St James T&W Metro Station

Discussion in 'Other Public Transport' started by southern442, 3 Feb 2018.

  1. southern442

    southern442 Established Member

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    On the Wikipedia page for this station, it states the following:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_James_Metro_station

    This made me curious but I know that wikipedia can be unreliable. Can anybody shed any light on this?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 13 Feb 2018
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  3. Kryten2340

    Kryten2340 Member

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    I don't think St James has ever had more than 2 platforms. That bit about it once having 3 platforms was added to the wikipedia article in July last year.
    It sounds like whoever has edited this has done so in error and possibly referring to North Shields but I believe North Shields platform 3 closed much later than 1984.
     
  4. MetroCar4058

    MetroCar4058 Member

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    I believe a 3rd tunnel was bored but it was never used.
     
  5. Baxenden Bank

    Baxenden Bank Established Member

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    I saw that bit on the Wikipedia page, but only after I had just come back from a trip to Newcastle where I did actually use St James Station and could have had a better look!

    There is a boarded up area to the left of the station entrance, I don't know what this was.

    There are longer platforms and 'over-run' tunnels heading west beyond the current platforms - the platforms for the longer trains which were initially planned but reduced due to cost-cutting in the 1970's and the tunnels for any potential expansion to the west end.

    I haven't found any other reference to a third platform, such as on urban explorer sites who usually know about, get into and photograph such things. For example the many disused London Underground stations and GPO Mail Rail.

    There is however this photograph, from a Newcastle Chronicle article which shows the 'line between Monument and St James', which might show a potential heading for a third tunnel off to the left?
    JS82884282.jpg
     
  6. 142094

    142094 Established Member

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    Never had 3 platforms, only the same two as at present in two tunnel bores. The area to the left in the photo is occupied by the lift, lift machinery, two toilets, cleaners cupboard and the escalator voids. Same as on the opposite platform.

    Someone on You Tube claimed there was 3 tunnels due to their being 3 info screens at concourse level. The outer two show platform departure info whilst the middle one used to show generic messages.
     
  7. southern442

    southern442 Established Member

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    Cheers for the responses. It would seem from what people have said and from the photo that provision for a third platform was made but none was ever built, so it had (rather typically) been exaggerated by wikipedia.

    I've always thought of St James as being quite a creepy station, especially at quiet times. Presumably the atmosphere is less so when there are football matches on. Out of interest, for how long do the over-run tunnels continue? Is it just a short distance or perhaps more over the top like the Jubilee Line at Charing Cross?
     
  8. 142094

    142094 Established Member

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    There is crowd control measures in place for when there is a home match on, plus there are normally at least two extra trains which are added into service going around the Coast, although these are not advertised in the passenger timetables. Trains run empty from the depot to Stoddart Street sidings and into St James, then out to Longbenton and back to the depot.

    The overrun tunnels can fit a 2 car set, although there is special signalling arrangements in place for this. Also now for the overrun tunnel on platform 1 to be used, there has to be a dispatcher in place as the driver cannot see along the side of the train to allow safe movement past the normal stopping point.
     
  9. Baxenden Bank

    Baxenden Bank Established Member

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    I found it a really strange place. A cavernous station with, just after the morning peak, two staff on the ticket barriers and perhaps three passengers and a driver going to start his shift. As you say presumably a lot busier on match days and perhaps the new development in the area will attract business.

    The tunnels end just the other side of the dual carriageway (but underground obviously) as the new development there had to take them into account. There is a plan with the planning application but the council website was down last night so I couldn't take another look at it.
     
  10. Nick66

    Nick66 Member

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    Apart from football matches the only people who would use the station are people coming in from the North Shields Line, changing at Monument isn’t really worth it for anyone coming from the north or the south and there’s not a great deal in that part of the city anyway. I remember the opening and have only ever seen 2 platforms.
     
  11. route101

    route101 Established Member

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    I always thought the line was planned to be extended westwards and it never has done .
     
  12. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Veteran Member

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    St James is a really odd station with a strange atmosphere. On non-matchdays it feels like a totally forgotten corner of the network.
     
  13. Puffing Devil

    Puffing Devil Established Member

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    I remember using Manors station in the late 80s - that was also a very empty desolate space at the time.
     
  14. Arctic Troll

    Arctic Troll Established Member

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    In peak time it's not deserted, especially with all the development around Gallowgate and on the old brewery site. I used to use it when I worked at the Uni as I'd get a seat.

    Evenings, though, it's weird. Very weird.

    I think it was only ever designed to have two platforms. But I get the feeling that the station box was designed to be amended if needed.
     
