SSR resignalling

Discussion in 'London Underground' started by Dstock7080, 22 Jun 2018.

  1. CMS

    CMS Member

    Messages:
    181
    Joined:
    12 Aug 2009
    That would seem excessive to me unless they are peak frequencies and all of the Amersham/Cheshams are fast and all of the Watfords semi-fast.
     
  2. bluegoblin7

    bluegoblin7 Member

    Messages:
    750
    Joined:
    10 May 2011
    Location:
    OZ / OP
    As stated in that post, they are the peak frequencies.
     
  3. PeterC

    PeterC Established Member

    Messages:
    1,674
    Joined:
    29 Sep 2014
    That is the same frequency as now for Chesham / Amersham. Two Amersham trains are stoppers the rest are fast. I know that local people are hoping for their fast trains back off peak once the resignalling is complete.
     
  4. CMS

    CMS Member

    Messages:
    181
    Joined:
    12 Aug 2009
    10tph Watford seems massive though, but I imagine it’s more for operational convenience compared to other potential reversal points than demand. I have also seen media around this and although I use the WCML far more than the Met line, I certainly believe re-introducing off-peak fasts is needed.
     
  5. DavyCrocket

    DavyCrocket Member

    Messages:
    505
    Joined:
    27 Oct 2006
    Won’t be happening in November now.
     
  6. bramling

    bramling Established Member

    Messages:
    5,626
    Joined:
    5 Mar 2012
    Location:
    South-east / Barnard Castle
    From what I hear it’s now postponed for the time being, with new dates yet to be announced. One can’t help but wonder how a few months ago they thought things were sufficiently close to be going into revenue service on one of the test weekends, and now it keeps slipping more and more to the right.

    To be fair this “third supplier lucky” contract was always going to be a challenge, however Thales do seem to be running into issues on this one.
     
  7. simple simon

    simple simon Member

    Messages:
    402
    Joined:
    13 Feb 2011
    Location:
    Suburban London
    copied from a railgen site...

    Simon
    ----------------------------------

    Another update.

    The proposed software version for revenue use won't be mature enough until well into the New Year.

    Hammersmith/ Finchley Road to Euston Square has been the suggested commissioning area to try and recover lost project milestones.

    Most S8 stock has been kitted out with CBTC already so is achievable while a large chunk of S7 stock is already fitted.

    Last Weekend's system testing possession between Euston Square to Whitechapel/ Tower Hill was successful.
     
  8. bluegoblin7

    bluegoblin7 Member

    Messages:
    750
    Joined:
    10 May 2011
    Location:
    OZ / OP
    This is the first suggestion I've heard of any combining of areas.

    I'd take most of what gets posted on "gen sites" about 4LM with a pinch of salt.
     
  9. simple simon

    simple simon Member

    Messages:
    402
    Joined:
    13 Feb 2011
    Location:
    Suburban London
    Well I know what I read, but I will only believe when I see it!
     
  10. DavyCrocket

    DavyCrocket Member

    Messages:
    505
    Joined:
    27 Oct 2006
    Doubftul that there is the resource to provide familiarisation over such a large area. That is why smaller areas are chosen for the first of each line(s)
     
  11. bramling

    bramling Established Member

    Messages:
    5,626
    Joined:
    5 Mar 2012
    Location:
    South-east / Barnard Castle
    It happened with the Jubilee, which among other things led to the Northern taking a "let's look at how they did things on the Jubilee and *not* do it that way" approach.

    I can't see the current SSR management going with a combining approach, as the intention is to emulate the Northern Line delivery as far as possible - and many of the key players have come straight from the Northern to SSR. Having said that, pressure can always be applied from above to do things in undesirable ways.

    Given the mess left over on the Northern, much of which is still there today, I'm pleased to see there does seem to be some effort to iron out software issues before "go live".
     
  12. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
    I note there is a closure for line modernisation this weekend between Hammersmith and Edgware Road — covering the SMA0.5 and SMA1 areas, plus some extra for sensible service patterns.

    Is this for testing, or for a potential rollout?
     
  13. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
    “Operational Proving of SMA0.5”, ie. full testing of timetable, trains running without passengers but stopping at each station.
    Hopefully ready for full commissioning 16-17 March.
     
  14. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
    Good news! Fingers crossed for a success.

