Staff changes

[ralphchadkirk]

Just read the post above yours!

I think he means that he wondered, and now he knows rather than he is wondering.

 

[Class172]

I think he means that he wondered, and now he knows rather than he is wondering.

Yes, that's what I meant, I didn't know before but now I do. Sorry if it was confusing

 

[David]

All moderators on RailUK are global moderators, we don't have any local moderators. Moderators are usually picked by the staff by discussing who we think is suitable for the position.

Also depends on how well behaved you are on the forum, which rules me out of a return! :P

 

[causton]

All the best wishes! (This is the 1000th post in this forum )

 

[yorkie]

I wondered how they were chosen...

Just out of curiosity, how do people go about becoming moderators? Or is it a position for which you are head hunted?

We don't invite applications at present but we may review that.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Also depends on how well behaved you are on the forum, which rules me out of a return! :P

Rules me out of ever getting anywhere near!

 

[strange6]

Rules me out of ever getting anywhere near!

When I joined the forum at the beginning of the year (I didn't really know how a forum operated), people wound me up quite easily and I did tend to show the fact that it did; but with a little bit of guidance from Yorkie and Mojo in particular, I think I have learned the knack of it now. I still don't have the in-depth knowledge of the railway though, to become a moderator on these fine forums.

 

[Greenback]

When I joined the forum at the beginning of the year (I didn't really know how a forum operated), people wound me up quite easily and I did tend to show the fact that it did; but with a little bit of guidance from Yorkie and Mojo in particular, I think I have learned the knack of it now. I still don't have the in-depth knowledge of the railway though, to become a moderator on these fine forums.

It can often take time to get used to the tone and atmosphere (if that's the right word!) of a forum.

I imagine that being a moderator on any forum requires a certain amount of commitment in terms of time. Does it require particular expertise as well? I suppose it helps to know something about the subject, but the mods I have seen on other forums don't always come across as being as knowledgeable as those on here!

 

[Bittern]

I leaned that if someone gives you crap, you ring their doorbell and run away.

 

[bluenoxid]

I leaned that if someone gives you crap, you ring their doorbell and run away.

It's true. Next time, it won't be the water pistol

 

[the sniper]

All moderators on RailUK are global moderators, we don't have any local moderators. Moderators are usually picked by the staff by discussing who we think is suitable for the position.

We don't invite applications at present but we may review that.

Thanks for the answers guys. My curiosity has been satisfied.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I joined the forum in April of this year and I must confess that it did take some time to become accustomed to matters and to fully learn all that the website has to offer in the functions available. Maybe it was because I am nearer 70 than 60 and rather less computer literate than the majority of forum members.

I would like to put on record that yorkie has been kindness reincarnated, in respect of the many helpful PM that I have received from him, that are always worded in a way that empathy to forum members comes across at once.

My best wishes to the two new forum moderators.

 

[O L Leigh]

Given that the amount of anti-staff sentiment has been increasing on this forum, why is there not at least one member of railstaff acting as a moderator?

O L Leigh

 

[blacknight]

Given that the amount of anti-staff sentiment has been increasing on this forum, why is there not at least one member of railstaff acting as a moderator?

O L Leigh

Fully agree that for balance a moderator should come from rail staff industry if it comes to vote O L Leigh you have mine.
For example recent threads
Driver "reading paper" at controls was open for 4 days
Incident at Crewe alledged behavior of guard to passenger still open after 4 days, although thread as digressed somewhat.
O L Leigh thread about anti staff sentiment closed within 14 hours

 

[yorkie]

For example recent threads
Driver "reading paper" at controls was open for 4 days
Incident at Crewe alledged behavior of guard to passenger still open after 4 days, although thread as digressed somewhat.
O L Leigh thread about anti staff sentiment closed within 14 hours

I don't understand what relevance these 'statistics' have? If you have a problem with a post, report it. If you don't, don't.

As for the driver reading paper topic, if you are trying to suggest there was 4 days worth of 'anti staff' comments then the reality is somewhat different, yes some people may have gone OTT, but then the photographer has been criticised and called into question too, and there have been plenty of 'anti-customer' comments too!

I would appreciate it if this thread wasn't used to complain, yet again, about anti-staff posts. If you feel a post is inappropriate, report it. This forum is a balanced forum for staff and non-staff alike, and if you want a forum that is completely pro-staff and has many anti-customer comments on it, then such a forum does exist.

By the way it isn't the case that the forum staff team consists entirely of non-rail staff.

 

[The Snap]

By the way it isn't the case that the forum staff team consists entirely of non-rail staff.

I don't know who from the current staff list works on the railway, nor in which area they work, but I can't help thinking that an experienced member of railway staff would benefit the moderation of this forum...

