Jesus. That is horrific.
What a sad, sad day.
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Carmont (near Stonehaven) derailment - 12 August 2020
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What a sad, sad day.
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Both I think, the power car is further round. That coach also looks like it may have been on fire?
That photo does make it clear that one coach has been completely crushed
Royston Vasey
Established Member
The first visible skid marks in the ballast are actually on the bridge itself
Not sure what you mean, sorry.
snookertam
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Not sure about this and probably not worth speculating - appreciate you are only putting 2+2 together - but had the train been in section for so long with no report the alert would have been raised by the next signaller. Also there were seemingly NR staff already in the vicinity, so it’s unclear if there was any long delay in alerting emergency services.
I didn't realize that there was still a box there, many years since I have been along that stretch of line and I used to do KX to Aberdeen regularly, regardless, a regular passenger with no railway knowledge may not understand what to do in an area with near to no phone signal if any in the middle of nowhere, whereas if true, a member of crew onboard did the right thing, made authorities aware and may have saved lives, even if it was catering crew for instance, they will have some safety critical training and it may have helped with this tragedy.
Royston Vasey
Established Member
The PC can be seen in some shots, nearest the bridge down the embankment, under a tree. Read the thread back, there are other photos.
I'm watching it live on Sky at the moment. I see very little ballast around the wreckage, but a hell of a lot of mud.
Royston Vasey
Established Member
Harbon 1
Member
Don't get confused with Single Line Working. Rule Book says about wrong direction movements "4.3 Train Speed: Except during single line working, you must always be able to stop within the distance you can see to be clear"
Thoughts with everyone involved and affected. As someone whose been driving (admittedly only in yards) for less than a year, this sends shivers down my spine
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
I can't comprehend the scale of damage, for a train supposedly running at reduced speed.
Another line of comment on the BBC is apparently from ORR who are saying the increasing risks of severe weather, and its consequences, are outstripping Network Rail's capability to protect the network from such events.
Another line of comment on the BBC is apparently from ORR who are saying the increasing risks of severe weather, and its consequences, are outstripping Network Rail's capability to protect the network from such events.
Wilts Wanderer
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That explains why some of the bridge parapet is in the river below. From the proximity I’d hazard a guess that at least one of the vehicles went over the bridge at an extremely skewed angle.
WestRiding
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Well for a start, making a Wrong Direction move, where points are involved, is no faster than 15mph. If people are going to quote the rule book, make sure you quote correctly.
SamYeager
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WADR it's a14 page thread so it's not that easy to catch up with past info.
Tom Quinne
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The speed 50mph and 10mph for a wrong direction movement.
Do Sky still have a content share with Fox?
Sky are owned by Comcast who also own NBC - so I'd be surprised if they were sharing content with Fox.
WestRiding
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Wrong.
Nothing to add other than condolences and thoughts to everyone involved in today's accident, to the families who have lost loved ones, to those who are injured, to everyone at Scotrail and the wider railway family and also to give thanks to all the men and women of the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service, Scottish Ambulance Service, Police Scotland, Network Rail, Scotrail, the Air Ambulance and the Coastguard SAR who responded to this tragedy.
Royston Vasey
Established Member
Pictures clearly show it was right line
MadCommuter
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Looking at the video on Sky News, it looks like there is at least one side of the 'crushed' carriage reasonably intact?
Even though I guess the rear powercar would've had it's power cut when the front powercar derailed, it'd still have movement energy for quite a while which may well have contributed to the scale of the accident :/
WestRiding
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There is no defined speed for a wrong direction movement other than points 15mph no faster. Don't confuse it with single line working. I find it quite worrying that people are telling the world via this forum, railway rule book stuff, and then getting it wrong when they do. Especially worried that some of these people quoting rules work within the railway rules every day. Please please get it right. 50mph is for SLW. During a Typical Wrong Direction Move its a speed deemed safe by the driver who should be able to stop in time of trouble.
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Cheers - I'd seen those photos but was unsure as to whether they depicted a power car or coach.
Isn't the power car in the trees near the digger?
The train had already crossed over to be running "right road". We don't know the speed of the train at impact.
All this talk about wrong direction moves is pointless.
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