    Is anyone able to share any interesting detail about how the issue has been addressed with Hammersmith depot's disappearing/reappearing trains?
     
  15. LU_timetabler

    LU_timetabler Member

    Messages:
    100
    Joined:
    5 Feb 2017
    It's software issues. That seems to be the problem with new trains and new signalling these days - software issues!
     
  16. bramling

    bramling Established Member

    Messages:
    5,626
    Joined:
    5 Mar 2012
    Location:
    South-east / Barnard Castle
    It doesn't exactly help when you twice change your mind as to who's going to do a job, and then want it done asap!

    The Victoria Line is the only one of the PPP-era resignalling projects which has been delivered in a manner which could be described as smooth and orderly.
     
  17. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
    I wonder if that's down to luck? They might well have encountered many fewer difficulties purely through the good fortune of working on a line with an already-established ATO method of working.
     
  18. bramling

    bramling Established Member

    Messages:
    5,626
    Joined:
    5 Mar 2012
    Location:
    South-east / Barnard Castle
    Possible. To be fair the Victoria Line was likely to be a slightly easier line to work on, and of course it’s rather shorter and less complex than any of the others, and of course didn’t involve open-air running which does simplify things a bit. Having said that, I get the feeling this project was run by a much better project team, and of course with the benefit of a much more clued-up and experienced supplier - Westinghouse as opposed to Thales. They didn’t seem to make all the schoolboy errors that Thales did on the Jubilee and Northern.

    Without being on the inside of the project it’s hard to know for sure, however this is the feel I’ve picked up, and the Vic Line’s sublime solid 36tph peak service would seem to back this feeling up.
     
  19. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
    How did it go? I know there were faults at KXSP on Sunday, did that affect testing?
     
  20. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
    All seems OK, 132 out of 132 train movements successfully completed in CBTC.
     
  21. Mojo

    Mojo Administrator Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    16,696
    Joined:
    7 Aug 2005
    Location:
    0035
    That was the normal service, nowhere near the test area, described as "Operational Proving" and used a special test train, with the normal service terminating at Edgware Rd and the Circle line running a 'traditional' service.

    This differs from any commissioning will which involve a near-normal service[1] running to and from Hammersmith, with trains simply running empty from Paddington Suburban to Hammersmith, this is planned for, as stated above by @Dstock7080 the weekend of 16-17 March.

    [1] A different timetable with earlier closures, etc, applies for this weekend but broadly the daytime service sees both Circle & Hammersmith/City line trains running to Hammersmith.
     
    Last edited: 6 Mar 2019
  22. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
    I see — the previous post made it sound like that was already last weekend's plan.
     
  23. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
  24. Mikey C

    Mikey C Established Member

    Messages:
    2,288
    Joined:
    11 Feb 2013
    The Northern Line scheme didn't go badly, it was massively smoother and less disruptive than say the Jubilee Line one
     
  25. rebmcr

    rebmcr Established Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Joined:
    15 Nov 2011
    Location:
    London
  26. bramling

    bramling Established Member

    Messages:
    5,626
    Joined:
    5 Mar 2012
    Location:
    South-east / Barnard Castle
    Only after rescheduling, IIRC the original completion date was 2011, so the final completion was roughly three years late. To be fair this was largely due to the legacy of the Jubilee Line issues and perhaps partly due to the Tube Lines uncertainty. The ultimate Northern Line implementation phase went reasonably well, however there has been a legacy of issues left over, which are now LU’s problem, and have at times required assistance to be enlisted from consultants. Ultimately this and other factors has resulted in failure to deliver a new timetable which was planned to come in last year.
     
  27. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
    A ‘soft-launch’ into passenger operation will hopefully occur sometime this weekend.

    As at 0730 trains already operating to full timetable and no issues presented themselves.
     
  28. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
    CBTC Hammersmith-Latimer Road went live for passenger operation at 14.06 today.
     
  29. ijmad

    ijmad Member

    Messages:
    989
    Joined:
    7 Jan 2016
    Location:
    UK
    Great news. Hopefully the next phases will be easier now they've got a real live system proved and in daily passenger service. Roll on SMA1!
     
  30. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

    Messages:
    1,351
    Joined:
    17 Feb 2010
    Location:
    West London
    and 2 combined !
    Latimer Road/Finchley Road-Euston Square
     

Share This Page