Stations rebranded to Great British Railways design / Rail Alphabet 2

[Bletchleyite]

There have been two that I've seen, Trafford Park and Heald Green have had the new vinyls. No TfGM logo on them, just the same as all the other Northern examples.

That's definitely a bad thing. The PTE logos in their areas are a useful indication of e.g. PTE ticket validity.

 

[py_megapixel]

That's definitely a bad thing. The PTE logos in their areas are a useful indication of e.g. PTE ticket validity.

Although unless a passenger happens to know that GMPTE was TfGM's predecessor, GMPTE logos probably weren't all that helpful.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Although unless a passenger happens to know that GMPTE was TfGM's predecessor, GMPTE logos probably weren't all that helpful.

I think the "wavey M" logo is similar enough to the old one that people would realise it was the same thing.

 

[jonnyfan]

I was surprised to see the TfGM logo omitted, it can be a helpful indicator for limits on ticket validity etc. The TfGM logo does feature prominently on all station totems at the entrance, which have all recently been renewed across Greater Manchester.

 

[Gareth]

That's definitely a bad thing. The PTE logos in their areas are a useful indication of e.g. PTE ticket validity.

It'll be interesting to see how Merseyrail is affected. Considering it's a devolved TOC, maybe only the "City" line will receive the changes.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It'll be interesting to see how Merseyrail is affected. Considering it's a devolved TOC, maybe only the "City" line will receive the changes.

I suspect they'll probably just change the font.

 

[Peter Sarf]

That's definitely a bad thing. The PTE logos in their areas are a useful indication of e.g. PTE ticket validity.

I think that the average passenger will want to ascertain the validity of their ticket before starting their journey. So will not be making a decision to alight and travel back one stop because the station they have reached has no PTE logo.

I did wonder how useful the Zone number is on platform signs in London. South Croydon seemed to have a platform 5 in the middle of five platforms !. Then I realised both sides were number five, quickly followed by the realisation that other platforms were also number 5 !. It was of course the zone number which seems to me to be pretty pointless once you have reached the station whether by train or by foot/road.

 

[CJ]

Slightly related to the above comments re: GMPTE/TfGM logos etc.

I spotted earlier today that Deansgate railway station in Manchester still has an old Regional Railways branding signage with GMPTE logo intact!

It appears that it's viewable in Google Maps also, You can see/find it here if you zoom into it:

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

I wonder how that was missed (and if it will be RA2'd/GBR'd? ). As of right now, Deansgate is still in the old Northern branded signages.

 

[tomuk]

Slightly related to the above comments re: GMPTE/TfGM logos etc.

I spotted earlier today that Deansgate railway station in Manchester still has an old Regional Railways branding signage with GMPTE logo intact!

It appears that it's viewable in Google Maps also, You can see/find it here if you zoom into it:

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

I wonder how that was missed (and if it will be RA2'd/GBR'd? ). As of right now, Deansgate is still in the old Northern branded signages.

That sign was put up sometime between 2014 and 2016.

 

[Watershed]

Slightly related to the above comments re: GMPTE/TfGM logos etc.

I spotted earlier today that Deansgate railway station in Manchester still has an old Regional Railways branding signage with GMPTE logo intact!

It appears that it's viewable in Google Maps also, You can see/find it here if you zoom into it:

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

I wonder how that was missed (and if it will be RA2'd/GBR'd? ). As of right now, Deansgate is still in the old Northern branded signages.

Manchester Oxford Road is even better. I suspect that sign isn't very easy to access, hence why it's survived at least 30 years or so.

 

[The exile]

I think that the average passenger will want to ascertain the validity of their ticket before starting their journey. So will not be making a decision to alight and travel back one stop because the station they have reached has no PTE logo.

I did wonder how useful the Zone number is on platform signs in London. South Croydon seemed to have a platform 5 in the middle of five platforms !. Then I realised both sides were number five, quickly followed by the realisation that other platforms were also number 5 !. It was of course the zone number which seems to me to be pretty pointless once you have reached the station whether by train or by foot/road.

If you’re going to have a zone-based fare structure, then there should be very clear indication of what zone you’re in. The station name boards are the most obvious place to put that indication ( as well as the maps). Prague does it on the buses as well - took me ages to realise why they all had a little light display behind the driver displaying a capital “P”. Then I was on a route that crossed the city boundary, the “P” changed to a number “0” (I think) and the penny dropped. No excuse for not knowing you’re “out of area”!

 

[scrapy]

It'll be interesting to see how Merseyrail is affected. Considering it's a devolved TOC, maybe only the "City" line will receive the changes.

Rainford and Meols Cop have received the plain lettering and whilst not technically 'city line' they are Merseyside PTE stations. Will be interesting what of anything the TFW managed stations in England (including Merseyside) get

 

[emoaconr]

Not sure about this one at Liverpool James Street?

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Not sure about this one at Liverpool James Street?

Nope, that’s Transport.

 

[Goldfish62]

If you’re going to have a zone-based fare structure, then there should be very clear indication of what zone you’re in. The station name boards are the most obvious place to put that indication ( as well as the maps). Prague does it on the buses as well - took me ages to realise why they all had a little light display behind the driver displaying a capital “P”. Then I was on a route that crossed the city boundary, the “P” changed to a number “0” (I think) and the penny dropped. No excuse for not knowing you’re “out of area”!

Agreed. Why anyone would think it was actually a good idea to remove zonal identification on platforms is beyond me. It's unnecessarily removing information that may be useful to some passengers.

I can't imagine that Merseytravel and WY Metro are going to be too happy about having their smart signage replaced with 1970s blandness.