 

[SS4]

This is not a train nor is it part of the NR network. The forum is not affiliated to NR/ATOC in any way so why should they get special moderation privileges? If a member of NR staff is proven as good enough to moderate then let them do so but don't do it simply because they are employed on the railway.

 

[OxtedL]

...NR/ATOC...

You make a very good point. Speaking generally, moderation on a forum should not really be about content, unless it is obvious that the content in question is genuinely not relevant. A thorough knowledge oughtn't be required, although having said that, the staff on this forum all know their stuff.

I'm very concious of the exact wording Yorkie used. Hence the slightly out of context quote. But my mind could be playing tricks.

 

[Tom B]

You make a very good point. Speaking generally, moderation on a forum should not really be about content, unless it is obvious that the content in question is genuinely not relevant. A thorough knowledge oughtn't be required, although having said that, the staff on this forum all know their stuff.

Quite. I've been on forums previously where people have been made mods or admins because of their in-depth knowledge of the subject - which is not a good reason.

Experience suggests some people will happily complain about the moderation AFTER the event, but make no complaint at the time. There's a report function - use it! I'm not sure what the anti-staff complaints are regarding - it can't be expected that forum staff should ban any posts which are anti-staff. If people post things which others disagree with, or that they know are wrong etc, then put them right with a reply. If they won't listen, that's (IMO) not a cause to complain to the mods. If you're having a discussion with someone in the street and they won't listen to your argument, you don't call the Police, you think to yourself "God, what a prat" and get on with life.

There are anti-staff posts on here but plenty of anti-passenger sentiment too. It's not a willy-waving contest.

Anyway - congratulations to the new mods and all the best - some people will never be happy and it can seem a thankless task at some points - I know, I've done my time!

 

[Pumbaa]

I don't know who from the current staff list works on the railway, nor in which area they work, but I can't help thinking that an experienced member of railway staff would benefit the moderation of this forum...

Define experienced out of interest?

I have no problems with the moderation, it is light touch and guided where necessary. The best moderators/admins are those who are fair to all sides, and to the staff member concerned, they do this role well and remain balanced. Being 'experienced' or being railstaff should have little to do with it.

And I can also confirm that the mod team has railstaff present.

 

[O L Leigh]

For example recent threads
Driver "reading paper" at controls was open for 4 days
Incident at Crewe alledged behavior of guard to passenger still open after 4 days, although thread as digressed somewhat.
O L Leigh thread about anti staff sentiment closed within 14 hours

And this is the nub of the problem.

As it stands at the current moment there is no balance in the moderation of this forum. The threads that have engendered this feeling of animosity have remained open while my thread gets closed due to being "repetitive", something that I do not believe breaches forum rules. I have PM'ed the mod responsible expressing my hope that the moderation of the forum will be even-handed but I am still awaiting a response. Given the repetitive nature of some of these threads and their current open status is a tacit response of sorts, though not the one I had hoped for.

I am not naive enough to believe that there aren't anti-passenger sentiments expressed here (though I question how much of it originates from railstaff). Neither do I expect that railstaff should get a moderators position due to knowledge or any perceived special privilege, or that one is deserved by right. However, given the growing dissatisfaction amongst railstaff at the way this forum is being run I would expect that the moderators/administrators would do something about it. You cannot expect to stand idly by when a section of your membership is complaining about being marginalised or alienated.

If this forum is intended to be for enthusiasts then I am happy to leave it for the enthusiasts. However, if the idea is that everyone's views are welcomed and valued then everyone has to be made to feel welcomed and valued, and that is the job of the moderators to ensure this happens. I had previously said that I wasn't leaving the forum, but the truth of the matter is that the forum and it's staff are on probation. If I feel unhappy with the way railstaff are being treated then I will end my 5 year association with this community.

I hope that I have now been adequately clear on this matter.

O L Leigh

**EDIT**

And, by the way, yes I would like a substantive response that specifically addresses my concerns, not just some half-hearted attempt at persuading me that it is a "two way street".

 

[yorkie]

And this is the nub of the problem.

I've already answered that, and I don't agree that it is. The length of time that the topics were open for isn't really much of an indicator, and there were strong views from BOTH sides in the topics that are claimed to be 'anti-staff'.

However, given the growing dissatisfaction amongst railstaff at the way this forum is being run I would expect that the moderators/administrators would do something about it. You cannot expect to stand idly by when a section of your membership is complaining about being marginalised or alienated.

I'm not aware of many people who have expressed this view, only a small number.

I would encourage you to identify to me via PM any post(s) you are unhappy with.

There is a forum specifically for rail staff, this isn't it and never will be. We do hope the forum will be balanced but the fact is that we will have people with quite differing views. You will get less, or even none, of the views you dislike on a forum specifically for rail staff, such a forum does exist.

 

[O L Leigh]

I've already answered that, and I don't agree that it is. The length of time that the topics were open for isn't really much of an indicator, and there were strong views from BOTH sides in the topics that are claimed to be 'anti-staff'.

