Stockport to Cambridge routes and tickets.

[plugwash]

I am aware of the following routes from Stockport to Cambridge that I would consider reasonable (and that have popped out of journey planners at one point or another)

Stockport->Ely (EMR)
ELY->Cambridge (Various operators)

Stockport->Doncaster (TPE)
Doncaster->Peterbourough (LNER)
Peterbourough->Cambridge (Crosscountry)

Stockport->Nuneaton (AWC)
Nuneaton->Cambridge (Crosscountry)

Stockport->Birmingham NS (Crosscountry or occasionaly AWC)
Birmingham NS->Cambridge (Crosscountry)

Stockport->Doncaster (TPE)
Doncaster->Stevenage (LNER)
Stevenage->Cambridge (Great Northern/Thameslink)

Stockport->Euston (AWC)
Euston->Kings Cross/St pancras (Walk or tube)
Kings Cross/St pancras->cambridge (Great Northern/Thameslink)

Stockport->Euston (AWC)
Euston->Finnsbury park (tube)
Finnsbury park->cambridge (Great Northern/Thameslink)

Stockport->Euston (AWC)
Euston->Tottenham Hale (tube)
Tottenham Hale->cambridge (Greater Anglia)

According to online journey planners, all of these seem to be permitted routes except the one via Doncaster and Stevenage.

This leaves me with a couple of questions.

1. Why isn't Doncaster and Stevenage a permitted route? Initially I thought it was the short doubleback between Hitchin and Stevenage, but forcing a route via doncaster and hitchin and avoiding stevenage doesn't seem to be valid either.

2. Given that all the reasonable routes I have found other than the one via Doncaster and Stevenage go via either ely or London, what is the point of having "not london" tickets.

 

[endecotp]

I think you can also go via Stoke and Derby.
At least, 20 years ago that was one of the better options if travelling with a bike!

 

[30907]

On 2: does "not London" allow Willesden Jn - Stratford - Tottenham Hale? Not that anyone bar a Forum member would want to go that way....

 

[Ianno87]

1. There is an easement (700070) that states

Customers travelling from stations North of Cheshunt via Cambridge and Hitchin to stations North of Hitchin may double back between Hitchin and Stevenage. This easement applies in both directions.

I think Stockport count's as 'North of Hitchin' if Cambridge-Hitchin-ECML-Doncaster-Stockport is otherwise permitted.

I certainly do Cambridge-Stevenage-Leeds-Manchester-Bolton regularly on valid itineraries.

 

[sheff1]

The Routeing Guide shows that Bolton (and Manchester) to/from Cambridge is valid via Stockport, Doncaster and Stevenage. However, Stockport to/from Cambridge via Doncaster and Stevenage is not listed as a valid route.
Sheffield to/from Cambridge is also valid via Doncaster and Stevenage.

Why the Routeing Guide compilers have decreed that people travelling from stations either side of Stockport can go via Doncaster and Stevenage yet people wanting to travel from Stockport on the same train cannot - who knows ?

 

[mmh]

The Trainline will give an itinerary changing at Doncaster and Peterborough.

National Rail Enquiries only seems to offer Doncaster and Stevenage, perhaps because it's slightly quicker. It's more expensive though, as the via Ely only fare isn't valid.

 

[kieron]

1. Why isn't Doncaster and Stevenage a permitted route? Initially I thought it was the short doubleback between Hitchin and Stevenage, but forcing a route via doncaster and hitchin and avoiding stevenage doesn't seem to be valid either.

There are a couple of ways I can take this question.

1. What prevents Stockport-Cambridge from being valid via Doncaster and Stevenage?

The valid routes you see for a "not via London" ticket will generally be based on one of the map combinations which are available for a Stockport-Cambridge journey. The options are:

Stockport to Cambridge LONDON AM BO+AB HO+AD MH+AC MH+AS MN+AL MN+AY MS+AC MS+AS

Ignoring LONDON (which brings in the various London-Cambridge routes, which I haven't listed), none of the above map combinations include the Hitchin-Cambridge line.

You can buy a "Peterborough & LNER" ticket on that route, but these restrict you to a specific train.

2. What would someone wish Stockport-Cambridge not to be valid via Doncaster and Stevenage?

I don't know.

2. Given that all the reasonable routes I have found other than the one via Doncaster and Stevenage go via either ely or London, what is the point of having "not london" tickets.

The "not via London" Stockport-Cambridge tickets are part of a larger "flow" of routes between one "cluster" of stations and another. This means that you can buy a ticket for exactly the same price between (for example) Heaton Chapel and Cambridge.

This is potentially useful, as Manchester Piccadilly is a valid routeing point for Heaton Chapel for this journey. The map combinations for Manchester Picadilly-Cambridge include DB+EE+KE, DW+EE+KE and MN+EC+KE, and KE includes the Hitchin-Cambridge line.

If you travel via Manchester (or, at least, use part of an itinerary which does), a Heaton Chapel-Cambridge "not via London" ticket is valid via Doncaster and Stevenage.

I think you can also go via Stoke and Derby.

Going via Stoke, Derby and Ely is fine. MH+AS contains the most straightforward route for it.

On 2: does "not London" allow Willesden Jn - Stratford - Tottenham Hale? Not that anyone bar a Forum member would want to go that way....

After a fashion, I think. A ticket which is valid between Harrow & Wealdstone and Queens Park is valid on London Underground (LU) between Harrow & Wealdstone and Queens Park and intermediately (so you can use it for Willesden Junction-Queens Park). Queens Park and Stratford are stations at which you can start/end a cross-London transfer on LU. This means that you can travel via Willesden Junction and Stratford if you use LU between them.

I don't know if you can go back and substitute the North London Line for LU in this, especially as you wouldn't be travelling via Queens Park in that case.

 

[plugwash]

This is potentially useful, as Manchester Piccadilly is a valid routeing point for Heaton Chapel for this journey. The map combinations for Manchester Picadilly-Cambridge include DB+EE+KE, DW+EE+KE and MN+EC+KE, and KE includes the Hitchin-Cambridge line.

If you travel via Manchester (or, at least, use part of an itinerary which does), a Heaton Chapel-Cambridge "not via London" ticket is valid via Doncaster and Stevenage.

Since the Manchester Picadilly to Doncaster trains go via Stockport, does this mean I can use a Heaton Chapel to Cambridge ticket to go from Stockport to Cambridge via Doncaster and Stevenage?

I just had a look on trainscanbecheaper (since national rail is buggy with handling multiple via points), and it seemed to think Manchester to Cambridge via Doncaster and Stevenage was fine, and that journey passes though stockport and there don't seem to be any break of journey restrictions.

So it seems I'm good to go if I buy my ticket from Manchester instead of Stockport.

Curiously it seems that the "any permitted" tickets from Stockport and Manchester are the same price, but there is no "via ely" ticket from Manchester and the "not london" ticket from manchester is the same price as the "via ely" ticket from stockport.

 

[sheff1]

Since the Manchester Picadilly to Doncaster trains go via Stockport, does this mean I can use a Heaton Chapel to Cambridge ticket to go from Stockport to Cambridge via Doncaster and Stevenage?
....
So it seems I'm good to go if I buy my ticket from Manchester instead of Stockport.

Yes to both, as long as the ticket does not have any break of journey restrictions.