Not sure what happened to prevent it going all the way after a long wait outside York.

Was being dragged dead by 67012 which would have been trapped had it continued to Kings Cross
 

6Gman

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Come on, it's (almost) an emergency! Far better than a shop doorway or trying to find a seat that will allow you to stretch out inside a station. I would give a commendation to any operator/manager who had the wit to offer such accommodation to essential staff.
I (and family) were allowed to kip in a stationary couchette train at Hendaye once during a French rail strike and was very grateful for it.

No safety-critical staff should even consider reporting for work after spending a night in "a shop doorway" or "a seat that will allow you to stretch out inside a station". Let the guy/woman go home, sleep in a bed and report for duty properly refreshed.
 

SGS

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Something up at Newcastle again. Platforms occupied by terminated trains, nothing much moving and loads of trains stacked up outside the station.
 
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