  15. 2392

    2392 Member

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    The somewhat odd design of St. James station is down to the accident at Moorgate [another older dead end station] on the London Underground back in 1975. When a tube train just kept on going and crashed with disastrous results. Bear in mind that at the time underground section of the Metro was being designed/developed. So there were over run tunnels with escape routes built and short section signalling installed on the approach to the platforms. The section between the last to signals is less than a single metro train long, hence the train runs into either platform at little more than a fast walking pace..............
     
    Last edited: 20 Feb 2018
  16. 142094

    142094 Established Member

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    Don't think the overrun tunnels were specificallly built with Moorgate in mind, more the fact that you can get 2x 2 car sets in thr platforms. The signalling system is set up as you say in regards to Moorgate, and will stop a train travelling at too high a speed into the platform (however it is the same signalling sequence and speeds if the platforms are occupied or not, apart from the last signal will have a position light for permissive working if the platform overrun is occupied.
     
  17. 2392

    2392 Member

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    One thing though is for certain the tragedy of the Moorgate accident, changed the views of the powers that be. The likes of the Railway inspectorate [as was] the Department of Transport etc.
     
  18. Paul_10

    Paul_10 Member

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    Are the reasons the same for why there is 2 signals in close proximity to each other leading to Airport station with of course the exception being it an extrenal location and I believe the speed limit is higher than st St James?
     
  19. 142094

    142094 Established Member

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    Yes same reason, South Hylton is similar as also has speed magnets on the approach but only the one signal protecting the platform. South Shields is a bit of an oddity as there are no speed magnets on the approach to the platform - there is a longish overrun to the signal that allows access to the sidings, however in the 80s when single cars ran, they used to couple up at South Shields so not sure why the speed magnets were omitted there.
     
  20. FQTV

    FQTV Member

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    I understand that surface developments since have required such deep foundations that extension westward from St James is no longer possible.

    Hence the North East Combined Authority’s recent adoption of proposals to use part of the former Hexham route along the Scotswood alignment to improve the West End’s connectivity.
     
  21. ModernRailways

    ModernRailways Established Member

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    There is still the possibility of tunneling westward from St James however it would be incredibly costly and the topography of Western Newcastle doesn't lend itself well to the Metro as stations would need to be dug deep down and would thus cost a fortune themselves. If there was to be a Metro in the west end, I would imagine Central Station becoming the interchange point with trains then continuing towards Westerhope/Scotswood running close to Westmorland Road/Elswick Road/Whickham View. Even then the route would still be incredibly steep.
     
  22. FQTV

    FQTV Member

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    I meant to link to the relevant document, but I couldn't locate it at the time.

    https://www.nexus.org.uk/sites/default/files/Metro Futures brochure.pdf

     
  23. Malcmal

    Malcmal Member

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    I have explored many of the various voids and chambers under St James station several times in the 1990's. One area was used for storing theater props - I think for the Tyne Theater if I remember correctly. Also I heard of a boat being kept in another part of the complex. At the end of the overrun tunnels is a spiral metal staircase that leads up to ground level with an exit at the back of St James Park football ground.
     
  24. DanNCL

    DanNCL Member

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    It would be interesting to see photographs and a map of all these voids and chambers, along with any other parts of the station that many people won't know about.
     
  25. ModernRailways

    ModernRailways Established Member

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    You could probably request a diagram from Nexus under FOI. Most of them will be closed off now though due to asbestos.
     
  26. DanNCL

    DanNCL Member

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    I think I might do that. Are there any other stations with large areas like those at St James that aren't accessible to the public?
     
  27. ModernRailways

    ModernRailways Established Member

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    I believe Gateshead, Monument and Manors do, but I'm not 100% sure. I believe Heworth also has some pretty big non public areas, but again I'm not 100% sure and it's just what I've heard in passing. Asbestos is a major issue which is why station refurbishments are being held off, the costs will be crazy high and Nexus are a little bit strapped for cash at the minute.
     
  28. TWTrains

    TWTrains New Member

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    There is a clear area where a third platform from the days of BR at Brockley Whins Metro was.
    At St James, there is provisions for a never-built, but planned, 2nd exit at Gallowgate End. Perhaps that's something to do with it having 3 platforms? I mean it would create less congestion as there would be more ways to get out of the station.
     
  29. hacman

    hacman Member

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    Haymarket also supposedly has a level between the concourse and the platforms.
     
  30. ModernRailways

    ModernRailways Established Member

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    If you use the lift you’ll see a floor labelled ‘Basement’ that can only be accessed with a key.
     

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