TfGM probably won't be too bothered because they've been in no hurry to update their stations from GMPTE to TfGM and in any case the latter is being superceded by the "Bee Network" brand. 2030 is targeted for full integration of the regional rail network into the brand.

 

[HarryL]

I can't imagine that Merseytravel and WY Metro are going to be too happy about having their smart signage replaced with 1970s blandness.

WY Metro signage isn't very smart to be fair, it's standard Northern/Transpennine signage but with their logo stuck on the side and most of the signs outside of WY stations are old BR ones that are getting pretty dirty and faded.

 

[DorkingMain]

I think it's important to remember here that the railways are not run for enthusiasts, and functionality is better than fancy looking station signs. Signage at stations has increasingly gained more and more meaningless clutter in recent years, advertising universities, local colleges, tourist attractions and other things that would be better off somewhere else.

 

[physics34]

I think it's important to remember here that the railways are not run for enthusiasts, and functionality is better than fancy looking station signs. Signage at stations has increasingly gained more and more meaningless clutter in recent years, advertising universities, local colleges, tourist attractions and other things that would be better off somewhere else.

Yes totally agree

 

[Deerfold]

Agreed. Why anyone would think it was actually a good idea to remove zonal identification on platforms is beyond me. It's unnecessarily removing information that may be useful to some passengers.

I can't imagine that Merseytravel and WY Metro are going to be too happy about having their smart signage replaced with 1970s blandness.

TfGM probably won't be too bothered because they've been in no hurry to update their stations from GMPTE to TfGM and in any case the latter is being superceded by the "Bee Network" brand. 2030 is targeted for full integration of the regional rail network into the brand.

Since Northern took over publicity from Metro, a lot of stations have lost their zonal maps which used to be up at every station. With many stations being unstaffed, this is useful information to have (yes, you can look it up online if you already know roughly where to look, but good publicity for MCards to have it readily available)

 

[Goldfish62]

I think it's important to remember here that the railways are not run for enthusiasts, and functionality is better than fancy looking station signs. Signage at stations has increasingly gained more and more meaningless clutter in recent years, advertising universities, local colleges, tourist attractions and other things that would be better off somewhere else.

While remembering that branded signage was introduced in the BR sectorised era. Branding is not for the benefit of enthusiasts.

 

[Non Multi]

Surely sponsored signage isn't going away, especially when the railway is desperately short of revenue.

 

[Goldfish62]

Surely sponsored signage isn't going away, especially when the railway is desperately short of revenue.

Good point.

 

[thomalex]

I don't have much of a problem with sponsored signage but it should be clearly separate from the station name boards

 

[Peter Sarf]

Agreed. Why anyone would think it was actually a good idea to remove zonal identification on platforms is beyond me. It's unnecessarily removing information that may be useful to some passengers.

I can't imagine that Merseytravel and WY Metro are going to be too happy about having their smart signage replaced with 1970s blandness.

TfGM probably won't be too bothered because they've been in no hurry to update their stations from GMPTE to TfGM and in any case the latter is being superceded by the "Bee Network" brand. 2030 is targeted for full integration of the regional rail network into the brand.

But is a passenger really going to change their travel plans based on the zone information they encounter when they arrive at a station or pass through that station ?. The passenger would surely want to know their departure and arrival zones BEFORE buying a ticket or starting their journey. It is why I have a problem with the lack of London zones maps displayed at London railway stations.

I think it's important to remember here that the railways are not run for enthusiasts, and functionality is better than fancy looking station signs. Signage at stations has increasingly gained more and more meaningless clutter in recent years, advertising universities, local colleges, tourist attractions and other things that would be better off somewhere else.

I agree. The station name board is there to help passengers identify where they are. It is not there to tell them what they are missing. Is a passenger really going to cut short their journey because they have encountered an interesting feature at a station on the way ?.

I don't have much of a problem with sponsored signage but it should be clearly separate from the station name boards

I agree. The station name is where some one plans to travel to. They need to know where they are.

 

[pt_mad]

Is there any specific order in which stations are being branded other than Northern first?
Also will staff wear uniforms in keeping with GBR branding in a few years despite the direct awards which have been given out lately?

 

[physics34]

The zonal information does cause confusion with platform numbers no doubt. Remember...78 year old Bertha with poor eyesight needs to understand it.signage needs to be clear and simple. Im over in Switzerland at the moment. The signage and info is so so clear and simple

 

[Bletchleyite]

The zonal information does cause confusion with platform numbers no doubt. Remember...78 year old Bertha with poor eyesight needs to understand it.signage needs to be clear and simple. Im over in Switzerland at the moment. The signage and info is so so clear and simple

And yet looks good with a bit of colour on it! Always liked the dark blue favoured by most European railways.

 

[Goldfish62]

And yet looks good with a bit of colour on it! Always liked the dark blue favoured by most European railways.

White lettering reversed out of dark blue is almost if not completely universal throughout mainland Europe and the now-superseded NR signage largely followed this practice.

Are they all wrong and we're right?

 

[physics34]

White lettering reversed out of dark blue is almost if not completely universal throughout mainland Europe and the now-superseded NR signage largely followed this practice.

Are they all wrong and we're right?

Yeh i have to say, im not sure what research has concluded? White on dark or visa versa. Both to me are clear. dark on white will need more cleaning clearly

 

[nlogax]

Slightly off topic but this seems to be the place to discuss GBR at present. Interesting mock up doublearrow on Twitter just posted:

Actually I quite like that, the XP64 callback looks pretty nice.