Yes it is. Why should I and my colleagues be unable to express our dissatisfaction when others are free to stick the knife in with impunity?

I'm not aware of many people who have expressed this view, only a small number.

Really...? Well if we'd been afforded a little more time then perhaps some others might have been emboldened to come forward and add their voices.

I would encourage you to identify to me via PM any post(s) you are unhappy with.

Oh please...!! Not this again. Report them for what...? Have you read the forum rules recently? They are as insubstantial as gossamer. It's no wonder the mods can act with impunity in any way they see fit without challenge. It's all down to interpretation; theirs not ours.

There is a forum specifically for rail staff, this isn'tit and never will be. We do hope the forum will be balanced but the fact is that we will have people with quite differing views. You will get less, or even none, of the views you dislike on a forum specifically for rail staff, such a forum does exist.

Thank you, I am aware.

If I simply wanted a staff perspective I wouldn't be wasting my time and breath here. But clearly you still fail to understand the core of my complaint. I have no issue with some anti-staff sentiment where it is justified, and nor do I have any problem debating such matters. What annoys me is the extent to which this is allowed to run away with itself unchecked, with the outcome that railstaff are considering leaving this forum for pastures new, such as the one you indicate.

O L Leigh

 

[causton]

Oh please...!! Not this again. Report them for what...?

Yorkie never said 'posts that break the rules', he said 'posts that you are unhappy with'. Taking a neutral standpoint here, I would suggest that means that even if it does not break a forum rule, if you don't like that sort of post tell him about it!

Now on a different note, I do see more a little more anti-staff related content than anti-passenger related content, but this may be due to me not reading every single thread - and I would be interested to know how many members as a % are railstaff, and passengers may not have anywhere else to rant about the sort of things they do outside of a forum setting, but any railstaff can moan to fellow colleagues etc (I know it happens in most jobs, so I am guessing it does in the rail industry too!)

If you can't tell already, I really am on the fence about this one - I don't know whether the anti-staff threads do go too far...

 

[Mojo]

Yes it is. Why should I and my colleagues be unable to express our dissatisfaction when others are free to stick the knife in with impunity?

Where?! I haven't seen anything.

Really...? Well if we'd been afforded a little more time then perhaps some others might have been emboldened to come forward and add their voices.

Time for what? You are free to send a message at any time, yet I have not received any PMs or messages from you via the contact form.

Oh please...!! Not this again. Report them for what...?

A breach of the rules? Or are the posts not breaking the rules, just an opinion you disagree with?

Have you read the forum rules recently? They are as insubstantial as gossamer.

They seem pretty simple and conflict-free and are pretty common rules you may expect on any normal forum.

In any case, you have been told before that this is not the appropriate place to discuss such matters. If you have some suggestions to make regarding improvements, rather than vague complaints regarding incidents which I haven't heard anything about in order to verify whether they did or did not happen, or if it's just a difference of opinion, then they should be made through the appropriate channels (ie. by PM or contact form).

 

[O L Leigh]

So, no fair and open discussion amongst the community regarding the rules by which we're all expected to abide...? I did start a specific thread but, um, it got locked.

As for the rest of your post, I imagine that Yorkie is filling you in on our PM conversation.

O L Leigh

 

[Mojo]

Your thread was a complaint about the forum. Making a thread on that subject is not an appropriate way to leave your complaint. Nor is replying in this thread, an announcement on staffing changes.

I am not sure exactly what you are asking for. The posts do not break forum rules, which is why they are not reported? Stupid and nonsensical posts also come within the scope of the rules, so if you are certain they don't break them then perhaps they may just be a difference of opinion?

 

[AlexS]

Being a subject matter expert is about the worst way to pick a moderator, it should be about common sense. You're not picking up people on correct implementation of the rulebook, or ticketing or whatever else, it's the rules of the forum you need to be conversant in.

Therefore anyone with a reasonable level of common sense is able to do the job and being a member of railway staff is an irrelevance.

I hired several of the moderators on this forum back in the day (we're talking years ago) and they were selected because they were a) sensible and b) had a fair and balanced outlook on things. They all seem to have done fairly well.

The easiest way to get by is to forget trying to differentiate between 'staff' and 'enthusiasts' because everyone has a valid opinion. Ignoring a national news article because it features a member of railway staff would be ridiculous. Moderating it if it turned into a slanging match is another matter. You don't need to be a train driver to know where the line is.

Appointing someone to a position as a moderator purely on the grounds of them being 'staff' would also be, I feel, unfair to the other moderators, as first among equals isn't really on.

 

[HST Power]

Who actually started RailUK? Was it a joint thing or has ownership been handed down over the years?

 

[Jordy]

Primarily yorkie, I was a very early member but didn't become a moderator until some time later.